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Went to a local speed shop a couple of years ago along with some other Porsche guys, to visit the wheel dyno. After dynoing a couple of cars, I said to the dyno operator guy:
"Here we are with several wimpy 200-hp NA Porsches. I'll bet you see some pretty ferocious cars." He said: "Yeah. That black Honda over there makes 500 hp and the white Supra next to it makes 800 hp." There are nine-second Hondas out there. Be careful who you pick fights with. |
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The Mighty 2.0T is all I can handle. Once I learn how to drive it, I'll move up the power grid. |
No doubt. There are serious race-built automobiles and then there are poseur ricer types that can't spell a word longer than three syllables and think their fart-can equipped econo box might actually get them laid. Big difference.
There are some pretty serious Honda guys I've run into online that actually do their own BLOCK CASTING. That's pretty hard-core. |
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Those cars are not my cup of tea either. It's just that some of them are very nicely sorted and can hang with the best out there. I was able to stay with some Radicals on slick tires, so I was not that slow... Yet this guy just blew me off. Kudos to him I say... |
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Sad thing is, for every impressive Integra or Civic out there, there are 100 that are nothing more than noisemakers and Bondo collectors.
However, that really sets up the real guys nicely. They can drive up in their Civic at the drag strip, and nobody expects much. |
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PS At least American car guys know which wheels should drive the car. Drag racing w/ fwd is like eating ribs with a knife & fork. |
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Somewhere I have tucked in my stack of magazines a Honda tuner mag. I kept it for the cover story:
HOW TO BUILD A 650HP TURBO B18 It ran something completely insane like 26 pounds of boost, and the attention to detail was, for lack of a better word, outstanding. I seriously considered getting something B18 powered after reading that. At the $10 or $12K it cost, the performance for dollar spent blows just about everything out of the water. |
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Of course, the guys that cut the muffler off of a primered Civic, then cover it with stickers and wings, they're just idiots. |
I hate to break it to you Matt, but a IRS, '03 Cobra handles pretty well. Light mods on any of the cars you mentioned will result in a Mustang disappearing into the distance, on any track.
No underestimation here. i understand what it takes to go fast. FWD is off the list. So are 4 cyls. Can you put one on the ragged edge & go fast, yep. But don't forget, you are on the ragged edge. Don't overlook the fact that I'm not talking about some clown in a Mustang either. Here's one to check out. 8.80 Daily driver. <object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/RZyErg0fLT4&rel=1"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/RZyErg0fLT4&rel=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object> |
So an 8.80 daily fox body Mustang isn't "ragged edge?" Please.
I'm a Mustang fan, too, especially the Cobras, but I can't picture a stock, 03 Cobra "disappearing" to anywhere other than the rear view of a light modified 400+HP WRX STI or EVO. A lightly worked B13 or B20 (especially B20) RX7 would leave that Cobra, and then some, imo. Likely even a modded Cobra. 4 cyls off the list? You must not have seen all the 400 and 500 HP 951s. I'm reasonably sure those are "fast" by anyones standards. Except maybe Schummi and the F1 boys. I dunno, all seems like a pointless pissing match to me. Seems everyone knows of a faster car just around the corner. I met a guy at my local McDs on cruise in night that has a Lingenfelter (sp?) TT Vette. My brother's really good friend, Raz, has a 700 something HP Cobra monster. His other buddy had (sold it) a 650HP TT 350Z. Any weekend you can go to Chicago and find street races, 600-900HP imports. But then there's Henessey 1000HP Vipers. Someones always got a faster car, and it usually falls to money, skills and planning as to why it's faster, not country of origin. By the way, it looked like that kid in the WRX was having troubles with the gearbox, no? |
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Did he have spiked hair?
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Since you keep pounding the physics drum, one thing you are leaving out of the equation is weight. Its all about power to weight and if you can put it to the ground or not.
Using your own argumant against you, the next logical step - your precious small block mustang could never stand up against a big block anything.......Cubic inches baby....its all just physics, right? But wait.....some of those 5.0 Mustangs are faster than big block cars. How can that be???? SmileWavy I like 5.0 Mustangs too. There are some wicked fast 5.0's out there. But, much like the Hondas and thier fartcans, for every fast Stang one there are 10 with a tired stock motor and a pair of Flowmasters. In fact, here in the Midwest there are probably more posers per capita driving Mustangs than Hondas. Now that I think about it, I have raced plenty of 5.0's over the years. Here is a pic of the last one. He is a local street racer with a stroker motor and some type of super-loud centrifugal blower. When we were sitting in the staging lanes, he was setting up a $500 race for later that night. Perhaps he had the same mantra as you Mule "i understand what it takes to go fast. FWD is off the list. So are 4 cyls"http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1193685326.jpg http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1193685375.jpg |
I'm a fan of cubic inches. The green & black Mustang going 6.53 on a 10.5W has a BB Ford & 2 88's. your first statement is absolutely correct. Power, weight & grip are the key to performance.
I don't believe that every Mustang is a killer. I do believe that if you take a Mustang, GTO or similar RWD, V8 American car, NO FWD 4cyl anything, on anything like a similar level of preparation, can run with it. Isn't there an Ohio parts Co. with some fast VWs. |
Are we talking just straight line acceleration or around a track where you need to turn right also?
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Pretty closed minded point of view Mule. Ultimately, RWD musclecars still are king in drag racing. On a road course, they are anything but. All that power is great, but worthless in a car that is inable to put it down while cornering. The IRS Mustangs do handle well, for a Mustang. There's always that caveat. Ultimately, their suspension is too simple and they are too heavy to totally compete on a road course.
On the other hand, with a few thousand in modifications and typically without even cracking the engine, an STi or Evo can hang with all but the most exotic supercars on earth. You may not like them, or want to drive them, but you should respect them. |
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