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-   -   Why do liberals seek to limit free speech? (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/off-topic-discussions/255338-why-do-liberals-seek-limit-free-speech.html)

Nathans_Dad 12-09-2005 01:12 PM

I know this will probably be denied by the liberals on the board, but I honestly think it is because conservatives are more polite in general. Conservatives tend to come from the middle of the country or down south where we still have emphasis on southern manners and traditions. Liberals tend to congregate in the coasts where life is much faster and people have a bit less respect for each other. I work with some folks from up north and they tend to be very direct and somewhat loud compared to my southern friends. Doesn't mean they're mean, just different customs. So maybe liberals see shouting someone down as a viable means of discourse whereas conservatives tend to try and let someone speak their piece and then respond.

Flame suit on...

tabs 12-09-2005 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by cool_chick
Coulter was not prevented from doing anything. Free speech was in fact alive and well.

She wants to speak in an inflammatory way, she will pay the consequences for her actions.

Free speech is a beautiful thing......

Like it or not, Joe, the hecklers are ALSO demonstrating free speech.

That's the bummer of free speech to some people...they want people like Coulter, the KKK, etc., to be able to speak freely, but they don't want to deal with the consequences of those actions...

Negativity breeds same. Too bad, so sad, but this is not "silencing" nor "stifling"....what you're seeing here is a consequence of one's actions.....

I know, I know, you don't want some people to have "consequences" for their actions, in this situation, consequences for Coulter's hate-speak...but sorry, that's just how life is.

Hitler couldn't have said it better when he was speaking about the Jews... Great justification there Cool....what ever happened to Civility...instead of Brown Shirt tactics...America is degenerating into 2 ideological camps and neither one is listening to the other anymore.

Shaun @ Tru6 12-09-2005 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Nathans_Dad
I know this will probably be denied by the liberals on the board, but I honestly think it is because conservatives are more polite in general. Conservatives tend to come from the middle of the country or down south where we still have emphasis on southern manners and traditions. Liberals tend to congregate in the coasts where life is much faster and people have a bit less respect for each other. I work with some folks from up north and they tend to be very direct and somewhat loud compared to my southern friends. Doesn't mean they're mean, just different customs. So maybe liberals see shouting someone down as a viable means of discourse whereas conservatives tend to try and let someone speak their piece and then respond.

Flame suit on...

Rick, I've lived in CT, MN, TX, western MA, Boston, Chicago, NYC and visited SF on business enough that I feel qualified to say I've lived there.

Some observations:
CT: gentle, honest-day's-work democrats, conservative fiscally, socially liberal, polite with grace

MN: bend over backwards nice, conservative values, hard-day's-work, easygoing overall, very polite

TX: rough and tumble, macho, but polite. work hard, play hard rowdy

western MA: very liberal, save the world, spend freely doing so, polite but in your face if you aren't one of them.

Boston: mean-spirited, walk fast, talk fast, get the job done, not-in-my-backyard liberalism, hard day's work, solid liberal family values, very sophisticated

Chicago: see MN, add a touch of sophistication.

NYC: for me the ultimate. Take all of the best from above, mix and serve.

SF: work hard play hard, enjoy life, socially very liberal, progressive, looking for the next way to improve the world around them. wonders why the world doesn't see it the way they do, really don't care.

I'm going to need your flame suit I think. Just a few generalizations. :) Tried to be honest.

Mulhollanddose 12-09-2005 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by cool_chick
Yep.

I'm certain Coulter was constipated that night....

Well look what she is chewing on, it would constipate even the strongest stomach.

nostatic 12-09-2005 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by aways
I think we're focussing to much on Coulter as if her treatment was some sort of abberation. I work at a University, and I can tell you that anyone to the right of the far left either isn't invited to speak at all, or if they are, they are usually shouted down by a gaggle of low-lifes. What's particularly galling about these people is that they are always going on and on about "tolerance" and "diversity", etc., but ONLY for people who share their opinions. I think it's a big problem for the society that Universities have become centers of indoctrination rather than centers for learning and the free exchange of ideas.
what university and what is your work? I'm afraid as student, faculty, and staff at a number of colleges and universities that just isn't what I've seen. While there might be a perception of left-leaning, it isn't as overwhelming as the media would lead you to believe. And in fact I see plenty of conversative viewpoints and speakers getting "airtime" on campus.

cool_chick 12-09-2005 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tabs
Hitler couldn't have said it better when he was speaking about the Jews... Great justification there Cool....what ever happened to Civility...instead of Brown Shirt tactics...America is degenerating into 2 ideological camps and neither one is listening to the other anymore.

