Ok guys. Relax and stay friendly. As long as we keep a polite enviroment we can (or at least should be able to) talk about almost everthing. (Steve & others restraint yourselves, please)

Now I'm going to be a little mean here, but no hard feelings remember. Who brought death, war, blood and the likes into the debate?? I think mostly anti gun persons did. As long as pro gun people can talk alone it's usually peaceful. Do you catch my point everybody? I'm not saying that some are jerks and others are innocent. It's just that it seems both sides are missing a point.

Denmark is the proof that a compromise is possible.

No Mikkel,
You posted the topic about guns.

Remember this is a Porsche bbs, not a gun, war and death bbs.

Tell me, what other function do guns have that doesn't involve destruction? I agree that there is sport in shooting, I enjoy clay pigeon shooting with a 12bore shotgun, but the guys that have got all excited on this topic are talking about protecting themselves in civil situations. That, is something completely different, my friend.

You have innocently rolled over a rock and revealed some pretty unpleasant stuff underneath. Take my advice, roll the rock back and let's carry on with enjoying our cars.

I consider myself quite liberal on alot of views, including the gun ownership thing. I personally have no (zero, nada) reason to personally own a handgun, and I do not accept that "home protection" is a factually valid argument (ownership decreases crime rate, but gun owners are more likely to get shot with their own gun than someone elses, etc etc etc). In addition, I do take great offense when Steve interprets the meaning of the constitution for us. Steve, if you are not a J.D. in constitutional law, please refrain from telling us what "our founding fathers were implying". But, living in a democracy, if more than 50% of the population want to own guns, then that should be law....As far as I can tell, this issue is so politically heated that it will not be solved agreeably in congress, rather in civil court. You leave the keys in your car and it is stolen, you can be held responsible for the damages. So should be a handgun (if you leave it unlocked). If you are willing to either bear the risk of a lawsuit (or buy insurance) you should be allowed to own. If you cannot or will not bear those costs, you should give it up since it is not right for society to bear the costs of one's "hobby" or "desire"

My $.02

Scott read Artical 1 sec 8 the powers of the Congress. I posted it earlier I did not interpet it I just read it, Please read it and tell where the congress has the power to make any gun laws.
Bo, I get my news from Shortwave Radio, the Internet, I do not own a TV.
BTW 1978 Graduate USC School of Law. Not member of the Bar, I refuse to pledge my allegiance to the Queen of England,Which is what you do when you become a member of the Bar. Steve

[This message has been edited by SteveStromberg (edited 03-07-2001).]

[This message has been edited by SteveStromberg (edited 03-07-2001).]

I think my television is more dangerous than a gun. Aiming a television at anyone under the age of 18 should be a crime.

I don't keep a gun in the house because I am a parent. I am beginning to believe that television has little to nothing to offer us. Someone asked me the other day how I find the time to "watch that thing?" I couldn't give him an answer...food for thought!

Jw

Can we talk about something that the conspiracy theorists and socialists won't get so upset about, like abortion or something?

You people need a hobby http://www.pelicanparts.com/ultimate/smile.gif

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Mark Szabo
1986 911 Targa 3.2
1987 Escort 5-speed 1.9
The Porsche Owners Gallery

I think my television is more dangerous than a gun. Aiming a television at anyone under the age of 18 should be a crime.

I don't keep a gun in the house because I am a parent. I am beginning to believe that television has little to nothing to offer us. Someone asked me the other day how I find the time to "watch that thing?" I couldn't give him an answer...food for thought!

Jw

www.penetrators.com/culture.html

See half way down page

[This message has been edited by SteveStromberg (edited 03-07-2001).]

[This message has been edited by SteveStromberg (edited 03-07-2001).]

United States Senate, Judiciary Commitee report on the second amendment from 1982.
http://www.2ndlawlib.org/other/other/senrpt/senrpt.html

U.S. v. Emerson, Federal court case, from Texas 1999. This one is currently under appeal.
http://www.2ndlawlib.org/court/fed/46fsupp2d598.html

Both of these conclude that the 2nd amendment means axactly what it says, with a detailed background at to why.

All about Guns See: http://links.shooters.com/
It's Weapons Wednesday on the Intel. Report.
See http://www.pbn.4mg.com/intelreport.htm

Steve

[This message has been edited by SteveStromberg (edited 03-07-2001).]

Steve, give it a rest mate.

Why don't you find something else to do. It's obviously getting lonesome in the bunker with your tins of bake beans, your shortwave radio and loaded rifles, waiting for the end of civilisation. You should get out more and realise that there is a world out there with lots of different sorts of people who mostly aren't that bad. You are obviously uncertain of your views, why else would you have to shout your views on this thread in a desperate attempt to persuade us all that you are right. Hey, you are right if that's what makes you happy.

I have to pull you up on one point though. Britain and Northern Ireland. You're obviously a bit, how shall we say, narrow minded in your attitude. Could I make a suggestion that you don't go on about stuff that you obviously know very little about. You see, it makes you look stupid, and you wouldn't want that. You should understand that there are alot of things in this world that you can't solve with guns and bombs, really, its true.

The fact that you have to keep digging about in the distant past to make some sense of your argument,shows that you have very little grasp of reality. It's people like you that keep sending money and weapons to the IRA that prolong the situation in Northern Ireland. If you ever emerged out of your bunker you would know that the Irish problem has more to do with gangsters, drug money and protection rackets than it has with any glorious freedom struggles that went on several hundred years ago.

The british government is trying to settle the situation in Northen Ireland as best it can through dialogue and reconciliation. Something that is proving very difficult when the IRA haven't surrendered any weapons as they agreed to and people like you keep sending them more. The british army has moved out a long time ago and many political prisoners have been let out of jail. Incidentally, this has resulted in a number of gangster related shootings as they reestablish their territories.

