I hate credit card fraud!

[Rick Lee]

Originally Posted by cstreit

MAmex is the worst. Had a customer that bought a brake system, Admitted to ordering it, admitted to receiving it and simply stated to Amex, "I don't understand the charge".

They sided with him, of course. I don't take Amex any more.

Bottom line is, if the customer files a dispute, they will win. The small business gets the shaft. Credit card companies don't care, at all. They know they have business by the short ones. It's the consumer they care about.

That's right. And that's why I'd only accept plastic from customers I know well, who won't try to shaft me. Doesn't matter for small, consumer stuff like you buy at a gas station. But for large, commercial or industrial stuff, you give terms or take plastic when you know the customer won't shaft you.

[WolfeMacleod]

This is why I have business insurance.

Originally Posted by cstreit

MAmex is the worst. Had a customer that bought a brake system, Admitted to ordering it, admitted to receiving it and simply stated to Amex, "I don't understand the charge".

They sided with him, of course. I don't take Amex any more.

Bottom line is, if the customer files a dispute, they will win. The small business gets the shaft. Credit card companies don't care, at all. They know they have business by the short ones. It's the consumer they care about.

It's a business decision by the CC companies, which are effectively banks. For the 2-3% they got on each transaction from us when we ran our business, they were not willing to guarantee payment. Had they been willing to take that risk, their cut would have been substantially larger. That's exactly the same as a bank. When you cash a check, you endorse it. That means you guarantee payment, not them. I recall blessedly little UCC Article 2 law, but I do recall the basic gist of it is "at the end of the day, the bank always wins."

Originally Posted by WolfeMacleod

This is why I have business insurance.

Does it guarantee payment against back charges, Wolfe? Not familiar with that insurance product. And don't get me started on insurance companies . . . the lowest form of human life.

[flatbutt]

Originally Posted by red-beard

Update. I called the bank for the second card they used (CHASE) and it was a nightmare trying to get to the correct fraud department. And by the time you are phone transferred a few times, the phone call quality degrades. The last person I spoke to we could barely understand each other.

Now that's interesting. CHASE is the one bank that I'm presented with most frequently .

[GH85Carrera]

We only take credit cards at my company because the Federal governments and state governments just love to pay with plastic. We just add in a little padding on the quote to pay for the 3.85% charge to take their card number over the phone. We know thy CC is good at least.

For all other customers. I would rather wait another week or two for a check in the mail, or a bank transfer.

[WolfeMacleod]

Originally Posted by madcorgi

Does it guarantee payment against back charges, Wolfe? Not familiar with that insurance product. And don't get me started on insurance companies . . . the lowest form of human life.

I remember asking about that when I renewed it after a few years of absence, when I bought my laser cutter. I inquired specifically because my new site accepts credit cards, and I was concerned about stuff like that.
Chargebacks? I don't recall for sure. Credit card fraud, yes it does.

[jwasbury]

All fraud is worthy of hate.

I am a recent victim of check fraud. I sent a check to pay my credit card bill (in full). I was close to the cut off date, so when the next bill arrived without showing my payment I wasn't concerned. But when the next month bill arrives and my payment still didn't show up, I thought "hmmn...I know that check cleared the bank, what's going on here?"

Find the cleared check in online banking...see that some random individual (not credit card company) endorsed the check and deposited it. Somehow random individual received my check, their bank took it on deposit (even though it was made out to "Chase Card Service" not "random individual") and my bank honored it. Reality is banks don't check anything. They don't check endorsements, they don't check payees vs. depositors, they do not check signatures vs. authorized signer info in their files. I brought this to my bank's attention over 2 weeks ago and they are still "investigating" and I am still out the cash. Had this been credit card or debit card fraud, I'd have been given my cash back on the spot.