Hot Start Problem, Code P0446

[randy_k]

Given that my hot start problem has reacurred. When it reaches about 190* on the temp gauge and I shut it off for about a half hour or so. It does the crank, crank crank, chug, chug, chug thing and when it does start. The rev's go way up to around 3k. Then it wants to die. (I may end up helping it with that, ala Dr Kavorkian)
I'm getting code P0446, shut of valve activated, charcoal filter function below limit.

Would you guys start with the evap control valve, Link to Pic below. Or the charcoal canister? I've already read that the crank position sensor can cause this. But the one on it was replaced about 1,500 miles ago. I guess it could be shot again. Also getting the code that says the O2 sensor ahead of cat cylenders 4-6 is bad. Replaced that less than 300miles ago.

Thanks for any input.

Randy

Pelican Parts - Product Information: 996-110-129-06-M100

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by randy_k

Given that my hot start problem has reacurred. When it reaches about 190* on the temp gauge and I shut it off for about a half hour or so. It does the crank, crank crank, chug, chug, chug thing and when it does start. The rev's go way up to around 3k. Then it wants to die. (I may end up helping it with that, ala Dr Kavorkian)
I'm getting code P0446, shut of valve activated, charcoal filter function below limit.

Would you guys start with the evap control valve, Link to Pic below. Or the charcoal canister? I've already read that the crank position sensor can cause this. But the one on it was replaced about 1,500 miles ago. I guess it could be shot again. Also getting the code that says the O2 sensor ahead of cat cylenders 4-6 is bad. Replaced that less than 300miles ago.

Thanks for any input.

Randy

Pelican Parts - Product Information: 996-110-129-06-M100

Randy, P0446 is the code thrown when there is a problem with the purge air line from the EVAP canister to the engine is inoperative. Usual suspects are a blockage of the purge air line (clear the line by blowing compressed air through it), or the EVAP canister is blocked and has to be replaced.

Note that this is only correct when there are no other codes being thrown at the same time for idle air control or the secondary air system. The function of the fuel tank ventilation system can impact hard starting, and the system can be activated for test purposed using the PIWIS or Durametric Pro software, if memory serves......

What is the O2 sensor code you are getting?

[randy_k]

JFP, I was hoping you'd chime in. The O2 sensor code I'm getting is. P0154. 02 sensor ahead of cat cylinders 4-6. That would be the right side of the car. Like I said. I replaced that and the left side as well,at the same time. I would think getting two replacements at the same time and replacing them both. That would narrow the odds of getting a bad one on the right. But then again. There are reasons I don't gamble when I go to Vegas.

I just have the rookie version of the Durametric code reader. So it it takes the Pro version. That's out. But I'll check to see to make sure it won't activate it.
Do you happen to have or can you direct me to a clear picture of where that purge line/evap canister is. (or anyone for that matter).The Bentley Manual is very vague when it comes to those things.
Thanks as usual for your help!!!
Randy

[mikefocke]

To test the O2 sensor, move it from one side and replace it with the other side's new one. If the problem follows the swap....

[JFP in PA]

Before I would swap the O2 sensor around, I would test it in place per the diagnostic tree instructions below. I've also included the system diagram for the EVAP unit:

[randy_k]

JFP, Thanks. I can't hardly see the pic. But is it the line in the lowest right corner? If so? Do I disconnect it from the manifold and blow air in that way? Or do I disconnect it from both ends. Canister and manifold and blow air in from the canister side? Thanks for your time.
Randy

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by randy_k

JFP, Thanks. I can't hardly see the pic. But is it the line in the lowest right corner? If so? Do I disconnect it from the manifold and blow air in that way? Or do I disconnect it from both ends. Canister and manifold and blow air in from the canister side? Thanks for your time.
Randy

Randy, PM me either a fax number or your email and I will send you high resolution PDF's...............

[randy_k]

Will do and thanks!!!

[randy_k]

Ran real time O2 sensor readings and they seem fine. .97 on 1-3 and 1.03 on 4-6. They stayed pretty steady for about 15 minutes from start to stop.

[randy_k]

Even though these are the fault codes as of this morning. When I first started the thing.

Bosch Digital Motor Electronics Motronic 5.2.2
Module Identification



Part Number 986.618.621.01
Supplier Part Number 004155073601


Current Fault Codes

P0150:
O2 sensor ahead of cat. conv. Cylinder (4-6)


P0446:
Shutoff valve activated charcoal filter (function) below limit value


P0130:
O2 sensor ahead of cat. conv. Cylinder (1-3)

[JFP in PA]

I would worry first about the EVAP related codes, then clear everything after you have made your EVAP repairs and see if the O2 sensor codes come back; they may be "ghosts" associated with the other problem.

[randy_k]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

I would worry first about the EVAP related codes, then clear everything after you have made your EVAP repairs and see if the O2 sensor codes come back; they may be "ghosts" associated with the other problem.

Zactly what I was thinking JFP. I know these things will give false codes if something up stream is a problem. And to have two O2 sensors go bad in less than 300 miles. Highly unlikely.

Good news is. It pulled that hard to start thing again after my test run. For freaking joy. If all else fails. I think I'll buy a USPS uniform and go postal on the thing. (-;
Randy

[randy_k]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

Before I would swap the O2 sensor around, I would test it in place per the diagnostic tree instructions below. I've also included the system diagram for the EVAP unit:

JFP, Which of the two lines that go into the manifold is the one that needs to be addressed. The one marked #1/#8 or #3?
Thanks, Randy

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by randy_k

JFP, Which of the two lines that go into the manifold is the one that needs to be addressed. The one marked #1/#8 or #3?
Thanks, Randy

#1 is actually a valve on the manifold end of line #8, which is the most common problem line. It would not hurt to also blow out line #3 while you are doing it.

Just an aside, I recently was told that Sunset Porsche is selling a fair number of replacement line #8 because the valve on the end fails (it is not removable). Just a thought.....

[randy_k]

Thank you JFP, for you thoughts. I would think it would be cheaper to replace than the Canister. You wouldn't happen to have that part number for #8 in your back pocket would you. Knowing you. You may actually have it there. I can't tell from the Porsche PET what it is. That thing is like reading Japanese stereo instructions at times.

Thanks, Pain in the arse Randy.

[JFP in PA]

Not off the top of my head as I am currently away from the shop. Give Jeff at Sunset a call, I'm sure they can give you the number and a great price.

[randy_k]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

Not off the top of my head as I am currently away from the shop. Give Jeff at Sunset a call, I'm sure they can give you the number and a great price.

Thanks for the info and will do GZ. Randy

[randy_k]

JFP, (or anyone) I have another question. Is it the outer plastic line. Closest to the side of the body. That runs from the front to back the line that has the purge valve at the manifold on it. Another words. The bigger of the two lines under there on that side.
I have a specific reason for asking before I take things apart and blow air through the evap purge line.

Randy

[randy_k]

I have decide to continue this thread on my Diary of a 1999 high milage thread. See link below. Thanks to everyone for there help!!!
Randy

Diary of a 1999 high mileage Boxster

[randy_k]

Is there a way to test the charcoal canister other than using the Durametric to read the codes that I'm getting? Also, Can someone explain to me why or how the Charcoal evap canister causes the car to be hard to start once the engine temps are up? Let me pile on one more question. If the fuel pump was bad and when it got hot. It didn't perform right and did the chugging thing until it starts running normally cause the DME to send false codes. The main reason I ask is. My gut tells me it's the fuel pump. I don't mind spending money to fix this thing. But I want to spend money that does fix it.
Randy