Rust armorer found guilty

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by Por_sha911

Based on Baldwin's claim, can you imagine how many people should have died in these pictures?




All those guns just waiting to go off without anyone pulling the triggers! Baldwin is claiming that guns kill people all by themselves!

I bought my first pistol at the State Fairgrounds at a show just like that. 100,000 square foot building and filled with tables of guns. I walked up picked out the pistol I wanted, handed over cash. He gave me a receipt, and a bag to put the pistol in, and I walked out.

Sadly that gun and many others were lost in the boating accident not too long ago.

[Por_sha911]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

I bought my first pistol at the State Fairgrounds at a show just like that. 100,000 square foot building and filled with tables of guns. I walked up picked out the pistol I wanted, handed over cash. He gave me a receipt, and a bag to put the pistol in, and I walked out.

Sadly that gun and many others were lost in the boating accident not too long ago.

There was no report or background check done so my statement would be
Gun? What gun. I didn't see any gun.

Unfortunately, the "Boating accident" alabi would be worthless when Big Brother wants to know why you are buying ammo (or powder and primers) for guns you no longer have.

[john70t]

Originally Posted by Reiver

The DA in the NM area responsible said she has not decided upon charges as yet... no one is in the clear.

Isn't she "obstructing justice" and using her position for "favoritism"?

Shouldn't she be brought up on Grand Jury charges?

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/jackie-johnson-ahmaud-arbery-prosecutor-charged-obstruction/
Nov 25, 2021 · Justice for Ahmaud 41:46. A former Georgia district attorney has been booked on charges linked to her alleged mishandling of the case of Ahmaud Arbery,

[craigster59]

The Gun Show pictured above, I don't know if any So Cal Pelicans attended, but The Great Western Gun Show they would have at L.A. Fairgrounds in April and November would be 5-7 HUGE buildings. It could take 2 days to walk through.

Unfortunately after the Rodney King riots they canceled all gun and ammo sales so the gun show was canceled. Then people were upset that county property was being used for gun and ammo sales and that was the end.

[Por_sha911]

Originally Posted by craigster59

The Gun Show pictured above, I don't know if any So Cal Pelicans attended, but The Great Western Gun Show they would have at L.A. Fairgrounds in April and November would be 5-7 HUGE buildings. It could take 2 days to walk through.

Unfortunately after the Rodney King riots they canceled all gun and ammo sales so the gun show was canceled. Then people were upset that county property was being used for gun and ammo sales and that was the end.

Kalifornia at its best.

[MMARSH]

Originally Posted by craigster59

In my honest and biased opinion I really don't think AB is responsible for the cinematographer's death beyond being too cheap to hire decent, experienced people.

I believe (and it will eventually come out) that the armourer was responsible for the live ammo being brought on site and eventually on set. She is young, scared and inexperienced and is going to deny responsibility until enough evidence is brought forth and then and only then will she break.

I agree with you.

[Crowbob]

Originally Posted by craigster59

In my honest and biased opinion I really don't think AB is responsible for the cinematographer's death beyond being too cheap to hire decent, experienced people.

I believe (and it will eventually come out) that the armourer was responsible for the live ammo being brought on site and eventually on set. She is young, scared and inexperienced and is going to deny responsibility until enough evidence is brought forth and then and only then will she break.

This is a very dangerous way of thinking. If it comes down to not holding the individual who pulled the trigger responsible for the consequences of shooting someone dead, what would prevent anyone else from claiming ‘someone else is responsible but it certainly isn’t me’ when any loaded gun is handed to him and someone is killed? Say a gun owner, who is responsible for that firearm unknowingly hands off a loaded firearm. Is it reasonable to say, ‘It’s his gun! I didn’t know it was loaded. It’s his fault!’

In such a case, what would prevent any unintentional discharge of a firearm and the consequences including death, be the responsibility of the gun owner?

Two people plinking. The gun owner lays his firearm down, both thinking he spent the last round when the other person picks it up and kills somebody. Is the gun owner then responsible?

This is a very, very dangerous precedent. It opens the door to all gun owners being held responsible for the consequences of someone else’s negligence.

