Pools - switching from chlorine to saline

[johnco]

I see the auto fill thingies, or used to, all the time. almost everyone is tied up, jammed shut or disabled. they hang up and the water keeps filling.. and filling. a couple days running and your water bill is $$$$ more than usual. something to think about! leave your garden hose running in the pool over night by accident like I've done a couple times and your yard, the neighbor's yard... flooded. in my case, it's during an install and the pool floats up or sinks down and there's a day or two extra work digging out, jacking it up and releveling. I've learned (except for yesterday) not only to turn off the hose, but pull it out of the pool just to be sure. not fun driving up the next day and the pool is 5 inches lower on one side than it was yesterday when I started adding water

[boba]

I have had auto fill unit on both of my salt water pools, from 1988 till present and have not had a problem once. As stated it is a much like a toilet float plumed into a water source. Not expensive if done at time of build.

[Jims5543]

John - if you had my mind you would want to take your chances with the float.

I cannot count how many times I have flooded the back yard. I ahve also followed that by forgetting to turn off the back wash and emptying the pool, then over filling it again.

I now set the timer on the stove and tell eveyone in the house I am filling the pool and the timer is on.

Food for thought though about the auto filler.

[johnco]

I probably see more pools since it's what I do for a living and not trying to say they aren't useful. I've just seen way too many that malfunctioned. since it rains so damn much down here, people are usually draining water, not filling. now the thing I want is the timer that hooks to your hose that shuts it off after setting how many hours you want to run it. since I pretty much do 99.9% of the work myself installing pools, I get too busy and forget the water running way too often

[red-beard]

My Pool company was charging an extra $3500 for the Salt System. I priced it as my discount place and I can get the same system for $2000. We'll run the chlorine/Ozone for a bit before I jump over to to salt.

[johnco]

sheese, I don't get enough. I only charge $1200 installed.

[red-beard]

No wonder you're busy!

[sammyg2]

I drained my pool this weekend.
The hardness was over 800 ppm and I have a bunch of black algae staining, so i bit the bullet.

I power-washed the whole pool (lower pressure setting) and have chlorine-washed the stains.

So what's next? Chlorine wash the whole pool, acid-wash, or just re-fill? i don't want that black algae coming back, it's a beotch.

[red-beard]

I've had problems for years with yellow algae. I finally started copper sulfate late last year. POOF! Gone.

Acid Wash then chlorine wash. You need to scrub. Take a read through the link below. Mechanical cleaning is needed to kill black algae. Prevention will be chemicals.

Swimming Pool Algae Information Page - Page 2 Algae Info Continued

And the Copper Sulfate works against black algae. The liquid isn't too expensive, but I think you can buy copper sulfate crystals and mix it up in water. If you need to worry about blue stains (while plaster) mix it in a 5 gallon bucket. I have a blue colored Diamond Brite "plaster" so blue staining isn't an issue. I pour it directly into water.

[red-beard]

I don't know why, but the guys around here with salt water pools are the ones with black algae problems.

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by red-beard

My Pool company was charging an extra $3500 for the Salt System. I priced it as my discount place and I can get the same system for $2000. We'll run the chlorine/Ozone for a bit before I jump over to to salt.

9 years later, I still haven't switched. I am installing a VFD. I say installing because the Hayward Tristar I installed on Friday was dead. A new one is coming on Monday.

Based on the VFD calculations, the energy savings in less than one year is equal to the price difference. And my electric prices are $0.079/kWh! $775 vs. $539. By running the motor slower, the power drops off, but the flow drops off more slowly.

[Charles Freeborn]

Would love to convert my hot tub to saline. I guess I'll check with manufacturer to see if the plumbing can handle it?

[Skillet83]

Hey Red. We discussed a while back, but coming up on year 5 with an ozone system. Use a chlorinator on the back side. Easiest pool I have ever had. Virtually zero chemical costs. I add a little granular chlorine when I know I have a heavy swim load coming, a little liquid copper based algecide once a month. No irritation of eyes, water stays crystal clear. I am completely sold on ozone. Working with a 40K gallon pool.