Hitler?

WTF does Hitler have to do with Coulter getting exactly what she brings on?

cool_chick 12-09-2005 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by aways
By all accounts of the event, the effect of the heckling/screaming/singing was to make continuing the speech impossible..., but you know that.

BTW, I guess you've answered the question of whether you're irrational or disenginouus. It's apparently the former.

Impossible? LOL. Coulter is NOT a victim. She brings it on herself. I do realize that accountability is something that's lost on conservatives of your nature, however.

And regarding your last paragraph, apparently you're mistaken AGAIN.

LOL

Man, is all that you have to offer is ad hominum? You do realize when people have nothing but ad hominum, it's because they can't intelligently counter.

cool_chick 12-09-2005 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Moses
No rational persons definition of free speech includes silencing the free speech of others. Cool Chick is a bright lady. I suspect she was just stirring the pot.
So then you agree hecklers should not be silenced?

cool_chick 12-09-2005 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SoCal911SC
Good grief! You've got to be kidding me.

First, physically preventing someone from speaking is the only way of preventing speech??

Second, and this is the best part, you say that "heckling" has the "purpose to prvent others from airing their opinions," and we're not in China.

That's exactly what the students did to Coulter. Heckled "to prvent her from airing her opinions." Which you find acceptable for people to do to her (in person, none the less), but take insult to someone doing to you, with simple typewritten words on a computer screen.

I thought you were cute AND smart?


We have a person who says stuff like this:

"God gave us the earth. We have dominion over the plants, the animals, the trees. God said, 'Earth is yours. Take it. Rape it. It's yours.'"---Ann Coulter on Hannity & Colmes, 6/20/01

She was fired for making this comment:

To a disabled Vietnam vet: "People like you caused us to lose that war."--- Ann Coulter (MSNBC)

Liberal soccer moms are precisely as likely to receive anthrax in the mail
as to develop a capacity for linear thinking.

We should invade their countries, kill their leaders and convert them to Christianity. We weren't punctilious about locating and punishing only Hitler and his top officers. We carpet-bombed German cities; we killed civilians. That's war. And this is war.

Whenever a liberal begins a statement with 'I don't know which is more frightening,' you know the answer is going to be pretty clear.



And she's not supposed to have consequences of her statements? Let me ask you this, what if this was Michael Moore? What would you guys be saying? Me, I wouldn't change my opinion. Would you? Or would you be cheering those who stood up to a slanderous person who slanders complete strangers?



Edit: and thank you, it's true. :)

cool_chick 12-09-2005 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SoCal911SC
That's precisely what I'm trying to figure out.

When it's Michael Moore or Al Franken giving a lecture and saying equally absurd things, but from the far left, there aren't a bunch of conservatives disrupting him or trying to stop him from expressing himself.

Why is that?


Perhaps it's happened before to one of them. Perhaps this is the first time this happened to a radical extremist righty.....

If you honestly believe all "conservatives" are "one way" and all "liberals" are "another way" then, I'm very sorry for you. You cannot possibly believe that to be true......

cool_chick 12-09-2005 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SoCal911SC
I'm not saying all.

But MOST of the time, it seems to be liberals disrupting conservative speeches. That's what I observed in my 7 years of college and grad school, and continue to observe today.

No one seems to disagree with that observation.

(Pretty weak try on setting up a straw man BTW - geez, the liberals here have really been off their game the past month or so. Very unimpressive).

I wasn't "setting up a strawman..." That's what you're implying, no? If not, then please, what exactly are you saying?

I don't know if I would say that either...I can't say either way whether "one side" disrupts the "other side" speeches lots more than the "other side" does to the "one side" or not. I have absolutely no data to substantiate that claim either way. To study that accurately, one would have to analyze across the country..there are conservative areas and liberal areas. Would a conservative in a liberal area be heckled, and alternatively, would a liberal in a conservative area be heckled?

