The Myth of the Math and Science Shortage

[onewhippedpuppy]

Originally posted by Rodeo
Oops, Now I'm responding to a post that no longer exists!

I must say I think the tragedy of the commons is precisely on topic, for practically anything Pat posts. In fact, we have been over this before, and reached the conclusion that Pat is not so much a libertarian as he is an anarchist.

He does not care one wit what happens after all of federal, state and local government is abolished. As far as I can tell, he has never posted a single word on the topic of what his world would look like if he had his way.

My guess is that loincloth would come back into style.

For once I agree with Rodeo, what is this world coming to? Google NASA innovations, NASA inventions, etc, you'll find pages of things that NASA invented that benefit our daily lives. Here's one example:

http://space.about.com/od/toolsequipment/ss/apollospinoffs.htm

CAT scans, kidney dialisis, a method of food service for hospitals, and a cardiovascular conditioner used by athletes. Not that it will matter for Pat. Hey Pat, doesn't the irony of the internet kill you? You are using it to post your anarchist, anti-establishment rants, but it was originally developed by the US government for, gasp, military use! Do as I say, and not as I do, right?

[Tim Hancock]

WTF? This is like bizarro world, I am actually in agreement with Nostatic and Thom on an issue that usually would get mired in political leanings!

Looks like SloPat is reaching RedUfo status in pelican OT!

[Rodeo]

If I were in agreement with you guys, I still wouldn't admit it publicly

[dhoward]

Wouldn't anarchy be bad?
I mean, a lot of people don't like spiders....

[VaSteve]

Originally posted by IROC
You imply that NASA writes laws? Interesting.

I stand by my statements. I think space exploration is a noble way to spend taxpayer's money.

Mike

It puts a sexy face on science. More so than some egghead working equations ala Good Will Hunting. That's what gets a lot of people in the door. Fear factor surely isn't...

[fastpat]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by IROC
You imply that NASA writes laws? Interesting.[/quo9te]

Don't be a silly goose, I've implied no such thing. When I write they have written laws the normal legislative process is understood, unless your obtuse, you knew that.

I stand by my statements. I think space exploration is a noble way to spend taxpayer's money.

Mike

There are no noble ways to spend taxpayer's money, it's a product of theft just like that of a armed bank robber. The bank robber is more honest though, he makes no pretense of doing anything other than stealing money.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by Superman
Lincoln was a sociopathic monster.

Which is easily proven.

There is no shortage of American engineers and scientists.

Obviously.

What next? The moon is made of green cheese?

You'll have better luck showing that the earth is flat, you can start that now.

It's like Dubya's gambit. If he'd found WMD, he could have been the genius of all geniuses. He's thrown the dice on a DISTANT longshot. And lost.

Pat, we'll think you're smarter if you STOP espousing these obviously incorrect theories.

Go with the flat earth proof, it'll be easier for you.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by Rodeo
Oops, Now I'm responding to a post that no longer exists!

I must say I think the tragedy of the commons is precisely on topic, for practically anything Pat posts. In fact, we have been over this before, and reached the conclusion that Pat is not so much a libertarian as he is an anarchist.

He does not care one wit what happens after all of federal, state and local government is abolished. As far as I can tell, he has never posted a single word on the topic of what his world would look like if he had his way.

My guess is that loincloth would come back into style.

Of all the balderdash I've seen here this takes the cake. You have the temerity to assign all that is good and permanent about American culture to government.

That's a heinous statement. Governments, the US and many in europe, have been the most deadly entity mankind has ever known. And you think that all good is a result of government.

How dare you make such a statement.

More people were murdered by governments in the 20th century by governments than by petty criminals by a magnitude of at least 100, perhaps as much as 500 fold.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by wludavid
Sorry Rodeo.

Here's the link I had posted before: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons

While I sympathize with small-gov't proponents, hard core libertarians have never really explained how to deal with things that benefit all, but individuals cannot be excluded from: the Commons.

Yes they have, you apparently don't want to find out.

[fastpat]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by onewhippedpuppy
For once I agree with Rodeo, what is this world coming to? Google NASA innovations, NASA inventions, etc, you'll find pages of things that NASA invented that benefit our daily lives.[/aquote]

Were you aware that a large amount of medical science was accumulated from a variety of socialist governments during the 1930's and 1940's? All by governments, no the research subjects weren't willing, particularly the children that were experimented on. But, those data are there for anyone to use to this day.

Here's one example:

http://space.about.com/od/toolsequipment/ss/apollospinoffs.htm

CAT scans, kidney dialisis, a method of food service for hospitals, and a cardiovascular conditioner used by athletes. Not that it will matter for Pat. Hey Pat, doesn't the irony of the internet kill you? You are using it to post your anarchist, anti-establishment rants, but it was originally developed by the US government for, gasp, military use! Do as I say, and not as I do, right?

All were done by private industry, government did none of that. Want to compare your list to the level of research that could have been done were 40 to 80 percent of the money not wasted on administrative costs, graft, and useless research grants.

No, I thought not.

Every time, EVERY TIME, someone wants government out of business where they have no business, and no Constitutional authorization, these goodnessess are trotted out like a trick pony.

It's as much garbage today as it was 40 plus years ago when it was done.

[Rodeo]

Originally posted by fastpat
Of all the balderdash I've seen here this takes the cake. You have the temerity to assign all that is good and permanent about American culture to government.

That's a heinous statement. Governments, the US and many in europe, have been the most deadly entity mankind has ever known. And you think that all good is a result of government.

How dare you make such a statement.

