Question on immunity when we open again

[Crowbob]

I'm beginning to wonder if we are somehow not dealing with only one virus. Or I should say we may be dealing with a virus that somehow fundementally mutates faster than our testing can keep up with. This would also account for the wide variance in symptomatology, degree of debilitation, recovery times, etc. in addition to the false tests both positive and negative, the so-called dormancies and reemergences and variable periods of incubation. All of which have been all over the place.

Is it even possible? Maybe it's just me but this is sounding very unnatural.

[jyl]

There virus is being pretty aggressively monitored for mutations, not seeing that.

[island911]

From the Senate Committee on Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions hearing on Tuesday:

SEN. RAND PAUL: Dr. Fauci, scientists have shown that rhesus monkeys that are infected with COVID-19 cannot be reinfected. Several studies have also shown that plasma from recently infected coronavirus patients neutralizes the virus and lab experiments. In addition, infusion of convalescent plasma is based on the idea that recovering coronavirus patients are developing immunity and that it could be beneficial as donated.

Studies show that the recovering COVID-19 patients from the asymptomatic to the very sick are showing significant antibody response. Studies show that SARS and MERS, also coronaviruses, induce immunity for at least 2 to 3 years, and yet the media continues to report that we have no evidence that patients who survive coronavirus have immunity. I think actually the truth is the opposite. We have no evidence that survivors of coronavirus don't have immunity and a great deal of evidence to suggest that they do.

The question of immunity is linked to health policy and that workers who have gained immunity can be a strong part of our economic recovery. The silver lining to so many infections in the meat processing industry is that a large portion of these workers now have immunity. Those workers should be reassured that they likely won't get it again instead of being alarmed by media reports that there is no evidence of immunity.

You've stated publicly that you'd bet it at all that survivors of coronavirus have some form of immunity. Can you help set the record straight that the scientific record, as it is being accumulated, is supportive that infection with coronavirus likely leads to some form of immunity, Dr. Fauci?

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2020/05/12/rand_paul_vs_fauci_you_are_not_the_end_all_we_can_ listen_to_your_advice_but_you_dont_get_to_decide.h tml

[island911]

Senator Rand Paul is also a medical doctor who contracted the virus ... and lived through it w/o symptoms.

Fauci really had to break out the weasel words to find a way to say, well, we don't know everything about this virus so... we will need a few years to say clearly anything about immunity.

But Fauci did agree that survivors of coronavirus have some form of immunity. --Capt Obvious stuff, if you ask me. Still the disinformation abounds.

[flatbutt]

Originally Posted by widgeon13

OK, so we ddid social distancing and masks, hand washing and disinfecting everything for Covid 19!

So have we now lost immunity to many other illnesses since we have been exposed to so little over the last 60 days or so. We may have escaped Covid 19 but will the seasonal flu and simple cold now do us in.

Just curious, haven't heard any of the experts address this question, is it even an issue?

I'm no doctor but I don't see how the immunities that we've acquired over our lifetimes could be nullified in the space of 60 days.

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by flatbutt

I'm no doctor but I don't see how the immunities that we've acquired over our lifetimes could be nullified in the space of 60 days.

This.

I do remember as a kid having to get a second small pox vaccination even though I still have the scar on my arm from the first one. The second vaccination did nothing to me, except make me bleed at the site where they scratched my arm.

I had mumps as a kid, measles, and lots of vaccinations. All the kids in school lined up to get a sugar cube for polio. That was a treat!

The worst was having chicken pox as a kid makes me likely to get shingles as a geezer. I have had the shot to help prevent that. I get the pneumonia vaccination and a flu shot every year.

I grew up in the leave it to beaver era, and ate many meals with hands dirtier than mom would have approved of. She would ask if we washed out hands, and we always figured that meant when we took a bath that morning.

[MBAtarga]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

The worst was having chicken pox as a kid makes me likely to get shingles as a geezer. I have had the shot to help prevent that.

There are actually two shots for the latest shingles vaccine. One, then another few weeks/months later as a booster.

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by MBAtarga

There are actually two shots for the latest shingles vaccine. One, then another few weeks/months later as a booster.

Yea, I had the single shot version only. My next doctors visit they are supposed to give the the step one of the two part shingles vaccine.

[Cajundaddy]

Originally Posted by flatbutt

I'm no doctor but I don't see how the immunities that we've acquired over our lifetimes could be nullified in the space of 60 days.

^^ Yep.

No Doc here either but we know that immunity antibodies from a typical seasonal virus typically last 1-3 years. There are also different layers of immunity. Innate immunity doesn't depend on exposure to others and can be maximized through eating right, daily exercise, hydration, sun exposure (vitamin D), and getting plenty of sleep.

Still plenty of uncertainty regarding Covid-19 immunity after exposure.

[dad911]

Originally Posted by techweenie

I've read that false positives and false negatives happen as much as 30% of the time. But then, I read it on the Internet, so take it with a grain of disinfectant.

I've heard it from a medical professional also. Basically said you might as well flip a coin, the tests are so bad.

[Eric Coffey]

Originally Posted by Mahler9th

By law, test sensitivity is a matter of public record, so anybody can get this information. And of course that information is based on the tests being used in accordance with their labeling (also known as instructions).

So if folks are interested in the sensitivity for a particular test product, they can easily find out. And I am pretty sure that folks that are tested can find out what test product is being used.

Of course, the other side to the efficacy coin is: Specificity.

[RWebb]

Originally Posted by Crowbob

I'm beginning to wonder if we are somehow not dealing with only one virus. Or I should say we may be dealing with a virus that somehow fundementally mutates faster than our testing can keep up with. This would also account for the wide variance in symptomatology, degree of debilitation, recovery times, etc. in addition to the false tests both positive and negative, the so-called dormancies and reemergences and variable periods of incubation. All of which have been all over the place.

Is it even possible? Maybe it's just me but this is sounding very unnatural.

it mutates - all viruses are highly mutable rel. to larger organisms

but this virus has a rel. low mutation rate

there are however two strains extant -- one is sometimes called the European strain, and is populating the US E. coast

but no, not faster than our testing can keep up with

[flatbutt]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

This.

I do remember as a kid having to get a second small pox vaccination even though I still have the scar on my arm from the first one. The second vaccination did nothing to me, except make me bleed at the site where they scratched my arm.

I had mumps as a kid, measles, and lots of vaccinations. All the kids in school lined up to get a sugar cube for polio. That was a treat!

The worst was having chicken pox as a kid makes me likely to get shingles as a geezer. I have had the shot to help prevent that. I get the pneumonia vaccination and a flu shot every year.

I grew up in the leave it to beaver era, and ate many meals with hands dirtier than mom would have approved of. She would ask if we washed out hands, and we always figured that meant when we took a bath that morning.

Same here, in fact I got the initial shingles vaccine when I turned 60 but had a break out anyway, wasn't too bad but not at all fun. Last year I upgraded to the newer 2 step vaccine. The 2 shot is s'posed to be far more efficacious.