edited for content by poster.

is that all you got? Typical sniveling liberal, can't stick to the issue, has to go out on some kind of, what appears to be a personal attack, to deflect. I feel sorry for your children.

Are you sticking to the issue? Is this not a personal attack? Take a look in the mirror young man!

I asked him a question with regards to baseless accusations he made and he retorted with that, so I called him on it. I still want an answer to the question, and I maintain that those are the tactics of a sniveling, crybaby, liberal.

BT, i retracted that after rereading it. that was a low blow and i will never make fun of your car again... i am sorry.

i don't have any kids yet, so save your sorry thoughts for something more constructive. when i do i will teach them tolerence, something you and SS seem to be lacking in. its not that i am for open borders or illegals being allowed to pour over our borders. thing is that for every story that SS posts there are 100 mexicans doing work (legal or not) and trying to do nothing more than make a living and contribute to a better life.

have you ever been to a construction site? oh yeah, who builds anything where you live? but if you go to where the economy is well enough off that construction is occurring you will see the mexican labor contributing. its easy for guys like SS to dig up stories of the few bad apples and paint them all with one big brush stroke, but there are productive illegals doing work not many other here (white bread republicans) will dirty their hands with.

there is not easy answer to this problem. i think there has to be better methods of documenting these people, because they are not going away. they serve in a capacity that helps keep our economy running and will continue to. i just resent the fact that SS can come in and post articles about the extreme cases and expect us to think that every illegal in the country fits that bill. if our federal goverment (your republican controlled federal goverment) is not going to make an effort to figure out which of these people are the ones that SS links, or the ones that the original poster in this thread discribe it will continue like this. they will continue to come, we need to document them, get from them what they owe if they are going to make a living here, and weed out the ones that SS links. him painting with his wide brush is like me calling him a racist, which i have not, lately because of his views.

they will continue to come, if SS had some constructive ideas about what should be done i would listen. his constant spew of hate for a few bad apples (and they are very bad people) with out any real solution except "its the law" in his views gets old.

What should we do?

DEPORT THEM DONT REWARD THEM

When I was growing up the constrution was do by AMERICAN CITZENS not Criminal Aliens.

The made good money pounding nails or pouring concrete.

If it wasnt for 25% of the population of mexico invading our country those jobs would still be paying good wages.





Minutemen Are People, Too
Arizona rednecks win a round against the ACLU.

BY LEO W. BANKS
Thursday, May 19, 2005 12:01 a.m. EDT

TUCSON, Ariz.--Anybody who appreciates a good yuck was sad to see the Minutemen pack up their pickups and go home. After all, it wasn't every day that we got to enjoy the spectacle of sunscreen-lathered ACLU observers chasing volunteer border-watchers through the desert. But in the media bonfire accompanying Arizona's Redneck Revolt, we saw the cultural divide separating media elites from ordinary people--those with BlackBerries and $150 hairdos versus folks with tobacco bulges in their cheeks.

In the view of most of the reporters who parachuted into Arizona for this story and, disturbingly, local ones as well, you'd get the distinct impression that the Minutemen are the problem along the border. That's right. America needn't worry about the thousands who bust into the country every night. No, the real danger are those yahoos who think calling the cops when they see somebody breaking the law is a good idea.

Never mind that it worked, more or less. In April, the number of illegals coming across along the Naco corridor, where the Minutemen were stationed, fell, even if the balloon effect pushed them to other places along Arizona's 350-mile-long border with Mexico. But that's not the story most editors and producers wanted. They wanted to stand up the angle that went something like--no, exactly like--this: Gun-toting vigilantes run amok in the desert, hunting harmless illegals who are only looking for work.

So, you show up in gritty Tombstone, grab somebody wearing a straw hat and a sidearm and work him for the quotes you want. Then you shoot film of the guy wearing his gun, because that's what the producer said in the story meeting, and if you're lucky you get a big grin on the subject's face showing gaps where teeth should be.

I've been a reporter in Arizona for 30 years. As the border story has heated up, I get calls from out-of-town reporters wanting me to hook them up with angry border residents. If I mentioned in a story that a particular rancher carries a gun, that's the rancher the reporters want to see. They're less interested in understanding his problems than getting film of him and his six-shooter.

