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canna change law physics
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What would it REALLY take to secede?
I'm not talking about guns and ammo. I'm talking about a theoretical legal manner for a state to decide to leave the union.
I'm not a lawyer, I don't play one on TV. I'm a not so humble Mechanical/Nuclear Engineer. There is a mechanism built into the Constitution to join the Union by creating a new state. But can someone discern if there is a way for a state to take a legal path to leaving the United States? Would it take a new amendment? Or is there something existing in the Framework that would allow it?
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James The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the engineer adjusts the sails.- William Arthur Ward (1921-1994) Red-beard for President, 2020 |
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07-18-2008, 04:31 AM
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: New York, NY USA
Posts: 4,269
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2/3rds of the states would need to create an ammendment to change the constitution. Then a mechanism would be put in place.
Either that or is mostly likely going to happen to our southwest states, they will just be absorbed back into Mexico.. |
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07-18-2008, 05:02 AM
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is this thing on?
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Franklin, NJ
Posts: 2,527
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vermont or New Hampshire have been wanting to cede from the USA...and they have the votes to do it from their citizens...it comes up every once and a while
Texas, upon joining the USA reserved theright to cede and break up into 13 individual countries... just some historical trivia
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"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both" ~Benjamin Franklin |
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07-18-2008, 05:05 AM
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: N. Phoenix AZ USA
Posts: 28,943
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Believe that Texas is the only state that is its on republic, and has the ability to break away from the US.
If they start to do so may think very strongly about moving back to Texas...
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2013 Jag XF, 2002 Dodge Ram 2500 Cummins (the workhorse), 1992 Jaguar XJ S-3 V-12 VDP (one of only 100 examples made), 1969 Jaguar XJ (been in the family since new), 1985 911 Targa backdated to 1973 RS specs with a 3.6 shoehorned in the back, 1959 Austin Healey Sprite (former SCCA H-Prod), 1995 BMW R1100RSL, 1971 & '72 BMW R75/5 "Toaster," Ural Tourist w/sidecar, 1949 Aeronca Sedan / QB |
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07-18-2008, 05:17 AM
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Bye, Bye.
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Planet Earth
Posts: 6,167
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I researched Texas a little before I moved here last month; I found nothing that states Texas reserved any right to secede from the union. I even brought this up while touring the State Capital and was told that this is just a myth.
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Elvis has left the building. |
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07-18-2008, 07:54 AM
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Dog-faced pony soldier
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Quote:
I honestly think CA seceding would be a good thing for both CA and for the U.S. . . Both would be happier. Dunno which one I'd side with though.
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A car, a 911, a motorbike and a few surfboards Black Cars Matter |
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07-18-2008, 08:38 AM
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Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 574
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Such self-loathing for the country that is THE place most people want to come to!
What the H*ll is wrong with the USA that hasn't always been wrong, and always been getting slightly better, year by year? People still making millions despite the taxes. People still getting care when they are sick. People still worshipping as they please (or not to if they so choose). It's not perfect, but, sheesh! Maybe we are a bunch of whiners! |
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07-18-2008, 08:44 AM
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<insert witty title here>
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Secession is NOT a can of worms you want to open up. Look at how it's consumed the greater part of the Quebec provincial government for the last several decades. IMO, the province is much worse the wear for it, because so many separatist provincial gov'ts have wasted so much time, energy and resources on it that other areas of gov't (particularly the economy) have been badly neglected.
The fact of the matter seems to be that, as we've always known, there's greater strength in unity, despite internal difference. Unless a group is significantly oppressed, the reasons to stay together are much stronger than those to split.
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Current: 1987 911 cabrio Past: 1972 911t 3.0, 1986 911, 1983 944, 1999 Boxster |
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07-18-2008, 08:59 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 89
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Sucession
Seems like a few states tried that a few years back and started the worse war we have ever had. The Feds. won't allow it they want all of our money.
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07-18-2008, 09:06 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: So. Cal.
Posts: 11,239
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I know nothing about Texas' right to secede; however, it is true that upon joing the nation Texas retained the right to split inot what I believe is five STATES. thereby gaining additional representation in the U.S. Senate. It is largely believed/understood that Texas gave up this right when it joined the Confederacy and the South subsequently lost the War of Northern Aggression.
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David 1972 911T/S MFI Survivor |
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07-18-2008, 09:26 AM
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Location: Ogden, Utah
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It would cause another Civil War. Like it or not we are all in this together, till the bitter end.
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Wrap me up in my old flying jacket, And give me a joystick to hold, to hold, And I'll soar once again o'er the trenches And thus shall my exploits be told. |
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07-18-2008, 09:33 AM
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Leave the gun. Take the cannoli.
Posts: 20,936
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Key West did it:
http://www.conchrepublic.com/welcome.htm |
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07-18-2008, 09:48 AM
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Dog-faced pony soldier
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This is true. . . I have a good friend of mine who lives there and proudly hang the Conch Republic flag in my garage (right next to the Gadsen "don't tread on me" flag).
My favorite expression: "we seceded where others failed". 
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A car, a 911, a motorbike and a few surfboards Black Cars Matter |
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07-18-2008, 10:49 AM
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Dog-faced pony soldier
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This is true. . . I have a good friend of mine who lives there and proudly hang the Conch Republic flag in my garage (right next to the Gadsen "don't tread on me" flag).
My favorite expression: "we seceded where others failed".
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A car, a 911, a motorbike and a few surfboards Black Cars Matter |
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07-18-2008, 10:49 AM
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Cars & Coffee Killer
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: State of Failure
Posts: 32,246
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It would take winning a civil war.
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Some Porsches long ago...then a wankle... 5 liters of VVT fury now -Chris "There is freedom in risk, just as there is oppression in security." |
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07-18-2008, 10:54 AM
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Location: Palm Beach, Florida, USA
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We did win the Civil War.
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07-18-2008, 11:18 AM
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Cars & Coffee Killer
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Location: State of Failure
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Quote:
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Some Porsches long ago...then a wankle... 5 liters of VVT fury now -Chris "There is freedom in risk, just as there is oppression in security." |
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07-18-2008, 11:23 AM
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3.2 targa |
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07-18-2008, 11:25 AM
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Location: Palm Beach, Florida, USA
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The United States of America won the Civil War. You, as a citizen of the United States can lay claim to that great heritage. In fact, as a resident of the State of Illinois, you have a double claim.
It is proper to refer to a lawyer as "counselor". As in, "You're a poopyhead, counselor." There. I saved you the trouble of posting a reply.
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MRM 1994 Carrera |
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07-18-2008, 12:41 PM
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Location: Lake Oswego, OR
Posts: 571
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Quote:
They could start a race to see who could get in the most debt. oh wait.....they are already doing that |
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07-18-2008, 12:45 PM
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1970/1982 Porsche 914-6/911SC 2.7 RS
1972 Porsche 911T 2.4
