Worth a Read, even if you don't agree...

[legion]

I don't think that conservative Democrats bother most of us.

[Seric]

Originally Posted by widebody911

2005 called, they want their glurge back...

Meh, things like this need to be repeated. We all need a reminder.

[cmccuist]

Originally Posted by Shaun 84 Targa

Try again friend.

it must really bug you that John Glenn, a truly unimpeachable American hero, is a Democrat.

You guys like to put up the "shiny beautiful" women of the Republican party pic against the photoshopped women of substance of the Democratic party.

Well here we have Democrat John Glenn, Marine, Test Pilot, Astronaut, Hero up against George Bush, Guard pilot-wannabe who didn't even serve his time, safe on the homefront, who has done more damage to this country than any other sitting President in history.

That comparison makes about as much sense as Clinton v. Bush 41 or Clinton v. Bob Dole. Or Clinton v. Bush 43 for that matter. Actually, both Clintons have to take a pass on anything military-related.

John Glenn was a hero. My parents are Republicans and they named my brother after John Glenn (my brother's middle name is Glen).

As far as the shiny, beautiful people comparison, that poster is a response to the left's fictitious monopoly on good looks. You could put together a pretty convincing roster of hollywood hotties who are homogenous in their support of the Democrats.

But you have to admit, Janet Reno, Donna Shalala, Madeline Albright (worst secretary of state ever!!) and Helen Thomas, with that catcher's mitt strapped to her face, are exponentialy ugly!

[rbuswell]

Originally Posted by stevepaa

uh no, the quote is not correct per SNOPES.

Snopes also noted that the remarks about prior US wars was attributed to Glenn when he never said it or wrote it. Whoever wrote that short essay, however, had some good points.

The key point is that Americans are hypersensitive to military casualties and if you lost a son or daughter in a war you will understand. By the measure of loss of life, Iraq has barely been a blip on the radar screen. Wars are necessary sometimes and to blame President Bush because he's a Republican and ignore the track record of Democrats when it comes to war isn't a fair argument. If political party is an indicator of warmongering then the Democrats and Republicans are pretty even; therefore we may only have one choice, the Green Party, if we want no more war no matter what. But then we'll all have to put our Porsches in the garage and never drive them again. Too many emissions and no fuel.

[Rick Lee]

Originally Posted by rbuswell

Snopes also noted that the remarks about prior US wars was attributed to Glenn when he never said it or wrote it. Whoever wrote that short essay, however, had some good points.

Most of what we attribute to politicians, at least modern ones, was not written by them. They have speech and copy writers and plenty of stuff that gets approved still never sees the light of day. Anyone think Bush ever wrote one of his speeches? He has some of the best speech writers ever, but can barely get through a few sentences without mangling words. One of Clinton's best performances was done from memory when his staffers loaded the wrong speech into the teleprompters, but they were already live on tv.

[M.D. Holloway]

The whole WMD thing was inflated because of a bad speech...

[Moneyguy1]

The entire article holds true: You CAN fool some of the people all of the time. If the info contained confirms your pre conceived ideas, then it must be true.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Originally Posted by Moneyguy1

The entire article holds true: You CAN fool some of the people all of the time. If the info contained confirms your pre conceived ideas, then it must be true.

this thing actually reads exactly like propaganda from the flip-side twin towers conspiracy theorist tinfoil hat set.

lots of ALCOA shareholders in this thread.

[WI wide body]

It appears as if many people here do not really know the difference between getting our troops maimed and killed for legitimate reasons or for exagerrated and questionable reasons.

Iraq posed no more threat to the USA than dozens of other nations around the globe. In fact, Bush has just proposed to send $billions of dollars of weapons to MANY Middle East nations that very well may use them (and possibly against us) in the not too distant future.

Very difficult to pretend that you are seeking "peace" while providing the weapons for exactly the opposite.

[M.D. Holloway]

And the answer is?

So, given the opportunity to make the decision, how would you have handled the middlebeast when Iraq invaded Kuwait and what would you do starting today?

[WI wide body]

Originally Posted by LubeMaster77

And the answer is?

So, given the opportunity to make the decision, how would you have handled the middlebeast when Iraq invaded Kuwait and what would you do starting today?

Good question: what should we do starting today. How's this for starters?

When Iraq or Iran or any other nation in the unholy area known as the "Holy Land" has a problem it should not immediately be OUR problem. Unless we have an agenda that most Americans do not understand. There are dozens of nations that it should impact far sooner than it should the USA.

Our troops should not get maimed or killed just to be the policemen of the world for nut cases like Cheney, Wolfowitz, Pearle, and the rest of the chickenhawks who control Bush's brain.

We should tell ALL nations of the Middle East (including our best buddy Israel) that as of Monday all support and aid is done...over...finished...period. And that in the future our support, aid, and responses will be based on nothing but what they actually do. And then do precisely that.

Any other questions?

[Jim Bremner]

Originally Posted by Shaun 84 Targa

Try again friend.

it must really bug you that John Glenn, a truly unimpeachable American hero, is a Democrat.

You guys like to put up the "shiny beautiful" women of the Republican party pic against the photoshopped women of substance of the Democratic party.

