Home Electrical Question - Replacing Main Breaker

[Tidybuoy]

I have a Zinsco Breaker Box. I've read horror stories regarding this type of old system but mine has been trouble free until this weekend.

The power went out during stormy weather and when it came back on only half the house came back to life. Puzzled, I went to the breaker box and flipped off/on all breakers but no success. The next morning I went to each room to determine which lights were not working and when I got to the kitchen and turned on the stove all the lights came on. ????

I went back to the breaker box and flipped off/on the main several times and everything started working. I came to the conclusion that the stove trick was related to it being 240v and drawing from both bus bars and somehow completed the circuit.

I went to buy a new main breaker (which I bought) and it was $179 ouch! A whole new service box with the main breaker included is $159 but installation is a big job.

My Questions:
To replace the main breaker, power must be shut off by the utility company. Do I have to call them or can I simply unplug the meter? I know that removing the meter will remove all power from the bus bars and main breaker but I'm worried that the utility company will then come after me - or, the smart meter tells on me or needs resetting.

I'm certain that I can replace the whole breaker box myself but this would require the utility company shutting off power. If I go this route, will they shut off, give you time to reinstall everything, and then come back? If I go this route I can't afford to have the power off for more than one day.

Any thoughts would be great.

P.s. The reason I wanted to just replace the main breaker is because I have already replaced most of the regular breakers and have a lot invested at this point. The bus bar appears good without any corrosion or burn marks.

[bpu699]

If you plan on changing the box you need to have the power shut off at the pole. Do not do this by yourself, you need a permit. There is huge danger and liability to doing this yourself... By code, you will likely need a new 100 or 200 amp service, new grounding rods, and possibly more.

I do all my own electrical. Changing out a box by yourself is a no-no. The electrical to the building must be shut off, and the electric company will only do that for a licensed electrician.

If you do it, and that building ever burns down, you have future never ending liability...

Bo

[john70t]

Originally Posted by bpu699

I do all my own electrical. Changing out a box by yourself is a no-no. The electrical to the building must be shut off, and the electric company will only do that for a licensed electrician.

Had an extra box put in years ago to separate units.
Electrician installed a heavy duty breaker between the box and street.
It was code he said. Good idea.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Agreed with Bo. To cut power from the pole you typically need to pull the meter, which requires cutting an anti-tamper tag on the meter box. Let's just say that if you hypothetically have a few of the anti-tamper meter tags that this can be done DIY.....

I've replaced a 240V breaker hot but it's really a bad idea. I've also seen what happens when someone lets a screwdriver slip when working in a 240V box, you need a new screwdriver and potentially a new pair of pants.

[bob deluke]

If you pull meter head, power downstream to the main circuit breaker and distribution box is off. You can then change main breaker. If changing the box, do like bpu699 says. It needs to be inspected by an electrical inspector before utility co. turns power on. This of course takes days, weeks, months to get inspected. If box is in good shape, just replace main breaker. Just make sure it is of same rating, not higher. Once you pull meter head, shouldn't take but a few minutes to replace main. You will probably have to cut off seal in your meter head box, but so what? Utility co will just replace it with another. "Gee, don't know what happened to the seal mr. Meter reader"...

[rick-l]

You need a permit and around here to do the work on your residence that involves going down and taking a simple test and paying the money.

The power company will pull the meter and work with you to minimize the time you are without power.

[john70t]

Originally Posted by bob deluke

You will probably have to cut off seal in your meter head box, but so what? Utility co will just replace it with another. "Gee, don't know what happened to the seal mr. Meter reader"...

("No. Not sure where that little resistor thingamajob came from. Total blank here. Damn kids.")