More people were murdered by governments in the 20th century by governments than by petty criminals by a magnitude of at least 100, perhaps as much as 500 fold.

Ok, I'll take the bait. I said nothing about the government being the source of "all that is good." Seems like you set up a straw man, hoping to divert attention from what I actually did say.

I said you were an anarchist, that you wanted to dismantle the government, and that you had "never posted a single word on the topic of what his world would look like" if your vision became a reality. What of law and order? The environment? National defense? What happens to the poor, the handicapped? How are the financial markets controlled? What of the courts? What happens to individual liberty?

You still haven't begun to tell us what your dream looks like. You can continue to rant that the government must be destroyed, but until you have some vision of what happens next, your rants will be just that.

[Flatbutt1]

As an aging,white,male scientist I can tell you as a fact of my daily life that our industry is dominated, DOMINATED, by foreign nationals. Asians are by far the most numerous followed by Indians and then Europeans.

Shortage of US scientists? You bet, at least within the medicinal field.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by Flatbutt1
As an aging,white,male scientist I can tell you as a fact of my daily life that our industry is dominated, DOMINATED, by foreign nationals. Asians are by far the most numerous followed by Indians and then Europeans.

Shortage of US scientists? You bet, at least within the medicinal field.

So, you would force American born men and women to go into math and the sciences?

The assertion is that there is no shortage of mathmaticians and scientists, not that there is a shortage or non-shortage of American born people in those fields.

[rcecale]

Originally posted by Rodeo
I said you were an anarchist, that you wanted to dismantle the government, and that you had "never posted a single word on the topic of what his world would look like" if your vision became a reality. What of law and order? The environment? National defense? What happens to the poor, the handicapped? How are the financial markets controlled? What of the courts? What happens to individual liberty?

C'mon Pat, enquiring minds wanna know!

Randy

[fastpat]

Originally posted by Rodeo
Ok, I'll take the bait. I said nothing about the government being the source of "all that is good." Seems like you set up a straw man, hoping to divert attention from what I actually did say.

Let's clear this up then.

I said you were an anarchist

As I've stated, I am an anarchist, all libertarians end up anarchists if they're true to the non-aggression principle.

that you wanted to dismantle the government, and that you had "never posted a single word on the topic of what his world would look like" if your vision became a reality.

Of course I haven't. Why would I do that? Better yet, apply yourself to figuring out why I've not supplied that answer. Actually, I have answered, you haven't listened.

What of law and order? The environment? National defense? What happens to the poor, the handicapped? How are the financial markets controlled? What of the courts? What happens to individual liberty?

Who really supplies all of that now? Certainly not government.

You still haven't begun to tell us what your dream looks like. You can continue to rant that the government must be destroyed, but until you have some vision of what happens next, your rants will be just that.

Nothing I've said is a rant. You have the answer.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by rcecale
C'mon Pat, enquiring minds wanna know!

Randy

Of course you do.

I'll simply tell what Murray Rothbard said when asked a similar question, No man should have to answer this question more than 500 times during his lifetime, therefore I shall not answer.

Professor Rothbard had more patience on this than I do.

Frankly, the answer is already in your possession, and more is for the asking, in the right place and time.

[rcecale]

I must say, Pat, you're quite the piece of work. For someone who posts as much as you do, it's amazing you rarely post an original thought.

Every day, usually several times a day, you post commentary from your icon Rockwell and his gang over at his website. And when asked for your own point of view on something, the reply is either another statement from one or another of your icons, or some vague attempt at insult, or a combination of both.

Q: Tell me, Pat, do you feel like a sheep?
A: "Nahh-h-h-h-h..."

Randy

[Flatbutt1]

Originally posted by fastpat
The assertion is that there is no shortage of mathmaticians and scientists, not that there is a shortage or non-shortage of American born people in those fields.

"...Thus does the President want to spend $50 billion over 10 years � a figure these people made up out of whole cloth � and we are all supposed to submit, cough up, and turn our sons and daughters into natural-science brainiacs. And the President is just sure that his great job-training mission is not limited to Silicon Valley but extends to all cities, rural areas, and ghettos in America..".


Whose sons and daughters are being referred to above?

[fastpat]

Originally posted by Flatbutt1
"...Thus does the President want to spend $50 billion over 10 years � a figure these people made up out of whole cloth � and we are all supposed to submit, cough up, and turn our sons and daughters into natural-science brainiacs. And the President is just sure that his great job-training mission is not limited to Silicon Valley but extends to all cities, rural areas, and ghettos in America..".


Whose sons and daughters are being referred to above?

You got the point, but didn't know what to do with it.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Originally posted by rcecale
I must say, Pat, you're quite the piece of work. For someone who posts as much as you do, it's amazing you rarely post an original thought.

Every day, usually several times a day, you post commentary from your icon Rockwell and his gang over at his website. And when asked for your own point of view on something, the reply is either another statement from one or another of your icons, or some vague attempt at insult, or a combination of both.

Q: Tell me, Pat, do you feel like a sheep?
A: "Nahh-h-h-h-h..."

Randy

You nailed it, the man is incapable of a rational, yes or no answer. When questioned he dances around the topic, often attempting to spin off on another tangent, or avoid the issue all together by insulting those that question him. Are you sure you're not a lawyer? You could have presented some brilliant Johnny Cochran-esque defenses. Furthermore, every topic is an incendiary rant by some nut with no credibility that Pat represents as a fact from a reliable source.

On the plus side, you have managed to bring the normally divided OT together. It's nice for everybody to have something to agree on when arguing against you on your threads.