Why don't you look up the Omagh bombing where children and pregnant women (Irish nationals) were blown up by the IRA scum and see how great these terrorists are.

Last week, these freedom fighters heroically left a torch bomb outside an army cadet centre in London where they blew the hand off a 14 year old boy who picked it up. They also blinded him in the only eye that worked after he lost one due to cancer.

Heros indeed.

I think it's time this thread was dropped. It's clear to me that many Americans (especially Steve!) have a very simplistic view of the situation in Northern Ireland and it's best they kept out of it.

Cheers

Come on fellas, this started out as an off topic question for those interested in guns. I suppose those that have no interest in guns should not have responded. However, here we are now, talking IRA vs GB and the bombing of pregnant women.

As I re-read many of these posts I am struck with a resounding sense of brotherhood. Yes - brotherhood. How else could one group of fellows disagree to the point of blows over one topic, and then be willing to help their "adversary" if the others Porsche need help? Porsche’s are beautiful, good, peaceful things that bring many different people together! http://www.pelicanparts.com/ultimate/wink.gif

I guess I am as guilty as anyone for being narrow-minded, and I apologize to those with different opinions.
Neil Peart said it best:

When the ebbing tide retreats
Along the rocky shoreline,
It leaves a trail of tidal pools
In a short-lived galaxy.
Each microcosmic planet
A complete society.
A simple kind of mirror
To reflect upon our own:
All the busy little creatures
Chasing out their destinies…
Living in their pools,
They soon forget about the sea...

Well said VIPR. I'll drink to that.

Who claimed they set off that bomb,I havent head any group that said they did it. No I don't hunker in my bunker I get out and make signs and callinto talk radio tring to get people aware of what is happening to our country.If people in the UK would stand up for freedom maybe you wouldnt live in a country with TV Cameras on every corner. Have you read Geo. Orwells 1984 that book sums up what your country is today. Freedom is not Free, The founders of our nation lost everything to insuer that their dream of a Free Nation would last." TO IGNORE EVIL IS TO BECOME ACCOMPLICE TO IT". Martin Luther King,jr Seek the Truth and the Truth will set you FREE. Steve

Saffs has a good point in that we tell it like it is on the BBS. I think Saffs does not like this since it is an on-line "community" and should be friendly. Personally I think it is friendly and to the point. I have no disrespect or hatered for people with opposing opinions, the opinions are just given bluntly because we do not have time for a politically correct essay. We practice the KISS principle http://www.pelicanparts.com/ultimate/smile.gif I love the controversy, when you meet people face-to-face you end up BSing as to not offend anyone and we call these white lies PC.

I think Steve has not interpreted the Constitution in his posts. The Constitution is amzingly well written and clear when taken in its correct context, granted it is based off Biblical ideals which you must be familiar with. Granted I beleive if church wants to have a say in government they better start paying taxes. I have not seen anything in the Constitution about social security, welfare, or socialized health care, have you? The oldest man that ever lived was Japanese and retired when he was like 80, then ran out of money and went back to work at 104 and lived until he was roughly 132, amazing. If you do not have any money then do not retire.

I just have a beef about China being in the WTO. They have strict import rules, are communist, illegally reproduce copywritted material, and do nothing about child labor. All the things I love to support! Yes, I have to buy some things made in China because there is no other choice, but I do not like it. Also would someone owning an authentic Turkish/Oriental rug like to explain who and how those were made? Hmmm, kids in a sweatshop. We all want a better world and to stop injustices, but how do we vote with our pocketbook? I guess until it airs on Dateline/60 Minutes/ 20/20 it is not happening.

Yes, I buy stuff I do not even want to know how got produced so I am not stoning anyone, but just be careful when possible as a consumer.

Okay, enough of my craziness. I got my delievery of parts from PP yesturday so my weekend is jam packed full of fun!!!



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Adrian Pillow
1979 911 SC
1966 VW Microbus
PCA - Peachstate Region

George Orwell is one of my favourite writers and 1984 is a fine book. It is a fictional novel however, and it's 'predictions' served as a sort of warning of what could happen in a communist system. George Orwell was very upper class and saw his way of life disappearing before his very eyes during the inter-war years as the newly created middle classes grew in importance and influence. Socialist thinking was very popular amongst the inteligentsia and it is against this threat that he aimed his novel.
The socialist threat never happened and Britain evolved in a different direction.

The cameras you refer to are aimed at reducing crime that is running at a very high level in most of our inner cities. It is not a method of controlling people as Orwell suggested, but a way of protecting people from violent parts of the community, some of whom have guns.

Right! Well, uh, is it correct that the difference between a Weber IDA and IDS carburettor is that the IDS has a high speed enrichment jet?

Anyone? Anyone?

Roight!!

"Well then,...other than the Actuad"u"cts, education, plumbing, and paved roads............What have the re"o"mans ever don fer us!!??"

"We'll all join the fight against weapons of mass destruction tonight, except Reg, who's out with a bad back."


"solidarity brothers"...

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Leland Pate

___79 SC Targa

after this "GET TO KNOW YOUR NEIGHBOR" yada yada is done.

we proud americans, who just happens to like a GERMAN car would have a dream...cruising on a not-so-american autobahn at a trillion miles per hour. waking up to a nightmare being pulled over by a highway car for going at 66 MPH at our interstates.

Chill out...whether you belong to the left, center or right, we are still buddies on the other threads.

We are just having fun...speaking our minds and getting to know our neighbors.

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simon d
911-t.70