stupid question for the fizzicks/chem folk

[id10t]

So I had a few bourbons last night....

And got to thinking.... How is static electricity and the attraction between the legs of my flannel house pants similar and/or different from magnetism?

And this morning, now that I am sober... I'm still pondering it.


So I know magnets work due to how the individual atoms are aligned in the matrix of the metal. You can "unmake" an iron magnet by simply getting it hot enough to loosen that matrix structure and letting the molecules rearrange themselves naturally.

But what about the attraction properties seen with static electricity? The legs of my pants, a balloon and the hairs on your arms, etc. Obviously no matrix structure, tons of various elements and compounds together so electron counts and valences should all balance properly, etc.

Help an id10t out. But try to make it so I can understand w/o drinking more bourbon.

[red-beard]

E&M, electricity and magnetism are very intertwined. A magnet is nothing more than an element with a bunch of the atomic level electric fields lined up, instead of randomly laid down.

A constant electric field will attract electrically charged particles, but not magnetic particles. A changing electric field will create a magnetic field and attract magnetic particles. So basically, run a current in a wire and you will get both electric and magnetic fields. Wrap the (insulated) wire around an iron or steel rod in the same rotation and you'll create a combined stronger magnetic field.

Here is a very low level run at E&M

https://www.thoughtco.com/introduction-electricity-and-magnetism-4172372#:~:text=Electricity%20and%20magnetism%20ar e%20two%20related%20phenomena%20produced,induces%2 0electric%20charge%20movement%2C%20producing%20an% 20electric%20current.

I am a Mechanical and Electrical Power Engineer, but not an "Electrical Engineer". I know enough to be dangerous...

[dad911]

Tribolectric charging, like a Van de Graaff Generator (The birthday present from Lafayette Electronics that my mother returned when reading 20,000 volts on the box)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triboelectric_effect

Materials from either end of the scale build the largest charge, in your case hair/skin is at the positive end, flannel is likely polyester or similar, at the negative end of the scale.

Wearing leather (at the same end of the scale as hair/skin) would be less 'shocking'

[Bill Verburg]

Originally Posted by id10t

So I had a few bourbons last night....

And got to thinking.... How is static electricity and the attraction between the legs of my flannel house pants similar and/or different from magnetism?

And this morning, now that I am sober... I'm still pondering it.


So I know magnets work due to how the individual atoms are aligned in the matrix of the metal. You can "unmake" an iron magnet by simply getting it hot enough to loosen that matrix structure and letting the molecules rearrange themselves naturally.

But what about the attraction properties seen with static electricity? The legs of my pants, a balloon and the hairs on your arms, etc. Obviously no matrix structure, tons of various elements and compounds together so electron counts and valences should all balance properly, etc.

Help an id10t out. But try to make it so I can understand w/o drinking more bourbon.

electric charge is a property of all matter

electric charge comes in 2 flavors, positive(+) and negative(-)

+ and - attract by the exchange of photons
+ and + repel by the same mechanism
- and - repel by same mechanism


most commonly in our normal environment positive charges are carried by protons, negative by electrons

when ever an electric charge moves there is an associated magnetic field,

Electrons can exist in free unbound states moving through space or moving through conductive matter or in bound states in association w/ the nucleus of an atom the bound electrons also spin which also generates a magnetic couple, All electrons thus generate a magnetic couple at all times, whether bound or unbound.

The electricity in the wires of the grid consists of free electrons moving through the wires which also generate a magnetic field.

static electricity is just the accumulation of extra free electrons on a particular piece of matter, could be your pants or could be a cloud, a redistribution of the excess electrons is the shock or a clap of thunder, same thing different scale


Protons in our normal environment exist mainly in bound states in the nucleus of atoms along w/ electrically neutral Neutrons, The only unbound proton state is the isotope of Hydrogen which only has a single proton in it's nucleus, as all other nuclei contain various #s of Protons and Neutrons, Deuterium is another isotope of Hydrogen, but w/ 1P and 1N, tritium, is 1P and 2N

The number of Protons in the nucleus determines what element it is, Helium has 2P, Lithium 3P

rarely will you encounter a flow of moving Protons unless you happen to have a Tokamak in your house

[Arizona_928]

https://youtu.be/zkUetTDGNoM
Nice explanation of electricity and magnetism. Which are hand and hand with each other. Magnetism produce electricity through electrons.

https://youtu.be/FehUCQKKRwo

Watch this one as well...

[westom]

Originally Posted by id10t

So I know magnets work due to how the individual atoms are aligned in the matrix of the metal. ...

But what about the attraction properties seen with static electricity?

Unfortunately some fundamental concepts are missing.

Magnet only created a magnetic attraction because that field is static.

Charges only creates an electric field attraction because that field is static.

Neither create something called electricity. Move those fields and electricity is created. Now both fields exist simultaneously. Those are Maxwell's equations.

What we call electricity is also called moving E-M fields.

Your pants were not attached by static electricity. Static charges created that attraction. No movement; so no magnetic field.