Are some of our societal problems self inflicted?

[cabmandone]

To start, this is not a political question. The question is based on my own observations as a 48 year old father of three who grew up in a two parent household. Thinking back to my childhood, I never would have considered calling the parent of a friend by their first name. I was taught to respect not only my elders but those who were considered an authority figure (teacher, principal, police....).

In thinking back to my kids (16, 18, 21 now) when they were younger, I remember having to correct some of their friends for referring to me by my first name. I've always taught my kids to be respectful of others and most certainly to be respectful of adults and those viewed as authority figures in society. I remember having a conversation several years ago with a teacher at a public school and her saying how disrespectful kids were. I asked at the time "why do you think that is". She said replied that some of the most disrespectful came from single parent households. I didn't dig much deeper into it from there.

Have we somehow gotten away from teaching kids to be respectful of adults and authority figures? And more importantly are we at this point because of the increased divorce rates and increase in the number of single parent households? As we've progressed as a society, have we actually regressed in some aspects?

Just some thoughts and PLEASE try not to bring politics into this.

[mgatepi]

3 words
The Great Society

Trying desperately not to PARF this up....

[rfuerst911sc]

I agree some issues are self inflicted , it seems like just basic manners as an example have been lost . I don't know how many times over the years I have held a door open for a man or women and never a thank you . That's not how I was raised . I'm sure there are hundreds if not thousands of reasons but single parent homes is one of them . But on the flip side having two parents is no guarantee of success or a good kid turning into a good adult .

A child needs guidance and discipline and education to learn all the life skills needed to survive . How a parent or parents conduct themselves on a daily basis has a lot to do with a child being a success . But it's also a crap shoot , we have all seen bad kids come from good families and good kids come from bad families . We are creatures of our environment . Then throw in economic issues/gangs/drugs etc. etc. and a kid has a big mountain to climb to be a positive contributor to society .

[aschen]

Which societal problems are generally worsening in say the last 20 years?

[cabmandone]

Let's please try not to get this booted to PARF. I think it's a conversation worth having.

[Seahawk]

Our societal problems are all self inflicted - we are all, after all, the society.

The two elephants in the room are changes to basic education and the family dynamic in this country.

It would take a Kaizen mapping event to even begin the understand the erosion to the foundations o this country.

This discussion has to be moved to PARF or it is hollow - sorry.

[hbueno]

In my experience, number of parents has nothing to do with the manners, disposition, or nehavior of offspring. I know of many children of single parent homes who have grown up to be productive, kind, and respectable members of society. I also know of children of two parent households who have not grown up to be paragons of society.

Children model the bahavior of their parents and immediate family. Toxic parents and families often result in toxic children, although occasioonally, children from toxic situations somehow break the mold.

Everyone, regardless of age, deserves respect until they prove otherwise by their behavior. Just because you're older or in a position of authortity doesn't mean you deserve respect regardless of what type of person you are.

The question you're asking has been asked by people since time immemorial. Socrates said:

“The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers.”

[onewhippedpuppy]

Originally Posted by Seahawk

Our societal problems are all self inflicted - we are all, after all, the society.

The two elephants in the room are changes to basic education and the family dynamic in this country.

It would take a Kaizen mapping event to even begin the understand the erosion to the foundations o this country.

This discussion has to be moved to PARF or it is hollow - sorry.

Ditto.

Btw my kids have wonderful and respectful friends, I tell them to call me Matt. My kids default to calling parents Mr/Mrs, but I can’t think of any that also don’t go by their first names. Mostly Catholic school kids where being respectful to your elders is still taught.

[cabmandone]

Originally Posted by Seahawk

Our societal problems are all self inflicted - we are all, after all, the society.

The two elephants in the room are changes to basic education and the family dynamic in this country.

It would take a Kaizen mapping event to even begin the understand the erosion to the foundations o this country.

This discussion has to be moved to PARF or it is hollow - sorry.

I really don't want it to go there because it will end up the way all threads there end up. Admittedly I'm guilty of driving a few there myself... But I think this conversation can be had without the "liberal/conservative... dem/rep" insult slinging that will undoubtedly take place if it moves. If it can't be had without things ending up political then we can add that to the list of things that are wrong with our society.. Everything ends up political today.

[cabmandone]

Originally Posted by onewhippedpuppy

Ditto.

Btw my kids have wonderful and respectful friends, I tell them to call me Matt. My kids default to calling parents Mr/Mrs, but I can’t think of any that also don’t go by their first names. Mostly Catholic school kids where being respectful to your elders is still taught.

