best all-time baseball player

[CJFusco]

The "MLB Not for Me" thread got me thinking...

anyhow, here are the guys you could make a case for:

Ty Cobb.
.366 Career Batting (1st all-time)
.433 On-Base Percentage (9th all-time)
.512 Career Slugging (18th all-time)
Does not rank top 100 in career HRs
One Triple Crown, One MVP award, 11-time batting champion. One-time HR champion. 4-time RBI champion.

Babe Ruth.
.3421 Career Batting (tied 9th all-time)
.4739 On=Base Percentage (2nd all-time)
.6897 Slugging Percentage (1st all-time)
715 Career HRs (2nd all-time)
Two-time All Star, one MVP award, one batting title, 12-time home run champion. Six-time RBI champion. 2.21 Career ERA as a pitcher.
NOTE: Held single season home run record (60 in 1927) for 34 years.

Hank Aaron.
Doesn't rank top 100 AVG
Doesn't rank top 100 OBP
.555 Career Slugging (18th all-time)
755 HR (1st all-time)
21-time all-star. One MVP award. 3 gold gloves. 2-time batting champion. 4-time HR champion. 4-time RBI champion. 2297 career RBIs (1st all-time).

Ted Williams.
.344 Career Batting (7th all-time)
.4817 On-Base Percentage (1st all-time)
.6338 Slugging Percentage (2nd all-time)
521 Career HRs (14th all-time)
2 AL Triple Crowns, 2 AL MVP Awards, 17-time All-Star, 6-time AL Batting Champion, 4-time AL home-run champion, 4-time AL RBI champion.
NOTE: last player to ever bat over .400 in a single season (.406 in 1941)

Lou Gehrig.
.3401 Career Batting (17th all-time)
.447 Career On-base percentage (5th all-time)
.632 Slugging (3rd all-time)
493 Career HRs (20th all-time)
7-time All-star, one triple crown, 2 AL MVP awards. one-time batting champion. 3-time HR champion. 5-time RBI champion.


Barry Bonds.
Does not rank top 100 in batting
.602 career slugging percentage (7th all-time)
.4332 On-Base Percentage (8th all-time)
661 Career HRs (3rd all-time)
12-time all-star. 6-time MVP. 8 Golden Gloves. One-time batting champion. 2-time HR champion. 2-time RBI champion.
NOTE: holds the single season record for HRs with 73, in 2001.
NOTE: Bonds is the only player in history to have over 400 HRs and 400 stolen bases. Bonds has 661 HRs and over 500 SBs.

Willie Mays.
Does not rank top 100 in batting.
Does not rank top 100 in OBP
.557 Slugging percentage (25th all-time)
660 HRs (4th all-time)
1951 Rookie of the Year. 2-time MVP. 12 gold gloves. 20-time all-star. one-time batting champion. 4-time HR champion. 4-time stolen base champion.

So what do we think?

[smoak]

is this best all time hitter or player?

[nostatic]

if you're focusing on hitting, I'd add Tony Gwynn to that list. And lo and behold, here is some statistical evidence:

http://pup.princeton.edu/titles/6550.html

As for overall player, Roberto Clemente comes to mind. Ty Cobb was great, along with Honus Wagner. Brooks Robinson too.

[Moses]

It's hard to argue with Babe Ruth. The big league record for HRs was less than 20 when he entered the league. The fence in Yankee stadium was a lot farther away when he played. Some old lady with season tickets scored every game in Babes 60 HR season. She even recorded all his warning track shots. He hit 25 of them. If he hit those in todays Yankee Stadium, the record would stand at 85!

A lifetime ERA of 2.21 as a pitcher? That man was the king. My favorite Babe Ruth line? after signing his biggest contract, a reporter asked him if he thought it was appropriate that he made more money than President Hoover. Babe replied, "Well... I had a better year than he did."

[Shuie]

Bo Jackson.

He never held any records except for maybe most consecutive 200 strikeout seasons. I think he held the longest homerun record in 12 different parks when he was playing if that counts for anything. With 1 hip he still had the 2nd fastest time out of the batters box to first base. I still dont think the sport of baseball has ever seen another athlete like him.

