Not a big Jelly Roll fan,but a good video on the fentanyl crises

[serene911]

[Arizona_928]

Why does the United States still have a high rate of illicit drug activities, despite having the numerous laws and a decades long War on Drugs?

[rcooled]

Originally Posted by Arizona_928

Why does the United States still have a high rate of illicit drug activities...

Far too much of this ↓ being made by far too many people...

[Arizona_928]

Originally Posted by rcooled

Far too much of this ↓ being made by far too many people...

So money. Consumerism. Capitalism and greed… or therefore the illusion of it and hence the need for opiates(for those to escape the failures of their lives and country)…

[PorscheGAL]

Maybe I was naive but when I started my newest Job last summer, I came face to face with how prevalent drug use is in this country.

I expected pot to be the most used in the patients I was seeing, it is not. Cocaine, fentanyl and heroin are.

I mistakenly thought cocaine was a more expensive option so wouldn't be seen that often. Wrong. 80% of the patients I see test positive for cocaine. The oldest, I've seen, was 80 years old; the youngest 16 years old. I've seen people who live in government housing and people who live in upper middle class areas of town.

Fentanyl is cheap. It is mixed with the cocaine (which lowers the price), so if someone's tox screen shows cocaine, most of the time, it will show fentanyl also.

That testimony JellyRoll gave was powerful. Sadly, it will change nothing.

[Dixie]

Originally Posted by PorscheGAL

Maybe I was naive but when I started my newest Job last summer, I came face to face with how prevalent drug use is in this country.

I expected pot to be the most used in the patients I was seeing, it is not. Cocaine, fentanyl and heroin are.

I mistakenly thought cocaine was a more expensive option so wouldn't be seen that often. Wrong. 80% of the patients I see test positive for cocaine. The oldest, I've seen, was 80 years old; the youngest 16 years old. I've seen people who live in government housing and people who live in upper middle class areas of town.

Fentanyl is cheap. It is mixed with the cocaine (which lowers the price), so if someone's tox screen shows cocaine, most of the time, it will show fentanyl also.

That testimony JellyRoll gave was powerful. Sadly, it will change nothing.

Thank you for your first hand testimony. May I ask what you do? I'm simply curious if that skews the number of pot users you encounter. I too would expect pot to be #1.
Most everyone I know, but me, smokes pot. I wish I could claim I didn't care, but I've ditched multiple guys because all they wanted to do was hang out and get high, ugh!

[Flatbutt1]

I lost a cousin to heroin back in the 60's and it devastated the extended family. Back then there was virtually no awareness and no treatment so Richie just wasted away.

More peripherally I've seen huge changes in what has been my favorite playground for decades which is West Virginia. There are small towns that I used as stopping points / base camp that have nearly disappeared due to drugs. I haven't been back in 5 years so maybe it's gotten better but the last time I was there it was very sad.

[jhynesrockmtn]

I heard a long interview with the author Sam Quinones a while back. He has done a deep dive on the current drug crisis. How the drugs are made, sold, etc. The book is Th.e Least of Us: True Tales of America and Hope in the Time of Fentanyl and Meth

He has an interesting perspective on what we see as the last group of homeless, who essentially can't be housed, despite having beds at shelters and supported apartments available. Their drug use and paranoia prevent them from following any sort of process to get help.

We've seen this locally with folks camping in below freezing weather despite beds being available at shelters. The "housing first" model is failing because the drug use issue is being ignored by the "experts".

https://a.co/d/fuWbNcC

[cockerpunk]

Originally Posted by PorscheGAL

Sadly, it will change nothing.

what changes should be made? what changes can be made?

that's the question right? you cannot punish these folks into compliance, we know that doesn't work, we tried it for 40 years. you cant take something away from people who have nothing, and pretend it helps.

[Flatbutt1]

Originally Posted by cockerpunk

what changes should be made? what changes can be made?

that's the question right? you cannot punish these folks into compliance, we know that doesn't work, we tried it for 40 years. you cant take something away from people who have nothing, and pretend it helps.

Maybe try removing the profit motive from the cartels? IDK if across the board decriminalization is effective or even possible but hell it seems to be the only thing we haven't tried.

[1990C4S]

Originally Posted by Flatbutt1

Maybe try removing the profit motive from the cartels?

I don't think you can stop the supply. And reducing supply drives up prices and profits.

When you can't stop the supply, and you can't reduce the demand, then perhaps there is no viable answer.

[PorscheGAL]

Originally Posted by Capt. Carrera

Thank you for your first hand testimony. May I ask what you do? I'm simply curious if that skews the number of pot users you encounter. I too would expect pot to be #1.
Most everyone I know, but me, smokes pot. I wish I could claim I didn't care, but I've ditched multiple guys because all they wanted to do was hang out and get high, ugh!

I am a nurse who works in organ donation. I evaluate patients who are dying to see if their organs could be donated.

[PorscheGAL]

Originally Posted by cockerpunk

what changes should be made? what changes can be made?

that's the question right? you cannot punish these folks into compliance, we know that doesn't work, we tried it for 40 years. you cant take something away from people who have nothing, and pretend it helps.

