Atlas Shrugged, anyone?

[mthomas58]

Originally Posted by legion

In Atlas Shrugged, the government passes laws in an attempt to force total equality in the marketplace. As each new regulation is passed, it causes a host of unintended consequences that cause an economic meltdown. This happens slowly at first, then with an accelerating pace until the economy is completely in shambles.

Contrast that with the whole subprime mess. This was created by the government forcing banks to lend to people who were not credit worthy. When that started to cause problems, we got TARP, then the second "stimulus", and now another rescue is being debated.

In both cases, the government created the problems, then tried to solve them by forcing businesses to act against their own self-interest.

Well said! I would then add that the govnt then pointed the finger at and placed blame on the banks taking no reponsibility for the problems they created through their mandates and lack of effective oversight.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Worse still, most of the people out there are stupid enough to believe it.

Ask 10 people what they think the cause of the current mess is. Guaranteed at least seven of them will say "banks/lenders" or "lack of government oversight".

People have drank the Kool-Aid mixed up by the liberal government spin machine. Since they can't even understand the disease, there's not a snowball's chance in hell they can comprehend what the solution might be.

[m21sniper]

Originally Posted by Porsche-O-Phile

Ask 10 people what they think the cause of the current mess is. Guaranteed at least seven of them will say "banks/lenders" or "lack of government oversight".

I think you're deluding yourself if you believe 7 out of 10 Americans could give such a coherent answer.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

You do have a point on that.

I still maintain there are an awful lot of people out there that believe that it's somehow too LITTLE oversight/regulation/manipulation of the market that created this mess - certainly more than know/believe the truth and reality of the situation - that it's too MUCH oversight, regulation and manipulation through legislative gems like the CRA and institutions like Fannie/Freddie.

If banks were allowed to lend to whomever they wanted rather than having their hands tied by silly "forced equality" policies in an inherently unequal world, it would have avoided a lot of this mess. I still believe the manipulation of interest rates by the FED and Greenspan would've created some sort of bubble, but again the answer there is LESS regulation would have ultimately been better - not more. If the FED didn't exist and hadn't embarked on a historic rate-slashing initiative in order to "stimulus" the economy around and after 9/11/01, NONE of this would have happened.

[daepp]

"Do you wish to know whether that day is coming? Watch money. Money is the barometer of a society's virtue. When you see that trading is done, not by consent, but by compulsion--when you see that in order to produce, you need to obtain permission from men who produce nothing--when you see that money is flowing to those who deal, not in goods, but in favors--when you see that men get richer by graft and by pull than by work, and your laws don't protect you against them, but protect them against you--when you see corruption being rewarded and honesty becoming a self-sacrifice--you may know that your society is doomed."

From Francisco's money speech

[gr8fl4porsche]

Thanks for the reading selection guys!

I am almost halfway through it and am enjoying it. Long book.

Amazing how something written so long ago still applies. This book should be mandatory for high school students.

Of course, Ayn Rand is so extremely long winded that a compressed version should be utilized. Seems that she describes the steel against the sky every couple of pages.

I find the book inspiring as it relates to my business side of life.

[legion]

Originally Posted by gr8fl4porsche

Of course, Ayn Rand is so extremely long winded that a compressed version should be utilized. Seems that she describes the steel against the sky every couple of pages.

She writes like a Russian author...in English.

[nynor]

i've read most of ayn rand's 'novels' and enjoyed them all.

[nynor]

Originally Posted by Porsche-O-Phile

You do have a point on that.

I still maintain there are an awful lot of people out there that believe that it's somehow too LITTLE oversight/regulation/manipulation of the market that created this mess - certainly more than know/believe the truth and reality of the situation - that it's too MUCH oversight, regulation and manipulation through legislative gems like the CRA and institutions like Fannie/Freddie.

If banks were allowed to lend to whomever they wanted rather than having their hands tied by silly "forced equality" policies in an inherently unequal world, it would have avoided a lot of this mess. I still believe the manipulation of interest rates by the FED and Greenspan would've created some sort of bubble, but again the answer there is LESS regulation would have ultimately been better - not more. If the FED didn't exist and hadn't embarked on a historic rate-slashing initiative in order to "stimulus" the economy around and after 9/11/01, NONE of this would have happened.

and don't forget it was the dems in congress that mandated the policies that allowed lending to people not qualified for mortgages. "the poor need a chance at housing, too."

[Moses]

The sex in the book is disturbing. Pretty violent with a powerful woman portrayed as being sexually submissive. I guess Ayn Rand had some rape fantasies. Love the book otherwise. Socialists are generally pussies who can't compete.

[legion]

Originally Posted by Moses

The sex in the book is disturbing. Pretty violent with a powerful woman portrayed as being sexually submissive. I guess Ayn Rand had some rape fantasies. Love the book otherwise. Socialists are generally pussies who can't compete.

I didn't like the sex scenes either. I think her theories fell apart when she tried to apply them to sex. Other than that, she was spot on.

[the]

Her personal life was certainly on the "interesting" side, I've also wondered how her views on certain things (or maybe all things) would have changed if she would have ever had children.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Originally Posted by legion

I didn't like the sex scenes either. I think her theories fell apart when she tried to apply them to sex. Other than that, she was spot on.

Yea, I find myself kinda' skimming through those. Gratuitous and boring. Doesn't fit the rest of the story at all. Those scenes just seem completely contrived.

[lendaddy]

I took the sex as an extension of the passion the "doers and creators" had for everything they did. It was almost uncontrollable in the same sense they couldn't attack their business with anything less than extreme dedication and/or immersion...sometimes to the point of unhealthiness.

[the]

She has the sex scenes because the book is her "master work," and therefore is an attempt to present a unified, complete philosophy, covering every aspect of life.