The Church (capitol 'C' denotes the catholic church ;) ) called the theory of evolution ''more than a hypothesis".

Back to your post... do you often need to defend your beliefs against 'Darwinists'? Its not like you can defend your faith with facts. Your faith is based on faith. Do you feel singled out as a Christian? One could use that arguments against all sorts of religion.

Oh, and Darwinism makes you flatulent.

You know, the funny thing is that this isn't what schools are doing. We are ranting and raving here on PPOT (in a very calm fashion) about what's going on in schools and probably very few of us *actually* know what they are teaching.

My son's science class went through the evolution thing last year (8th grade here in Alabama) and they taught both sides. Well, maybe I should say "exposed" the kids to both sides. There was very little actual teaching going on about evolution or creationism due to the extreme sensitivity to the subject, but creationism was very much a part of the curriculum.

So...for all of you wanting "equal time", you should be very pleased with what's actually occuring in the schools.

Mike

Problem is, Creationism has no place in science class. Period.

I agree. I live in Alabama. Most people here seem to believe that it does and "majority rules" is in full effect.

Mike

Just had a thought... Does teaching children, in a state run institution, that creationism is not possible, conflict with separation of church & state?

There's a joke here somewhere... just cant quite put my finger on it... ;)

Oh, I am not Catholic so I did not get it. Guess I should answer "heretic" :)

Singled out? Maybe, it is always Creation vs. Evolution not Buddhism vs. Evolution. Do I care that we are singled out? no.

Faith vs fact questions:

Did Newton have faith that gravity existed before it was fact?

Did Columbus have faith that the world did not end (was flat) before it was fact?

Did the Wright brothers have faith in maned flight before it was fact?

Can you admit that these people defended their FAITH without facts and were later correct?

:)

But there ARE facts in Christianity. At this time sience can not disprove ANY of it. The Christian religion is based on history and fact. The bible is a book of history. The more people look to disprove the bible, the more it's found true.

>So...for all of you wanting "equal time", you should be very pleased with what's actually occuring in the schools.

That may be the case in the Bible belt states...It was that way when I was in high school in North Carolina in the early 90s.

But out here in "open-minded" California, my girlfriend (who is a Christian) teaches fourth grade and she is *strictly* forbidden from ever discussing religion, creationism, or even mentioning the word God. This is not due to any specific law, but due to a small minority of atheist parents who throw a hissy if the existence of God is suggested.

I agree with Moses that a Theology course that covers broad principles of theism would be an acceptable complement to evolutionary science.

You might find this article interesting...

Intelligent Falling

My sister-in-law is a teacher here in San Antonio... She is also strictly forbid.

Basing a set of beliefs on ones own version of history and a book is dangerous. Shouldn't you base your religion on more noble things like love and faith?

:rolleyes: (to the article not you) That is funny. Thanks I needed a good laugh. The only point they may have is that Gravity is not a "fact" yet. We have very good definition of what gravity DOES but we do not yet know what gravity IS.

Huh? Is there a religion NOT based on a book? Doesn't everyone learn history from a book? Isn't it not sound to base ones beliefs on something not disproven? With out recorded history how else would you learn of what happened accuretly?

As an extreme example to make my point... L. Ron Hubbard has written lots of books that would be hard to disprove.

History books show that religion has been more about power and money than what it preaches (peace, love, forgiveness et cetera).

Creationism should never be mentioned in a science classroom, either to support or refute. Pupils can decide matters of faith for themselves without the guidance of a science teacher.

Moses- To you... Is it OK to mention that some believe that some of the gaps in science could be explained by a higher power? AND, that some do not believe we came from apes?

The origins of the universe or the origins of man should not be presented as if they are completely understood. The science teacher who offers evolution as a rebuttal to Christian thought is completely out of line.

It is reasonable to represent evolution as fact, since it is a proveable phenomenon. To conclude than men evolved from apes is a huge leap that is controversial (though generally accepted) in the scientific community. If a science teacher professes to have unlocked the secrets of the origins of man, he is deluded.

Right. Thanks Skip.

Way I see it - as long as the recipient (kids in school ?) is able to comprehend the different basis for these two conclusions (which I doubt kids can), I presume both lines of belief could be legitimate for teaching in school.

Problem is people from the two wings will never fully understand each other. Myself, I believe in the evolution and for me thats based on "facts", where as religious belief is mythology. But I know a believer will turn that around every bit as certain as I am.

I will give the religious wing this: Up till the fraction of time corresponding to the Big Bang might as well been a God involved.