Well here we have Democrat John Glenn, Marine, Test Pilot, Astronaut, Hero up against George Bush, Guard pilot-wannabe who didn't even serve his time, safe on the homefront, who has done more damage to this country than any other sitting President in history.

yup, well shrub at least didn't run off to England like billy & hilly

[M.D. Holloway]

Originally Posted by WI wide body

Good question: what should we do starting today. How's this for starters?

When Iraq or Iran or any other nation in the unholy area known as the "Holy Land" has a problem it should not immediately be OUR problem. Unless we have an agenda that most Americans do not understand. There are dozens of nations that it should impact far sooner than it should the USA.

Our troops should not get maimed or killed just to be the policemen of the world for nut cases like Cheney, Wolfowitz, Pearle, and the rest of the chickenhawks who control Bush's brain.

We should tell ALL nations of the Middle East (including our best buddy Israel) that as of Monday all support and aid is done...over...finished...period. And that in the future our support, aid, and responses will be based on nothing but what they actually do. And then do precisely that.

Any other questions?

OK, so let them take care of their problems or get a bunch of nations together to gang up on them. Well, I'm not so sure that would be such a good idea for many reasons. Who would have stood up to Iraq when they into Kuwait if the US / UK didn't? The UN? Iran? And after Iraq was beaten back and the UN put forth a bunch of resolutions, how many years went by with all the inspector turn-backs et al?

I agree that the situation is not great but I am not so sure there would have been anything else that could have been done that would have made a difference?

Ignoring the situations and they will end up getting truely out of control - even more so than now.

[frogger]

These glurge articles, and the reactions by the folks that the glurge is intended for, reminds me of these fine fellas standing around, swilling beer and saying "yep" to everything any of them say.



At least they recycle.

[SLO-BOB]

Originally Posted by LubeMaster77

And the answer is?

So, given the opportunity to make the decision, how would you have handled the middlebeast when Iraq invaded Kuwait and what would you do starting today?

Exactly the way it was handled by the smarter Bush - Get in. Kick Saddam's a$$ back to Bahgdad, get out. Unfortunately, his son didn't take Dad's advice and stay the hell out of Iraq. Dad knew it was a quagmire from which it would be difficult, if not impossible, to emerge. When the towers fell, the one thing that GW did right, set up shop in Afghanistan, was set aside for his lame a$$ excuse for a war in Iraq. It's common knowledge that he had a hardon for Iraq since the begining and 911 was one hell of a convenient excuse to invade a country that posed a minimal threat to the US. To say that the "wmd" thing was a bad speech is bull*****. Bush milked that cow dry anytime a camera was on. When that wore out and was proven false, he fell back on the humanitarian effort, which then gave way to the failsafe "terrorist sympathizer/funder". While that part may well be true, imo, he totally lost focus on how to wage war (notice I didn't say win) on terrorism in a way that would have meaningful effect. However, Bush couldn't have done this alone. He had a LOT of backing by both parties. That backing has conveniently evaporated with hindsight.

What to do now?? I really hate to say it - Stay the course. We, as a country are commited. I believe that there's a light at the end of the tunnel. It would be a shame to let this go now. Believe me - I really hate to take this stance. Aside from that, I really think we should focus a little closer to our own borders and quit meddling in affairs that can't be controlled - i.e. strife in the mid east. Oh yeah, and plant a big old American flag in Afghanistan.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

We should place a War Tax on anyone who voted for Bush twice, to pay for the war.

[legion]

Originally Posted by Shaun 84 Targa

We should place a War Tax on anyone who voted for Bush twice, to pay for the war.

Just as long as we can be exempted from paying for Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, welfare, the Department of Education, the EPA, farm subsidies, corporate welfare...

[lendaddy]

Originally Posted by legion

Just as long as we can be exempted from paying for Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, welfare, the Department of Education, the EPA, farm subsidies, corporate welfare...

Sounds good, Dems pay for those and we'll pick up the war.

Deal Shaun?

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Originally Posted by lendaddy

Sounds good, Dems pay for those and we'll pick up the war.

Deal Shaun?

Not just Dems Joel, there are plenty of Republicans smart enough to have not voted for Bush twice. Not sure why legion included Republican Corporate Socialism in that list. That's your bailout baby.

But on the whole, yes, I'd rather sink $ into programs that have a chance of making a difference than burn $ and American lives in Iraq. And I'm not so sure you want to take on the cost VA/healthcare for injured/wounded mental/physical, and of course you'll be making payments to China directly.

On EPA, we'll take that, but will be billing you for ruining the environment and public health.

Farm Subsidies, I may be wrong, but I think that's yours too.

[Tim Hancock]

Originally Posted by lendaddy

Sounds good, Dems pay for those and we'll pick up the war.

Deal Shaun?

I am in too! If we are paying , can we kick the shiite out of Iran also any way we see fit without the media showing it on the 6:00 news? I am betting we could do a much better job kicking @ss if we could operate without having to wear kid gloves so as not to offend the bleeding hearts.

I am really liking this concept Shaun!

PS thanks again for the care package at X-mas, I will have to get and post some pics of my nephews wearing there "Uncle Tim" stuff.