Welcome to the country! Snakes edition part deux

[Seahawk]

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

This is the one I have. If you do it right, you cannot get hurt using one of these.

https://www.amazon.com/Ouronehome-Professional-All-Aluminum-Handling-Comfortable/dp/B07T6SR1GW/ref=sr_1_5?dchild=1&keywords=snake+stick&qid=1621481292&sr=8-5

That is way "more better" than what I posted.

Just ordered two!

[WPOZZZ]

I'm glad we don't have snakes in Hawaii.

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by WPOZZZ

I'm glad we don't have snakes in Hawaii.

Just the 2 legged kind...

[mattdavis11]

Originally Posted by masraum

What I need to do is figure out what the nearest hospital is that's got antivenom. No point in going anywhere else.

I did some checking this morning. Closest hospital that has anti-venom to you is Columbus Community Hospital. 110 Shult Dr, Columbus, TX 78934. The ER said to expect at least a 6 hour stay, worst case, they fly you out to either Austin or Houston, most often Houston.

[Rick Lee]

Long ago I went to a reptile exhibit near Luray Caverns in VA. IIRC, Steve Irwin (Crocodile Hunter) funded some of it. They had every one of the most exotic, venomous snakes you ever heard of - Taipan, Green Mamba, Gaboon Viper, King Cobra, you name it. I got talking with the owner and asked him what he could do if he ever got tagged while cleaning the cages or moving the snakes around. He replied that he'd have to get med-evac'ed to Johns Hopkins. Yeah, I'm sure that would take no time at all and they'd have whatever antivenin he needed.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by mattdavis11

I did some checking this morning. Closest hospital that has anti-venom to you is Columbus Community Hospital. 110 Shult Dr, Columbus, TX 78934. The ER said to expect at least a 6 hour stay, worst case, they fly you out to either Austin or Houston, most often Houston.

Wow, thanks! And that's great, that Columbus has it. They are close. I was hoping it would be something like that.

[mattdavis11]

They use Crofab in Columbus, if I remember correctly. They said a copperhead might knock you down for several days, but should heal after a bite with good treatment.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by mattdavis11

They use Crofab in Columbus, if I remember correctly. They said a copperhead might knock you down for several days, but should heal after a bite with good treatment.

My understanding is that until fairly recently the only approved antivenom in the US was CroFab. Recently, something that I think is called AnaVip was approved and comes from Mexico and is MUCH cheaper than CroFab.

It's interesting the CroFab is a UK company. The raw snake venom comes from the US and is then sent to the UK to be tested. The venom is then sent to New Zealand to be injected into sheep. The anti-venom is then removed from the sheep and shipped back to the UK for testing and processing. Then for the US it is shipped back here.

This is an image from crofab (if it works correctly) showing the geography of the process.

[vash]

are we NOT going to discuss the half-shirt Marv is rocking in that picture?!

[masraum]

Originally Posted by vash

are we not going to discuss the half-shirt marv is rocking in that picture?!

lol
:d

[Scott Douglas]

When my brother moved to his new location I took it upon myself to check and see if the local Urgent care place had antivenom for rattlesnakes as that would have been the first place I'd taken him if we'd run into a snake with a bad result. Turns out, they don't have any there. Glad I checked that out as we were told the nearest hospital which is 12 miles away would be our best bet as to who would have some on hand. I haven't checked to see if they do, but I can't imagine a hospital in such a snake friendly environment wouldn't have it. Guess I need to have him check.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by Scott Douglas

When my brother moved to his new location I took it upon myself to check and see if the local Urgent care place had antivenom for rattlesnakes as that would have been the first place I'd taken him if we'd run into a snake with a bad result. Turns out, they don't have any there. Glad I checked that out as we were told the nearest hospital which is 12 miles away would be our best bet as to who would have some on hand. I haven't checked to see if they do, but I can't imagine a hospital in such a snake friendly environment wouldn't have it. Guess I need to have him check.

Right, it seems like the time to do it is not after you've been bitten, but before. It would suck to have to sit down and make a bunch of phone calls or assume and drive to several different places after getting bitten. It seems like the time when you'd want to know exactly where to go.

My concern was what locations in the area would be big enough to have the $$$$ antivenom. Fortunately, it seems living relatively close to the city that's the county seat has perks.

[Scott Douglas]

Just to follow up.
I called the local hospital that the Urgent care facility reco'd to me and they do indeed have antivenom. I let my brother know too.

I can relax now.

[GG Allin]

Originally Posted by WPOZZZ

I'm glad we don't have snakes in Hawaii.

Interesting, never knew that. Next time I'm there, I'll drop off a few mating pairs of Pythons.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by Scott Douglas

Just to follow up.
I called the local hospital that the Urgent care facility reco'd to me and they do indeed have antivenom. I let my brother know too.

I can relax now.

Exactly. It seems important to know if you're in an area with plenty and likely to run into them like I am or your brother.

Originally Posted by GG Allin

Interesting, never knew that. Next time I'm there, I'll drop off a few mating pairs of Pythons.

Next time I see a copperhead, I'll stick him in the post. I'm guessing I can put him in a cooler, get him into brumation and he'll be fine.