These border residents are routinely snickered at and called racist vigilantes. But most are decent folks caught up in the daily invasion of illegals who tramp across their land. Ranchers in hard-hit areas spend the first hours of every day repairing damage done the night before. They find fences knocked down and water spigots left on, draining thousands of precious gallons. And then there's the trash: pill bottles, syringes, used needles, and pile after pile of human feces.





Sometimes illegals hammer on residents' windows in the middle of the night, demanding to use the phone. Some even walk right into the ranch house and refuse to leave until the rancher pulls a gun and forces the issue. One rancher told me about illegals who rustled one of her newborn calves. The intruders beat the 12-hour-old animal to death with a fence post, then barbecued it on the spot.
How bad is it? In the Tucson Sector alone in January 2005, the Border Patrol arrested 35,704 people, seized 34,864 pounds of marijuana, and impounded 557 smuggling vehicles. In one month. High-speed chases and accidents on our back-roads are now common. Residents know to stay off certain roads at night because the smugglers--of people and drugs--own them, and if you're not careful they'll come around a bend at 100 mph and run you into a ditch or worse.

In some hilltop spots near Douglas, you can unfold a lawn chair, crack open a Schlitz and watch the invasion happen. As dusk falls, they come, hundreds of headlights from Mexican cabs streaming north, each filled to the windows with soon-to-be illegals. Are they good folks? Are they carrying biological agents? We have no idea. They could be the worst terrorists and thugs. If that sounds alarmist, consider that some ranchers have found Muslim prayer rugs and Arabic dictionaries on their property. And the feds confirm that the ultraviolent Mara Salvatrucha street gang is using Arizona as a gateway into this country.

But you haven't heard much about these problems nationally, because the media soft-pedal them. Why? It's politically incorrect. We've built a new third rail in American life. Leave the harmless illegals alone and go after their victims instead.

I've interviewed a fellow named Bud Strom, a retired Marine and a pretty fair cowboy poet who has a ranch south of Sierra Vista. He tells about a reporter for the New York Times coming out to his place and doing a story on what it's like to live on the border. "The story made it sound like I was out there helping them, giving them water and such," says Bud laughing. In fact, when he sees a group, he wheels his horse and gets out of there fast, then calls the Border Patrol.





Bud knows what he's dealing with. He has had a truck stolen, found bales of drugs on his land, and routinely has illegals approach him demanding beer. It used to be that one or two would ask a local resident for water and a sandwich, and, once fed, be on their way with a polite "Gracias, Señorita." The new breed now comes in groups of 50. They demand to be driven to their pickup spot, and if you refuse they flip you off. Sometimes they poison barking ranch dogs or cut their throats to quiet them. How long do you suppose such outrages would go on in Fairfield, Conn.? Or Greenwich? It'd be a day and a half before some kumbaya-liberal flipped sides and founded the Merritt Parkway Minutemen. Or the BlackBerry Brigade.
The best part of this story is that while the elite media's agenda on the Minutemen played well on the coasts, Arizonans weren't buying it. A poll found that 57% of the state's residents supported the border-watch project, which sent the editorial page of Tucson's Arizona Daily Star into a stammering fit, calling the number alarming. Of course, this is a paper so politically correct it can't even bring itself to call illegals illegals. Its writers refer to them as migrants or, my favorite, border crossers. But as the Minutemen plan to expand operations to five more states--and a new citizen group, the Yuma Patriots, begins patrolling--that 57% heartens me. It looks to me like the rednecks won.

Mr. Banks is a writer in Tucson.

steve, you take a thread where someone has a "change of heart", and post a bunch of one sided news article depicting a mexican citizen doing some hurting on an american? nice tactic.

nowhere does toby say that mexican criminals should be allowed to run rampant through the streets, committing hideous crimes. come on, toss out a smart arguement. because for every Goddamn article you cut and paste, i promise that i can match you with one that an american citizen committed. *****, i will even find the same crime. mexican cop killer? i can find some american doing the same. for bonus points i will even make the american, caucasion.

i grew up on a border town. i was even fluent in spanish for a bit. i would watch the wealthy-er folks driving around with the pickup trucks, going into the hispanic neighborhoods rounding up daylabor. the mexican would pile into the back of the pickup. the guy doing the hiring would sometimes need to physically pull some labor out of the truck, because too many guys jumped in. they were that anxious to work. i promise you he got alot of work done with the relatively small amount of money he paid. there wasnt alot of respect there. i once was digging out a tree root and my neighbor said, "why are you doing that? just hire a bunch of mexicans". even to this day, the going rate for daylabor is $80 to 100 per day. i watch my neighbor do this last month, in order to trench his yard for sprinklers. none of the day labor guys mugged, killed, raped, or robbed anyone that i could tell.

what about the poor ladies working in "maquiladoras" in juarez mexico. they are being murdered by the hundreds. the factories dont do crap about it, (like bus labor) because there is another young woman to take the work position. well maybe this isnt the best point, because these ladies dont matter, they are on the correct side of the border as far as you are concerned. hmm, are these american factories?