I remember plenty of heckling for Kerry (none for Bush though......but that's because they screened who attended and wouldn't let anyone who wasn't a registered Republican attend....)

So in sum, unless you can prove that statement, it's not an accurate statement...it's just a "feeling" you have....

And, just curious, what "liberals" are you referring to in your post?

cool_chick 12-09-2005 04:34 PM

Quote:

When it's Michael Moore or Al Franken giving a lecture and saying equally absurd things, but from the far left, there aren't a bunch of conservatives disrupting them or trying to stop them from expressing themselves.
Whaaaaaa?

http://wildcat.arizona.edu/papers/98/36/01_2.html

Small groups in the crowd constantly heckled Moore during his speech, and he took it lightheartedly at first, using it as an opportunity to sarcastically respond to their political views, until it became so disruptive he told them directly to stop.

Tobra 12-09-2005 04:59 PM

Okay, that is one example, must happen plenty though

Quote:

Originally posted by cool_chick
So then you agree hecklers should not be silenced?
Clearly that was not what he was saying, hopefully you are cute

fintstone 12-10-2005 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by SoCal911SC
....

(Pretty weak try on setting up a straw man BTW - geez, the liberals here have really been off their game the past month or so. Very unimpressive).

Have to agree. It is hard to find one post lately where they actually have a lucid thought....although the brighter ones seem to be staying away (don't want to be associated with the gross ignorance). It makes even responding a waste of time. For example, equating a random heckler or a protester with well planned groups who actually drown out the speech of another is just silly....much less excusing actual assault against speakers. Based on the big talk about freedom of speech that one usually hears from liberals...you would think that they would be even more aghast about such tactics than conservatives...but I guess it is really just talk. As usual, with the libs...the end justifies the means.

tabs 12-10-2005 11:45 AM

Don't U Get It
 
Quote:

Originally posted by cool_chick
Hitler?

WTF does Hitler have to do with Coulter getting exactly what she brings on?

Hitler used the same self JUSTIFICATION about violating the CIVIL RIGHTS of the Jews in Germany..."The jews are getting exactly what they bring on" Nothing new under the sun my little Nazi friend.... Simply Goon Squad Tactics...

cool_chick 12-10-2005 11:54 AM

Re: Don't U Get It
 
Quote:

Originally posted by tabs
Hitler used the same self JUSTIFICATION about violating the CIVIL RIGHTS of the Jews in Germany..."The jews are getting exactly what they bring on" Nothing new under the sun my little Nazi friend.... Simply Goon Squad Tactics...

Yes, the same justification it appears you're using to quelch the hecklers (as Hitler would've done, and you condone). I see now.

Very nazi-like of you, I agree.

Capitalism, free market, free speech are foreign concepts to you huh...as heckling is proof of all of this!

tabs 12-10-2005 11:58 AM

Re: Re: Don't U Get It
 
Quote:

Originally posted by cool_chick
Yes, the same justification it appears you're using to quelch the hecklers (as Hitler would've done, and you condone). I see now.

Very nazi-like of you, I agree.

JAAA....Maybe you and I can go Goose Stepping down the Strip when U come in March....Liebschen...LOL

cool_chick 12-10-2005 12:00 PM

Re: Re: Re: Don't U Get It
 
Quote:

Originally posted by tabs
JAAA....Maybe you and I can go Goose Stepping down the Strip when U come in March....Liebschen...LOL

LOL

Me, I love freedom! Good and bad side of it (this is the negative side of it...but it's a beautiful thing nonetheless)!

Why don't you get busy and make some gulags for those who voice dissent. Don't forget to include those who heckled Moore's speech too....

tabs 12-10-2005 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tabs
.America is degenerating into 2 ideological camps and neither one is listening to the other anymore.
Weren't you listening....Liebschen!

cool_chick 12-10-2005 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tabs
Weren't you listening....Liebschen!
Actually, it's been like that for the history of the country.....

You should take a look at past eras...people even protested WWI....

Christmas was banned for 22 years in the 1800s.


Nothing's changed....except the TV throws it in your face now...makes you think the world is ending, puts fear of the "boogie man" into Americans.....

Get cracking on that gulag bud.....


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