Let's off Granma!

[Isabo]

In the damaging car thread: Revenge after someone damages your car?
The subject of old people being a waste of space was raised. With the increase in life spans and improving health the aged are becoming a serious problem with the working population having to take on more of the burden every year.
The old extended family has almost disappeared. Pension ages are being raised. Many have made little or no provision for their old age, manyu have been unable too.
I made a stupid comment that I was doing my part by smoking and drinking so I'd die early and not be a burden. However, I don't see any solutions, never mind politically correct ones. We can hardly take Granma for a day's fishing on the ice and leave her there like the eskimos used too and we can't afford to maintain an aging population.
Comments, opinions?

[Isabo]

Disclaimer. My parents and in-laws have all passed away so I don't need a personal solution.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Minimum age limit for Florida, say 65? Make it a retirement state. A state full of over 65 drivers, I think the problem would take care of itself.

[livi]

In several countries in Africa they are faced with the opposite problem. Big part of the grown population dying from AIDS. Only children left.

In any case I suspect the human race are running toward self destruction at a frightening pace.

If we don´t kill ourselves or our fellow citizens we´ll kill the planet.

I am an optimist though...

Any snow in I Italy, BTW ?

[Joeaksa]

Anyone else see 60 minutes last week where the scientist wants to extend people's life to 500 years? Says he can end our organs and such from failing and that there should be no reason not to live as long.

Personally 100 or so is enough for me... Mom and Dad both made it to 80 or a bit higher and do not need to go too much higher.

Joe A

[Isabo]

Originally posted by livi


Any snow in I Italy, BTW ?

Yes! and I am fed up with it.

[Dixie]

Disclaimer. My parents and in-laws have all passed away so I don't need a personal solution.

You do need a personal solution. One day it will be you. Give it time...

[livi]

Fed up... No ****!

At least your roads are blessed with a salt free surface, right ?

[Dixie]

Personally 100 or so is enough for me...

Why do I think the answer will be different when you're 99?

[pwd72s]

Originally posted by Isabo
Disclaimer. My parents and in-laws have all passed away so I don't need a personal solution.

When you find yourself missing the "old folks" at family gatherings, you begin to realize that you are one of the "old folks" now.

[Isabo]

To all who suggested I may need a personal solution in the future.
No, my personal situation is such that I'm not worried financially now or in the future. What would frighten me is being kept alive when old and decrepid. For me it's about quality of life.
However, not everyone is as lucky as me in material terms. The problem remains, what can society do about the rising aged population?
Milu and Tabs: Please don't reply that we should invest in retirement homes

[turbo6bar]

I have mentioned this plan before. I hope it finds some traction. Send the boomers and aging population to Mexico. Flood the borders. Put $1000 in the pocket of every able-bodied old fart and send them south. Mexicans are crushing the infrastructure in many states. It is time we give Mexico equivalent medicine.

I'm going to take a 2x4 after my parents, and my reluctance to take medicine or see doctors should do me in by 65-70. I currently see little reason to go further.

[oldE]

I might point out the 'age 65 retirement' idea came about in a time when that was the average life expectancy. We have created the problem by adhering to this arbitrary figure, or reducing the number, in the face of better health and potential productivity in persons over 65.
Many 'seniors' in response have taken to volunteering as a way to keep active and alert after being forced out of the workplace. Isa, I don't know what it is like in Italia, but around here, many organizations which improve the overall quality of life on our communities rely heavily upon the hard work of those a generation older than I.
Having said that, I will also note there seem to be two kinds of 'seniors'. There are those you are lucky to catch at home, because it is just a place to hang their hat and sleep while getting on with the business of life and there are those who are just putting in time before their big dirt nap. I suppose the same could be said about many of us.
Les

[Moses]

Originally posted by turbo6bar
I currently see little reason to go further.

I'm pretty sure time will force you to revisit that idea.

[turbo6bar]

Originally posted by Moses
I'm pretty sure time will force you to revisit that idea.

I'm hoping someone will revisit my proposal.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Get rid of the arcane laws based on even more arcane religious beliefs that prohibit suicide. Most people know when they're being a burden and have lived out their life. When my grandma was in her last months/years she said flat-out that she knew she was just waiting for the reaper to come and she hoped it would be sooner rather than later lingering on in a lousy quality of life and being a burden to everyone else. She said she still valued being able to see the other members of the family each day she lingered, but other than that, was content with the life she'd lived.

Now, I think that's one of the most selfless ways of looking at one's situation. If I ever find myself there, unable to do much of anything for myself, I think I'll say my goodbyes and make my peace with whoever is around me (family and friends), and take the pill and fade in to a peaceful hereafter. What's wrong with it? Those that oppose giving people this OPTION (not mandatory) I find to have religious "wacko-dom" as the root source of their beliefs (only god gives life so only god should take it - you know, the Terri Schaivo wacko crowd).

Personally I think if we had "suicide booths" like in Futurama maybe it wouldn't be such a bad thing. Too many people on the planet as it is. None of us ASKED to be brought into this world; least we can do is have some personal discretion over when we choose to leave it and when we've accomplished what we're going to in our own lives. Either it can be done humanely and peacefully and with a minimum of suffering to others or by sticking a gun barrel in one's mouth and blowing their own brains out.

More example of the RR f*cking up what really should be something reserved for common sense.

[Isabo]

Now we're starting to get to the heart of the matter.
Who decides when it's time for someone to go: That's a whole can of worms from euthanasia to ethnic cleansing and related purging of the gene pool.
What criteria would you use for yourself? My own would be when I'm no longer self sufficient or started to get heavy medical problems. I would want to be out of it before I became a burden. I have had a mostly very good life and death no longer frightens me, pain, lingering illness and the thought of being a burden does.

[turbo6bar]

tongue in cheek.

It comes down to society caring for the elderly or individuals caring for their own family. My parents took care of me, and I will take care of them.

I don't have some illusion that quality of life is great when I'm popping pills and have bones like jello. I feel alive when I partake in activities, so when I can no longer partake in any activities, I believe it is my time to go. I would not choose suicide, but if given the option to take some miracle drug or go softly, I'll go softly (or loudly, if the case may be).

I agree with PoP and Isabo. More drugs and medical advances mean we might live till year 3000, but does the act of breathing indicate you are really alive. If you need an orderly to wipe your ass, are you really alive? I'm not implying offing the elderly, but I think this grave-avoidance-at-all-costs must have some reasonable boundaries. The one approaching death must make the ultimate decision.

[Dixie]

To all who suggested I may need a personal solution in the future. No, my personal situation...

You still miss my point. So let me drop being subtle.

When you refer to older people living much longer, and being a "burden", you are not talking about people who are currently in their seventies. Heck, you are not even talking about people who are in there forties. People of this age will not live long enough to reap that much return from modern medicine.

Who you unknowingly refer to is YOURSELF. Especially if you're less than thirty. THIS is the generation that will benefit from DNA-based-medicine. This is the generation that will easily see140 year life spans.

Oh sure, you think you'll only live to be sixty-five or seventy. But it's much, much, more likely that you'll surpass the century mark by a wide margin. Leaving other to wish you'd kick off...

[Jared at Pelican Parts]

"put her in the movies!"