It's one thing to say "Call me Matt" after they've called you "mr...." it's entirely different to have the presume it's okay to call you by your first name.

[cabmandone]

Originally Posted by tcar

Divorce rates???? H..., a huge number of 'parents' never get married in the first place.

"Baby Momma" and "Baby Daddy" are all too common. And celebrated, especially in the entertainment industry...

Many kids don't even know who their father is...(sometimes their mother doesn't know either).

Part of this is the welfare system that actually penalizes women for marrying.

Probably gonna get us booted but that's the truth. I know several women who didn't get married to the father of their children until after the kids had graduated from college. No joke. "Single" mother with modest income qualifies the kids for grants. Married couple with combined middle class income (for the location) doesn't get them qualified for grants.

[pwd72s]

Originally Posted by Seahawk

Our societal problems are all self inflicted - we are all, after all, the society.

The two elephants in the room are changes to basic education and the family dynamic in this country.

It would take a Kaizen mapping event to even begin the understand the erosion to the foundations o this country.

This discussion has to be moved to PARF or it is hollow - sorry.

Bingo....If only enough voters could learn what the NEA, the national Education Association (teachers union) is really about...

Some are catching on, but most still think it's some benign group interested in education.

[cabmandone]

Why would a teachers union want teachers to be treated with less respect?

[Seahawk]

Originally Posted by cabmando

I really don't want it to go there because it will end up the way all threads there end up. Admittedly I'm guilty of driving a few there myself... But I think this conversation can be had without the "liberal/conservative... dem/rep" insult slinging that will undoubtedly take place if it moves. If it can't be had without things ending up political then we can add that to the list of things that are wrong with our society.. Everything ends up political today.

I get it, and I will not provide any fodder to push this to PARF.

This is not overtly political when starting the analysis of prospective causes, causal relationships and direct contributions to the decline of our society.

Books have been written on the rise and fall of societies. The clear juggernaut has and will always be human nature: "Solitary, poor, nasty, brutish and short" to quote Thomas Hobbes' poem Leviathan.

Despite history, the search for finding the better angels of our nature without acknowledging the bitter truth of the basics of our human nature continues.

Utopia is a cigar: https://uncrate.com/samuel-adams-utopias-cigar/

These sound familiar, the five really good suggestions for society?

Honor your father and your mother.
You shall not murder.
You shall not commit adultery.
You shall not steal.
You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
You shall not covet.

The 6th would be shut up, get an education, work hard and don't have children out of wedlock.

[widebody911]

Originally Posted by Seahawk

These sound familiar, the five really good suggestions for society?

[jcommin]

Originally Posted by Seahawk

Our societal problems are all self inflicted - we are all, after all, the society.

The two elephants in the room are changes to basic education and the family dynamic in this country.

It would take a Kaizen mapping event to even begin the understand the erosion to the foundations o this country.

This discussion has to be moved to PARF or it is hollow - sorry.

Agree with one exception - it is just not in this country. Societal issues started long before I was born and aren't exclusive to the USA.

[cabmandone]

Originally Posted by jcommin

Agree with one exception - it is just not in this country. Societal issues started long before I was born and aren't exclusive to the USA.

I agree. This is why I love to talk to older people and ask them what changes in society they've seen over their lifetime. I asked a guy in his 80's that once and then sat intently as he talked about his views of how society got from where it was to where it is over his lifetime.

[pwd72s]

Originally Posted by cabmando

Why would a teachers union want teachers to be treated with less respect?

Oh, they want respect...but..

Teachers teach the leftist agenda. The courses of publicly funded schools are modified to reflect leftist views. One example...our daughter's "Global Studies" class textbook flatly stated that the 2nd amendment doesn't give individuals the right to have arms...used the old "The militia mean the military" argument. She graduated high screw=all in '88.

[widebody911]

It seems each generation thinks it's all gone to hell once they reach the "get off my lawn" age.

<borderline PARF>
Want to piss off one of the MAGA crowd? As them to what point in history to which they would like to rewind, and then point out the technical - and more importantly, social - advances since that point in time.
</borderline PARF>

[widebody911]

Originally Posted by tcar

"Baby Momma" and "Baby Daddy" are all too common. And celebrated, especially in the entertainment industry...

I was skimming through one of the neighborhood groups on Facebook, and some lady was asking for advice and used the term "BD" - it took my a bit to figure out WTF she was talking about.