[gshase]

Did it here ,
easy and very close to maintenance free.....
CircuPool® SJ-20 Salt Pool System

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by Skillet83

Hey Red. We discussed a while back, but coming up on year 5 with an ozone system. Use a chlorinator on the back side. Easiest pool I have ever had. Virtually zero chemical costs. I add a little granular chlorine when I know I have a heavy swim load coming, a little liquid copper based algecide once a month. No irritation of eyes, water stays crystal clear. I am completely sold on ozone. Working with a 40K gallon pool.

My pool is also Ozone (bulb type). I think I'd like to replace it with a serious ozone machine.

[Gus Berges]

Never owned a pool until I had one built a couple of years ago for a property I rent. It was not until now that I learned that the unit itself is a "disposable" item after 2-5 years worth of use. Apparently the electrodes are a sacrificial type of element. Keep that in mind when comparing cost of ownership and which product to buy. In my case, I need to replace the entire item at a cost of nearly $1,000 every 3 years, but a buddy of mine has the ability to replace just the electrodes at $350 each.

[Cajundaddy]

Protip: A salt water pool IS a chlorinated pool with all the associated drawbacks and benefits. It simply uses electricity to separate chlorine and sodium hydroxide from salt water as it passes through the cell. It then oxidizes contaminants and turns back into salt. You still need to test and adjust water balance, add shock treatments periodically, and replenish the salt in the pool.

Plus:
- continuous chlorination any time the filter system is running.
- lower chlorine costs
- pretty reliable when away from home
- less noticeable chlorine taste and smell if carefully monitored and balanced.

Minus:
- Expensive to buy and maintain. Usually far more $$ than just buying chlorine over 5 years.
- Requires the addition of a lot more acid to balance pH. Maybe 10x as much.
- Salt pools are corrosive to pool equipment and pool materials. Shorter life span.

Salt/chlorinated pools are a viable option but not a magic pill. Water must still be carefully filtered, tested, and balanced or the neglected salt pool will look just as ugly as a neglected chlorine tabs pool. Whatever method you choose, test and balance your water weekly for a pool that always looks and feels great.

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by red-beard

9 years later, I still haven't switched. I am installing a VFD. I say installing because the Hayward Tristar I installed on Friday was dead. A new one is coming on Monday.

Based on the VFD calculations, the energy savings in less than one year is equal to the price difference. And my electric prices are $0.079/kWh! $775 vs. $539. By running the motor slower, the power drops off, but the flow drops off more slowly.

The second install took 20 minutes. Fired right up. I need to do some additional wiring and control reprogramming to make it a "2 speed" pump. If I add in some extra 120VAC relays, I can add more speeds, up to 8. I can't see the need for more than 3 or 4.

Regular - 1000 rpm rpm
Pool cleaner - 2000 rpm
Spa - 2500 rpm
Max - 3450 rpm

I can even combine pool cleaner and spa.

[Cajundaddy]

Originally Posted by sammyg2

I drained my pool this weekend.
The hardness was over 800 ppm and I have a bunch of black algae staining, so i bit the bullet.

I power-washed the whole pool (lower pressure setting) and have chlorine-washed the stains.

So what's next? Chlorine wash the whole pool, acid-wash, or just re-fill? i don't want that black algae coming back, it's a beotch.

Black algae shows up because of inadequate filtration and sanitation.
1. Make sure your filter is clean and in good working order.
2. Make sure you turn over (filter) the entire pool water volume every day.
3. Keep pH balanced and cl2 at 5-10ppm for a full year to kill off the established algae roots.

If your pump and filter are 20+ years old, replace it with modern filtration gear.

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by red-beard

The second install took 20 minutes. Fired right up. I need to do some additional wiring and control reprogramming to make it a "2 speed" pump. If I add in some extra 120VAC relays, I can add more speeds, up to 8. I can't see the need for more than 3 or 4.

Regular - 1000 rpm rpm
Pool cleaner - 2000 rpm
Spa - 2500 rpm
Max - 3450 rpm

I can even combine pool cleaner and spa.

Setting are now

Regular - 1200 rpm rpm
Pool cleaner - 2600 rpm
Spa - 2600 rpm
Max - 3450 rpm

Power as indicated on the pump is 10-12% lower than in the Hayward calculator. This may be occurring because I have a larger cartridge filter and it is recently cleaned. Pressure gauge at the filter is reading around 6 PSIG (15 ft head) at 2600 RPM. From the pump flow diagram, this would indicate about 95 GPM flow.

I need to get my Fluke current meter and verify the power readings.