10 mph? What are you following, a girl on her Barbie bike? Cyclists typically move between 20-25 mph, and in heavy traffic often are faster than the cars on the street. I don't see many cyclists riding around the city however I understand the position of a automobile driver, especially when you loose patience in heavy traffic and need to go somewhere, but I've also ridden thousands of miles on the streets of L.A. when I was younger - raced for years as a licensed USCF cyclist, so I know the mentality of cyclists when comes to staying alive. Riding in the steets of Los Angeles takes some balls, and most of us will in general try to move over or ride in that gap between the parked cars lane and the lane next to it, IF there's room and we 'feel' that the drivers behind us aren't going to plow us over into a parked car or into the curb. But manuvering like this takes quick thinking and constant reevaluation of the risks around you to your life vs consideration to the cars around you, not unlike racing or riding a motorcycle in L.A. streets. It's not your life at stake but his. Like people, most in general are good, but you never know when some Asian lady with dental floss around her eyes will plow into you with her new BMW 540.

Reminds me of when I was commuting to Podiatry school in SF.

Got hit by a mortuary student in a Nissan 4x4 one time, actually I hit his RF fender when he turned up onto the side walk to bypass some traffic backed up at a light. He was a white guy, no stitches, broken spoke on rear wheel. I was going about 25-30 mph down a hill between the stopped traffic and the cars parked along the side, so I guess that was my bad sort of. I flew about 25 feet, tumbled instead of hitting anything else and ended up flat on my back. Could wiggle my toes so I figured I was okay, rolled out of the road so I did not get run over.

An asian lady talking on her cell phone and driving a big mercedes sedan ran a light and I sort of T boned her at front tire of car. Went over her hood, broke the bottom bracket on my Raleigh mountain bike. She was gone before I could get the license. Thank goodness for lifetime warrantees on frames :D

Had a taxi bump me that was going the same direction as me in traffic. He almost crushed me against a parked car. When I caught up to him at the light, I busted in his passenger side front window with a Kryptonite lock and started cussing his middle eastern ass. He and his fare in the back looked pretty scared, did not hang around long.

Surprised I never got hurt commuting 7 miles a day round trip on the bicycle, did it for 3 years. I was an aggressive defensive driver. Had thighs bigger than my waist, which made it hard to find blue jeans.

Let me preface by saying I used to commute on bike across town ~13mile each way Yeah, I noticed that every techno-colored-spandex-wear'n cyclist thinks he is going that fast. . . and is most likely thinking he is Lance freaking Armstrong. But trust me on this, they are not that fast.

Furthermore, if you were driving say, a lawn tractor at 17mph . .er "20 - 25 mph" I'll bet your instincts would tell you to get the hell off the road. Somehow tho, because your putting so much effort into the spin, you get fooled into thinking you're making acceptable speed. You are not.

When I bike, I stay off the main roads as much as possible. I wish more would do the same. Yet, too many are too busy asserting their ownership of "slow -but spinning hard" on an otherwise fast road.

I am fortunate to have a commute where all but about 100 feet of my 20+ mile roundtrip has a bike lane, which is what I ride on.

I do not hold up traffic, well except for the Middle Aged Asian Ladies slowing down to remove dental floss and check out my ass ;)

My point is, bad drivers come in any ilk. Observe for a week and see for yourself.

I've driven forklifts, backhoes, and Caterpillar loaders on the streets before, and I feel like getting off the road not because I'm holding up traffic but feel like I could plow into a car with the bucket at any time ... but I digress - That driver mentality is what cyclists most fear, it really doesn't matter how fast or slow the cyclist is going, but his 'assertion' is his self perservation instinct at work. If you spent enough time cycling on the street, you would understand. Most streets have more than one lane - go around.

'Asserting his space on the road' and 'self perservation instinct' are at odds. IMO.

For some strange reason, bicyclists think that "Share the road" means "give me space on this road (built for cars) to do my exercise and Tour de France fantasy."