[BlueSkyJaunte]

Air Bud.

[Moses]

Originally posted by Shuie
Bo Jackson.

He never held any records except for maybe most consecutive 200 strikeout seasons. I think he held the longest homerun record in 12 different parks when he was playing if that counts for anything. With 1 hip he still had the 2nd fastest time out of the batters box to first base. I still dont think the sport of baseball has ever seen another athlete like him.

No doubt Bo may have been the best athlete to ever play the game. Amazing man.

[H.G.P.]

I place Ruth and Williams right up there, give Ruth the nod due to pitching. Further down the list, honorable mention to a life cut short, Roberto Clemente.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Oil Can Boyd.



Had to. You're a fellow Sox fan, figured you'd appreciate the silliness.

[mattdavis11]

Nolan Ryan. My choice is not because of his statistics, but rather because he beat the crap out of Robin Ventura.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

(1) Any current player of the Red Sox
(2) Any player that retired as a member of the Red Sox
(3) Any player that was once on the Red Sox (but never joined "The Enemy"
(4) Any player that beats "The Enemy"

In that order.

[CJFusco]

"Oil Can Boyd.
Had to. You're a fellow Sox fan, figured you'd appreciate the silliness."

How about Bill "Spaceman" Lee?

I grew up a fan of Dwight Evans.

[slope-nz]

Alright, I'm from Cinti,but what about Pete Rose ? Just asking Randy

[CJFusco]

Pete Rose certainly deserves a nod for the top ten or twenty, but I don't think he's in the same league (so to speak) as The Babe, the Say Hey Kid, or Teddy Ballgame.

[CJFusco]

I should also mention that Ted Williams's two best years were 1941 and 1946... he missed 42-45 due to service in WWII and Korea. His projected HR total, had he played those years, is 721, which would place him #2 on the all-time HR list!

I don't think we can argue that Ted Williams was the best hitter of all time (The Babe is the only person that could challenge him)... but he didn't steal a lot of bases, and was an average defensive outfielder...

I think Willie Mays is the best combination of Power, Speed, Average, and Defense.

[Shuie]

Originally posted by CJFusco
I should also mention that Ted Williams's two best years were 1941 and 1946... he missed 42-45 due to service in WWII and Korea. His projected HR total, had he played those years, is 721, which would place him #2 on the all-time HR list!

I don't think we can argue that Ted Williams was the best hitter of all time (The Babe is the only person that could challenge him)... but he didn't steal a lot of bases, and was an average defensive outfielder...

I think Willie Mays is the best combination of Power, Speed, Average, and Defense.

It’s an apples and oranges comparison, but I would love to see what guys like Tony Gwynn and George Brett could do against pitchers from Ted Williams’s era.

I’m not taking anything away from William's accomplishments. He was a phenomenal player, no question.

[elwood-914]

Willie McCovey was my favorite growing up, but Willie Mays had the bad luck of playing in Candle Stick Park, too windy. He would have had many more H.R. if not for that. But I'm glad we had him.

[pwd72s]

Bob Feller...H.O.F., '62...Better pitcher than Whitey Ford, IMHO...

[GrindingGears]

The Babe...looking at his batting numbers alone makes him a front runner for all time greatest. But then if you add his pitching numbers, get outta town! Pretty unbelievable #s he put up.

EDIT: CJ thanks for typing out all of that data.

EDIT 2: Bonds 500/500...amazing.

[nostatic]

Originally posted by Shuie
It’s an apples and oranges comparison, but I would love to see what guys like Tony Gwynn and George Brett could do against pitchers from Ted Williams’s era.

I’m not taking anything away from William's accomplishments. He was a phenomenal player, no question.

What he said. Williams didn't face fresh releif pitchers in late innings. That could be balanced by the thinner talent pool of the modern era, but Gwynn is the best hitter I ever saw, bar none. And he also worked harder than almost any player I heard of, and by sheer will turned himself from an average fielder to a gold glove winner.

I'll ask my dad though...he saw Williams as well as Gwynn, and in fact my mom went to the same HS as Williams (Hoover HS in San Diego)