[LakeCleElum]

I cut the tag and pulled my meter last year to chase a problem. Turned out the problem was in the vault and power company fixed it. They put put on a new tag, but weren't happy the old one was gone.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Originally Posted by bob deluke

If you pull meter head, power downstream to the main circuit breaker and distribution box is off. You can then change main breaker. If changing the box, do like bpu699 says. It needs to be inspected by an electrical inspector before utility co. turns power on. This of course takes days, weeks, months to get inspected. If box is in good shape, just replace main breaker. Just make sure it is of same rating, not higher. Once you pull meter head, shouldn't take but a few minutes to replace main. You will probably have to cut off seal in your meter head box, but so what? Utility co will just replace it with another. "Gee, don't know what happened to the seal mr. Meter reader"...

At least in KS, they can refuse to turn your power back on without an inspection from a licensed electrician if they suspect you were working on your own house. I suppose you could claim that someone vandalized your box and cut the tag and probably get away with it.

[carambola]

dude, if you have zinco, i would suggest an upgrade

[look 171]

Originally Posted by carambola

dude, if you have zinco, i would suggest an upgrade

yep.

[look 171]

Change out the main panel is in the works for you, my friend. I am not kidding. Zinsco have a known track record of not working properly and many houses have burned due to faulty breakers made by them. Many of the barkers have been found melted together and not tripping or cutting power allowing unsafe amount of electricity into the home. It will not pass UL approval today due to their faulty design. Look into it.

Installation of a new panel is about 2k, but replacing 5 breakers will run you about 1000 bucks and you still have the same problem. When I tell some of my clients, they think I am trying to sell an Eskimo ice.

[look 171]

Oh yeah, you need a permit and pass inspection so the electric company will jump your power over. If not, no deal.

[john70t]

Originally Posted by look 171

Installation of a new panel is about 2k, but replacing 5 breakers will run you about 1000 bucks and you still have the same problem. When I tell some of my clients, they think I am trying to sell an Eskimo ice.

Give them a picture of losing everything they hold emotionally and monetarily important:
-Sleeping in a friends basement or motel or car for half a year or more.
-Dealing with new daily logistical challenges like food pooping and showers.
-Dealing with paperwork lost and very unfriendly beneficiaries (i.e. insurance adjusters).
-Waiting. and. Uncertainty. Life ruined.

Is all that worth a thousand bucks?

[look 171]

Most folks eventually come to their senses in a couple of days. There are those few who do not and I almost never end up working for them. I see trouble looming down the road when they don't listen to real issues. After a couple of meeting with new clients, I point out all items that are needed, depending how extensive we gut the house. Electrical panel change out was never expected, so its a hard pill to swallow.

[Gogar]

With a (pro) friend, I removed my meter, replaced my box, all my breakers and installed a new mast on my house in about 2 hours. Utility company will never be the wiser.

Yes it's true that if you don't know what you're doing you can make a few poor choices and really hurt yourself.

If you're not comfortable and in control of your own destiny, pony up a few $K and let the pros do it, and sleep at night. A fine choice!

[dennis in se pa]

I am a do it yourselfer and have built a few houses complete. Footer to roof. I would give this job to a professional. You do not want to find out what you don't know somewhere in the middle of this.

[billybek]

I got rid of a Federal Pioneer panel for the same reasons listed as the Zinco panel. The old Federal panel had almost no room in it compared to a new modern panel.
Plus I needed more breaker space.
It really isn't a bad job if you are familiar with power and don't electrocute yourself.
Mine was easy as the garage panel is the main panel and the house is a sub panel. I could just shut off the main breaker for the house and run in power from the garage to run the fridge and freezer and work lights in the laundry room where the panel is located.
Was maybe 4 hours of work for the initial change out.
Find a good independent electrician that will permit the job and have it inspected.

[Tidybuoy]

Thanks all for the advice.

Sounds like I will be replacing the entire breaker box. That said, I will have it done by an electrician. I am not going to cut corners to save a couple of bucks and then burn my house down in the process.

I spent $500 yesterday on new breakers which I can return and trade in for the breaker box. After that, I will check with an electrician on getting it done properly. Fortunately, my box is outside the house and looks like an easy swap (other than cutting off the main power and changing out the main line in).

[onewhippedpuppy]

Ask around and see if anyone knows a good electrician, most of those guys do simple work like this on the side for cash. It's a huge discount over going through an electrical company.