No he spews what are racist commets " White Bread"
That is the same as calling a black person a Ni66er.
So who is the racist here.

We are being invaded by law breaker thatis the simple fact.
No paper to be in the USA legally then your a criminal.
It is that simple facts are facts.

My buddys 11 yo son was killed while riding his bike by a Criminal alien who fled back to Mexico.
I have a dog in this hunt.
Leperosy, TB and many other diseases are brought by these invaders and that is also a fact.
We need to seal our borders to keep the invaders out .
I dont care where you are from.
If you are here without permisson you need to deported NOW back to Ireland China Mexiico Canada.
I dont care just send them back.

if you're white, you are an "invader" in north america

of course a couple hundred years seems to have changed perspective.

wonder what the perspective will be in another couple hundred years?

i honestly didnt know that "white bread" was derogatory. i havent said it, but i am glad you mentioned it, so i never do. unless a sandwich is involved.

is it as bad as the Nword? really? i always felt the Nword was the topdog in racist titles, even the sound spews hate. too bad the KKK didnt start off with "pumpernickel bread" or ".brown bread", "burnt bread"? even steven.

steve, i honestly dont know how to slam the doors on the borders, and what it will do to our country in terms of inexpensive bargain labor. who would do the work on california's farms? i love artichokes, but i cant pay $15 dollars for one.

SEE what happen if ya just let'em walk in? :cool:

The Native North American tribes (who were here first, killing each other) should have done a better job of protecting their tribes. That is what you'r e saying, right?

no, what I'm saying is that people like to stop history where it is convenient for them.

Alright then.

But is he "stopping history" or just wanting to protect his digs? (as many of the native americans did)

not stop history, prevent the repeat.

no diseases allowed from across the borders, could relate to ponce de leons nice little dose of smallpox. maybe the bird flu is the new smallpox.

Thing is, we have a culture here that is much different than that of Mexico.

The illegal Mexicans, who are here (and coming here) by, and large, do NOT share in our same culture, customs and goals.

This country will have the most peace thru the idea of a melting-pot . . . not a collage. Look at Canadas prob's with the "French Canadians".

So now, let's just hope those damn psedo-frogs don't start sneaking across our boarder. :cool:

Wait, is "psedo-frogs" worse than "white-bread," but not as bad as nigerian? . .. or is . .. :rolleyes:

no friggen way is "pseudo frog" as bad. that is just crazy talk!

but...."psuedo bread" now that is bad, and you can get beat up throwing that out in a group of....bakers?

V - this is where the problem lies. We live in a welfare state. The social net is set very, very high and it is expensive. If you are poor or broke you are getting free health care, free housing and free education. And you you really think all of these folks are going to go home at age 62 with no social security and medicaid?

Buy the time you are done adding up the social costs - those artichokes are $15! We should pay the real cost of things up-front.

I for one cut my own grass, clean my own house, cook my own food and wash my own car. My view is that my tax dollar is paying for others laziness and sense of entitlment that semi-citizens can be ill treated and underpaid because certain kinds of work is beneath them and their butterball kid on the couch watching TV. If you cannot pay market rates for these services, then tough!

We are a nation of immigrants, that is not going away. But it should be our choice, how many, with what skills and from where. And we who work and uphold the law should not be asked to turn a blind eye to this criminality in front of us every day. Or be considered racist.

BTW; What "race" is Mexican?

eh, what do I know? . ...I'm just one of them damn culturists. ;)

Perhaps those partisan blinders of yours caused you to miss it but your boy bush's plan for SS would allow that mexican to invest that SS money in a 'private' account somewhere.

I wonder if the immigrant will be forced to pay taxes on that money if he cashes it out like a US citizen would?

With a president like bush in office a crazy californa democrat could never compete when it comes to giving the farm away to foreign labor.

Sorry to brust your bubble.
http://www.harbornet.com/folks/theedrich/hive/Kenn-Man/Kennewic.htm