In my worthless opinion, the person pulling the trigger should always be held responsible for whatever happens because of it.

[javadog]

Ultimately none of this matters. What matters is the law in that state, which makes this seem to be a definite case of involuntary manslaughter. The legal aspect is pretty clear, all that remains is the political aspect of it.

There is nothing in the law regarding exceptions for movies. He was in possession and control of the gun that shot and killed someone.

[Crowbob]

FIFY, respectfully.

‘He was in the possession and control of a gun, pulled the trigger and killed someone.’

[Reiver]

Originally Posted by Crowbob

FIFY, respectfully.

‘He was in the possession and control of a gun, pulled the trigger and killed someone.’

When the armorer was not on the set.... I would say, from my foxhole, that if you are the producer and you do not follow the set rules you are then responsible for what takes place.

[Crowbob]

Yes. I was thinking your statement could be misconstrued as ‘the gun that shot and killed someone’ was in Baldwin’s possession and control.

The gun didn’t shoot and kill anyone is the point I was trying to make.

[javadog]

It remains to be seen if he consciously pulled the trigger after pointing it, or had his finger on it when he pulled the pistol from the holster, or if it had some sort of unusual defect in the firing mechanism, etc.

Lots of possibilities and no details have been made public about any of them.

None of those details are relevant from my reading of the legal statute. Regardless of how he caused it to fire, she’s dead from a projectile fired from a gun that he had control of.

[berettafan]

Suggesting he did not actually pull the trigger is just silly. I would hope most aren't gullible enough to believe that.

[javadog]

Maybe you didn’t understand the point I was making. He might’ve had his finger in the trigger guard and had the trigger depressed, then when he pulled it out of the holster he might’ve cocked it with his thumb, then released the hammer and boom.

That’s a different scenario than pointing it and consciously pulling the trigger.

It’s like all of those unintended acceleration problems, when the driver thought they were pressing firmly on the brake pedal, but they weren’t.

And the point is there are several ways he could have fired the gun and we don’t know any details yet.

[Reiver]

Originally Posted by javadog

Maybe you didn’t understand the point I was making. He might’ve had his finger in the trigger guard and had the trigger depressed, then when he pulled it out of the holster he might’ve cocked it with his thumb, then released the hammer and boom.

That’s a different scenario than pointing it and consciously pulling the trigger.

It’s like all of those unintended acceleration problems, when the driver thought they were pressing firmly on the brake pedal, but they weren’t.

And the point is there are several ways he could have fired the gun and we don’t know any details yet.

As he has used that firearm before I doubt that and regardless, there is no way one can verify that he pulled/pressed/folded or massaged the trigger in any certain way other than the weapon went off.
If the single action revolver is in good repair his excuse is moot.....

[dlockhart]

[javadog]

Fair enough, but none of us know if it’s in good repair, or if it’s been modified in some way, or whatever. Lots of what if’s? at this point. Lots of opinions as to what went down, without any facts, yet.

Under New Mexico law, I don’t think any of it makes any difference.

[varmint]

Anybody have a guess when this will go to trial?

And pleassssse let it be televised.

[Crowbob]

Whether he pulled the trigger or not, the gun was discharged while in his hand and a person was killed.

No matter what the proximate cause of the discharge, the firearm was not inspected prior to being pointed at someone.

Pulling the trigger, or not pulling the trigger, the loaded firearm was pointed at a person and a live round was discharged, killing one and wounding another.

Only if it can be shown that the firearm pointed itself at someone and discharged a live round into someone all by itself can Baldwin be absolved of negligence.

Pulling the trigger was simply the last negligent act in a whole series of negligent acts, each contributing to the tragedy. Why should Baldwin escape responsibility for his part in it?

[javadog]

I don’t think anybody is suggesting Baldwin should be let off the hook. I’m on record as saying that I think he’s guilty of involuntary manslaughter.

The movie industry has procedures they like to follow, I get that, but those don’t seem to be relevant under New Mexico state law. Involuntary manslaughter is involuntary manslaughter and it doesn’t make any difference that it occurred on a movie set.