[vash]

I did a project recently that had rattlesnakes. some contractor guy blurted out that snake venom is not covered by insurance. total hooey. but he did get in my head and I called my insurance provider and hospital. they had the antivenom on hands and yes, it was covered by insurance. workmans comp if it happened at work. my own insurance if it happens while I am mtn biking.

no big deal.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by vash

I did a project recently that had rattlesnakes. some contractor guy blurted out that snake venom is not covered by insurance. total hooey. but he did get in my head and I called my insurance provider and hospital. they had the antivenom on hands and yes, it was covered by insurance. workmans comp if it happened at work. my own insurance if it happens while I am mtn biking.

no big deal.

It's still a huge deal. I've been watching the "National Snakebite Support" group on Facebook for a couple of weeks now. You'd be surprised at how many hospitals don't give anti-venom or follow the correct, modern protocol of snakebite treatment.

The facebook group is monitored by Doctors (MDs and toxicologists) and Vets. If you get a snakebite, you post and they advise you.

Things that I've taken away from it (this is not medical advice and I'm not qualified to give medical advice, if you get bit, go to a Dr/ER). elevate the extremity with the bite (ie, if it's your leg, get it up in the air at least at a 45º angle and keep the leg straight). Don't bother with benedryl. Don't take NSAIDs (they can make it worse). Don't ice the swelling (can cause tissue damage). And if the symptoms fit, give anti-venom. My understanding is that recovery from a snake bite can take a looooong time, and there can be permanent damage as a result.

I think I've read that most folks will require 4-12 vials of anti-venom. It's NOT based on the size of the person. It's based on the volume of venom injected by the snake, and I assume that's estimated based on the severity of the symptoms.

https://bmcemergmed.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1471-227X-11-2



I've seen folks talking back and forth on facebook that are in hospitals with photos of swollen feet, legs, hands, etc.... that are sent home without anti-venom or given tylenol and don't have the bite elevated.



https://khn.org/news/april-medical-bill-of-month-143k-snakebite-antivenin/
excerpts from the article

Summer Bummer: A Young Camper’s $142,938 Snakebite
The snake struck a 9-year-old hiker at dusk on a nature trail. The outrageous bills struck her parents a few weeks later.

Total Bill: $142,938, including $67,957 for four vials of antivenin. ($55,577.64 was charged for air ambulance transport.) The balance included a ground ambulance charge and additional hospital and physician charges, according to the family’s insurer, IU Health Plans.

The average list price for CroFab is $3,198 per vial, according to the health care information tech company Connecture.

A Mexican version of snake antivenin can cost roughly $200. But it couldn’t be sold in the U.S.

In Oakley’s case, St. Vincent Evansville hospital charged $16,989.25 for each unit of CroFab, according to the facility’s bill. That’s more than five times as high as the average list price.

WellRithms analyzed Oakley’s bill from St. Vincent Evansville at Kaiser Health News’ request and found providers generally accept $16,159.70 for all four vials of the drug.

In a statement, St. Vincent Evansville noted that the family was not responsible for that full tab and instead was expected to pay less than $3,500. But the facility appears to have since lowered its price for CroFab. According to its price list — posted online to satisfy a recent federal requirement — the drug now costs $5,096.76 per vial.

And the snake antivenin market now has another drug competing for patients: Anavip. The Mexican product — launched in October — has a list price of $1,220 a vial in the U.S, a fraction of what Latin Americans pay for it, according to Rare Disease Therapeutics, which distributes the drug in the U.S.

Oakley’s foot is healed, but her toe bends slightly downward and is sensitive to pressure.

If you even get bit, don't assume the medical folks know what they are doing. I'm not saying that they don't, I'm just saying don't assume that they do.

[mattdavis11]

Originally Posted by masraum

My concern was what locations in the area would be big enough to have the $$$$ antivenom. Fortunately, it seems living relatively close to the city that's the county seat has perks.

I figured it would have been Fayette County, La Grange. That's who I called first, they said Columbus, as they do not have it. Colorado County is on top. I would have never guessed. Makes sense though. They need the best being on I10 in the middle of nowhere.

Guadalupe Regional has it, only blocks away from me. I know copperhead snakes are in my back yard, I just hadn't seen one yet. Only a matter of time.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by mattdavis11

I figured it would have been Fayette County, La Grange. That's who I called first, they said Columbus, as they do not have it. Colorado County is on top. I would have never guessed. Makes sense though. They need the best being on I10 in the middle of nowhere.

Guadalupe Regional has it, only blocks away from me. I know copperhead snakes are in my back yard, I just hadn't seen one yet. Only a matter of time.

Wow, yeah, I would have expected La Grange to have it too. I'm shocked!

Lucky me! Hopefully, I never need it.

[Rick Lee]

Our local Nextdoor.com has posts just about weekly asking about a snake on someone's property. PD and FD won't deal with them here. So I volunteered and said I'd be happy to safely remove any snake and relocate it to the desert. Last week I got the first call, but I was on my way to work and wouldn't be back for several hours. From the lady's description, it sounded like a big Bull Snake, so no danger at all. By the time I got home and texted her, the snake had moved on. But I really look forward to relocating a Rattler for someone.