Oh and for all of you bashing Kerry speach.....

(CNN) -- Coming into Thursday, John Kerry knew what he had to do.

And if he didn't hit a home run, he at least had a stand-up triple -- or a 25-point game if you're a basketball fan, or a three-touchdown performance if you're into football. Kerry did what he needed to do.

The Massachusetts senator was confident and clear. He sounded out ideas on a number of key issues -- among them, that he won't raise taxes for individuals with incomes below $200,000, that he would increase the number of troops, that he'd spend more on education.


Seems like some people liked it.....

Geoff

Would you like to make a little wager that you saved more than that one $300 check?

would you like me to fax you the reciepts?

I liked it. I thought he did very well in outlining his intentions within an hour.

It's not like you could ever get specifics out of GWB or Cheney - they would just envoke "executive priveledge."

<grin>

Sure:) But receipts for what? Unless your tax bill was only $300 and you got it all back, you saved more. It was a percentage thing.

Well said and fair enough. I just read every subsection on the web site under "Plans". There's very little substance there. Lots of "We have a plan to..." and "We will..." but very little "...and here's how..."

In the past few years the percentage I have paid in taxes compared to Clinton and Bush hasn't changed much. I can afford to pay more and I believe that since I'm in a higher earning catagory that I should. I just wish I got a little more vacation out of the deal. The fact is, I am doing better under GWB than I Was under clinton but I don't think it has to do with either of them. I will take that credit myself thank you very much. I've worked my ass off the last decade to put myself where I am. Not enough people do that I think and still education is so expensive that they can't afford more than a community college at best (not that there is anything wrong with that).

"In the past few years the percentage I have paid in taxes compared to Clinton and Bush hasn't changed."

I am not sure how that is posssible. All the rates were adjusted down, ALL.

yes, the tax system in very complicated but all things being equal, ie. income earned, deductions, etc, you're savings are only a couple hundred dollars.

Counterpoints/rebuttal to last night's highly negative and hypocritical speech:

http://www.georgewbush.com/KerryMediaCenter/Read.aspx?ID=3118

On ramp, you're just wrong. What deductions were lowered? Some were left alone, and others were INCREASED, such as the child deduction. So I ask again what deductions were disallowed causing the rate decrease to have a lesser affect. Just one will do, thanks.

i can tell you the sky is blue and we can spend the whole day arguing about it and get nowhere. so what's the point?

You said the rate decreases were smoke and mirrors and that the percentage was less than advertised. I asked for proof, I guess I apologize.

Just one, please. Just one.

Also I am sick of the "my local taxes went up because of the Federal cuts" line. First I will say that good, local control and accountability are what we need.

Second, the fact is most states and localities were making money hand over fist in the 90's. Tell me you didn't notice all the State and county projects going on in your area. In essence they spent like drunken sailors because they could. The idiots never stopped to think the train might slow down. So now they(you) have to pay the piper for their foolish actions. Had they maintained a reasonible level of spending during the boom there wouldn't be a problem. The Federal government has virtually no affect on your property tax. And don't give me education cuts, there were NO cuts, none zero nada. In fact they were increased. Your state/local governments are BSing you to cover their own asses."hey it's not our fault they cut our funding". LIE, you are getting more money with each passing year, you just spend it so foolishly it doesn't keep up. Again NO cuts NONE.

I think Kerry is weak on pretty much every front. That may be part of what disgusts me about this election. It is a choice between dumb and dumberer (you can put whichever you want in the dumberer role). The lesser of two evils (actually 4 evils). I see nothing to get excited about, but rather fear from what each respective "leader" will do.

Clinton had his issues, but I found him to be a very smart man who was skilled at finding common centrist ground and building coalitions/consensus. I could at least get somewhat excited about the prospect that he would/could do something. While I didn't agree with much of Reagan's policy/ideas, I at least respected his inner commitment. Nixon was a megalomaniac, but brilliant in many ways.

I don't think you guys are off base. But I also don't think those who bash Bush are off base. More's the pity.

Fair enough:) I can detest the man (Clinton) yet respect his talent. He was/is a great politician(not sure if thats's a compliment).

Until recently (just bought my first house) I've had zero deductions available to me. Also, while the rates were adjusted down my income has increased dramatically each year, moving me into a different tax bracket. Up until recently I've had a very simple financial life. I get paid and I spend it or save it (for the house). Now, things are changing - I have a house and the deductions that come along with it and I will have a child in December and the deductions that go along with that. None of those savings are because GWB is president in my eyes (or Kerry for that matter).

The facts are that my tax bill will go up with Kerry in office. I've told this to my wife and my friends who earn as I do. If you vote for Kerry, your tax bill will likely increase. The thing is I think our standing in the world will go up. We didn't travel abroad this year because of GWB's policies and what they have done to the way American's are perceived in the world. I don't feel that it is safe for us to leave our borders now because GWB is in office. Their tactics of fear have worked I'm afraid of what they have done. I am not afraid to vote for John Kerry - I am afraid for this country if he looses. I don't agree with everything he says but I am comfortable with most of it.

I have issues with his policy on outsourcing - I don’t' know how it will be possible for him to incentive US companies to stay with US workers. I think the WTO and the EU will take issue with it - though what they will do I do not know. Personally I think outsourcing is a suspect practice. It does take decent jobs away from Americans and it pays those on the other side substandard wages even in their own country.

I can respect GWB's view if you can honestly tell me that it is worth it to you to pay with our soldiers lives for the stability in an area of the world to guarantee you cheap oil? Personally, I would have gladly pay $5.00 a gallon for gas if it had meant that ~1000 people who have died in Iraq up to now (not counting outside the service) would still be alive. You don't kill hornets by hitting the nest with a baseball bat. All we've done is stir them up and make them more angry (maybe mad is a better word) than they were. I'm not defending them in anyway but if we think we haven't done anything wrong we're sadly mistaken and greatly delusional.

Mike,

I disagree with the soldiers for cheap oil arguement. I simply do not believe that's what it's all about. I don't believe you can win these people over, you must defeat them. As Eagle said earlier, we must fight these guys, so lets do it over there instead of here. Whether W or Kerry is in office, these people want to kill us. Which guy do you feel will do a better job of protecting us from them? I know your answer, but the question is valid.

I smoke truth crack.

"I personally didn't see personal atrocities in the sense I saw somebody cut a head off or something like that. However, I did take part in free-fire zones, I did take part in harassment and interdiction fire, I did take part in search-and-destroy missions in which the houses of noncombatants were burned to the ground.

"And all of these acts, I find out later on, are contrary to the Hague and Geneva conventions and to the laws of warfare. So in that sense, anybody who took part in those, if you carry out the application of the Nuremberg Principles, is in fact guilty."

John "I married 2!!! millionares" Kerry

So, to summarize the above quotation, he didn't see anyone else commit attrocities, but he did commit attrocities.

This is consistent with his fellow Swift Boat veterans not on his payroll.