I'm actually kinda surprised the cyclist haven't started a "Share the sidewalk" campaign, as well. Don't those slow moving ped's know better than to get out of the way? sheesh . .all they do is hold-up the superior bicyclist. :rolleyes:

Herein is the problem. If cyclists abided to your philosophy, there would be more accidents as described above with the offensive and bad drivers of the road.

How's that?

Think about it, your generalization about cyclists is no different than the title of this thread. To an automobile driver with such an attitude, all cyclists are slower than their car and are in the way. So if these 'slow moving peds' were to get out of the way, what part of the street should they be riding on?

In your attitude, which is pervasive throughout most of the traffic I've ridden in. The funny thing is the motorist who would subconsciously like to - I don't know - possibly ram his/her car into a cyclist who momentarily delays their progress, certainly does shrink to a meek level and proceeds to wear a pathetic smile once that same cyclist they wanted to run down, stops beside beside them at the next red light.

to clarify: ped's (pedestrians) . . .the hypocrisy of bicyclists to want the slower moving ped's to make way, on the sidewalk (designed for pedestrians) yet have no regard for cars/drivers who want them to stay to the side . .. make way.

a cyclist who momentarily delays my progress doesn't bother me a bit. It's the one who feel a need to "Asserting his space on the road' (or sidewalk) that piss me off. Impeding traffic is not legal, yet the Lance Armstrong think-they-bees seem have a need to control cars/traffic . . that they are going fast enough, and damit, they have a RIGHT. :rolleyes: A little bit of sharing the road goes a long ways.

I do note that the commuter guys share the road pretty well. It's the techocolor-spandex guys who are just using the road as their private track who seem to be the worst. (it's a big problem on the island here) The local govt built an extra wide shoulder, but these yahoos think they are too fast for that. ....and of course, they have that huge responsibility to 'assert their place in the road .. .for their safety." :rolleyes:

Riding a bike on the sidewalk is actually illegal, and I don't ever remember seeing a cyclist riding on a sidewalk, at least not in any where in California. So your post doesn't really make any sense.

in this state it is perfectly legal. ..cyclists are a "a car" then a "pedestrian" . .then "a car" ....what ever works.

Can you describe this? Are these "Lance Armstrong think-they-bes" blocking the entire lane, making it impossible for you to drive through?

Or are you really just jealous of their shaved legs and cute shorts? :p

Wait, I know: you're just scared of having this beside you at an intersection:
http://cache.boston.com/resize/bonza..._8098/410w.jpg

What's not legal is to ride side by side, in a single lane. Yet, the technocolor-spandexers are always doing that. I think it helps them assert their place in the road. And makes it easier for them to shout a conversation back and forth. I'm not sure if that's better or worse than the ones in the middle of the road @ 17mph (asserting for safety) while tuning out to their iPods.

Any guy next to me (shave or not) pantomiming oral sex, yeah, creepy.

The question I would pose to most cyclists: you're going somewhere in your car, you are in a hurry. You get stuck behind an old lady with permed white hair, who can barely see over the top of her Buick wheel as she speeds along at 10 MPH. You are stuck behind her for an extended period of time. What do you do?

Rhetorical question of course, 99% of people would get seriously pissed off. Perhaps later they would start a thread in Pelican OT about old people driving.:p Regardless, the point I try to make is, why is it ok when the delay is a spandex clad biker?

Also, I know that technically the sidewalk isn't for bikes, but get over yourselves. You are not a car, the road is for cars. When was the last time a cop gave a cyclist a ticket for riding on the sidewalk? Hell, I would think that simple self-preservation would motivate you to take the safe route.

With a wide shoulder, I see no issue with cyclists. But, many think they are spandex-clad Davids, slaying our vehiculuar Goliaths. But F=ma, so you are destined to lose.

Alternate scenario: I load up the Dodge 2500 and tandem axle trailer with Kubota tractor and implements. The setup is well over 40 feet long and tips the scale at well over 10k lbs. Despite the strength of the Cummins turbo-diesel engine, inevitably, I am the slow man on the road. No cagers ***** at me, likely because I could run over their commuter car without fanfare.

Quite simply, delays are a consequence of driving on public roads.

In the end, courtesy from all parties would go a long way. Ultimately, size trumps all. After all, would you rather be right or alive?