I don’t have an answer. I’m sure everyone here has seen the effects of addiction.

I will share a story from nursing school: I was assigned a pt who had been in the hospital for several months recovering from an abscess on their spine which caused paralysis (this is quite common with iv drug use). They were very open with their story. Along with their spouse, they progressed from pot to oxycodone to heroin. They made the choice to sell their home and live on the streets to fund their habit. Their 3 children were estranged due to the drug use. Their spouse died from an OD while they were in the hospital. My patient had every intention of returning to their drug use after leaving the hospital. I was told on several occasions money from the sale of the home was still available.

Even though, this patient had lost their home, spouse and children, they didn’t want to change their drug use.

That made me more acutely aware I have no solution

[Seahawk]

Originally Posted by PorscheGAL

That made me more acutely aware I have no solution

Thank you for your posts on this subject.

I finally got a friend of mine into recovery, not cocaine related, and it was the hardest thing I have ever done: I had to walk away in anger so he could walk into a better life.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by Flatbutt1

Maybe try removing the profit motive from the cartels? IDK if across the board decriminalization is effective or even possible but hell it seems to be the only thing we haven't tried.

Congress passed a bill earlier this year that put "sanctions" on the cartels. It supposedly makes it harder for them to to launder the money and a makes it easier to catch and convict them. We'll see. "Sanctions" only work for as long as the dollar has value to them. With the BRICS countries working hard to overturn the US dollar as the world's reserve currency and the usefulness of cyber money, sanctions in US dollars is looking less viable as a tool. When the cartels no longer care whether they have US dollars or not, we are pretty much helpless.

I don't think criminalizing users is going to help anything. Attempted murder charges and long prison sentences for anyone caught selling fentanyl-laced substances would get current dealers off the streets, but with suppliers pushing product and willing buyers they will be replaced quickly.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by PorscheGAL

Even though, this patient had lost their home, spouse and children, they didn’t want to change their drug use.

Good that she was honest with you about her intentions. My ex made noises about wanting to get off of prescription drugs. Five years and over $150,000 later in repeated recovery and rehab I finally realized she only wanted to go through the motions of quitting. Had she been honest about her devotion to drugs over me we would have been divorced years earlier and I would have saved several tens of thousands of dollars on recovery and rehab.
It doesn't help that a lot of the recovery/rehab facilities are just there to take tax payer's money from clients who were court-ordered into it. Judges are so damn gullible. "Oh yes your honor, I do, I do want to kick my habit - I swear. Thank you your honor, for sending me to rehab instead of jail." It would save time and money if the judges turned them loose.

[Arizona_928]

Originally Posted by Flatbutt1

Maybe try removing the profit motive from the cartels? IDK if across the board decriminalization is effective or even possible but hell it seems to be the only thing we haven't tried.

The market is only there because we allow it. If we focus on rehabilitation instead of incarceration...

If the 'war on drugs' was worth anything, we would be hunting down the cartels like isis, Saddam, or Bin Laden... Instead, it is quite obvious that the corruption has ahold of every aspect of the government. We saw this with 2022 primary in AZ. Allegations that the cartels bought the Governor's election (which reeked of corruption). Further, the laws are only enforced upon the competitors to the cartels. Let alone the wide open border that the feds seem to be pushing..

Then I have the little monkey in back of my head thinking about the CIA and the cocaine epidemic of the 80's... The fact that United States has the most laws, and the most incarcerated... The point isn't to fix this issue. It's greed, power, influence and a whole bunch of money... All at the expense of the citizens of this great country.

[Arizona_928]

Originally Posted by wdfifteen

Congress passed a bill earlier this year that put "sanctions" on the cartels. It supposedly makes it harder for them to to launder the money and a makes it easier to catch and convict them. We'll see. "Sanctions" only work for as long as the dollar has value to them. With the BRICS countries working hard to overturn the US dollar as the world's reserve currency and the usefulness of cyber money, sanctions in US dollars is looking less viable as a tool. When the cartels no longer care whether they have US dollars or not, we are pretty much helpless.

I don't think criminalizing users is going to help anything. Attempted murder charges and long prison sentences for anyone caught selling fentanyl-laced substances would get current dealers off the streets, but with suppliers pushing product and willing buyers they will be replaced quickly.

That's comical. Sanctions are the virtue signaling from the west. The cartels are ran on extreme brutality. Cartels are a virus, prison won't do much besides forced labor for the privatized prisons (that is if they can stay in general population long enough not to kill more Americans)...

What was earmarked in that bill would be my question.

[creaturecat]

folks are being poisoned. ....... not the traditional "overdose".

a study here? almost 80% of the addicted women in the DTES (dntn eastside) Vancouver - were sexually abused as infants. essentially zero mental health facilities for the downtrodden. it's ****ed.

[pwd72s]

Singapore has a nearly zero illegal drug problem. How so? Death penalty for dealing.

(edit) I know...will never happen here. Perhaps the libertarian approach...let the addicts kill themselves.