Weird Night

[legion]

Between running errands today, I just happened to check my home e-mail and see that a fellow PCA member was having a little birthday get-together at Fat Jack's tonight. (This bar is now nationally famous as it is frequented by Sam Shepherd.) I decided to join the festivities.

I enter the bar and see some PCA people and a manager from my area at work who likes to hang out with the PCA crowd (he owns two Corvettes, a '60 and an '08--we're not picky ). What surprises me is that next to him, is his boss, who is my boss's boss.

Now, I just switched managers last week. (Not uncommon in my department. In fact, the fact that I have only had 4 managers in 9 years is somewhat unusual in my department. Most people have had many more!) I got some insight into the political issues that are going on a level or two above me. Quite the education!

Being a peon, I kept my mouth shut and just listened. It was clear to me that my old manager wasn't well-liked by the other managers, and my new manager isn't really that popular either. It seems my prospect for a promotion isn't all that great for the time-being. I also learned that my old manager had a habit of dumping work on the good-looking women in the unit. I'm not sure, but when I joined this guy's unit three years ago (old manager), a female friend of mine, who had had him as a manager seemed mighty suspicious, though she wouldn't tell me why at the time. (I still think there is more to the story.)

Part of me would like to make it into management some day. Part of me has no tolerance for the politics that comes with the territory. Tonight was a real eye-opener. Perhaps I will go back to Plan A and just become an indispensable technical authority--some of them can be paid as well or better than management.

[KFC911]

Originally Posted by legion

...Part of me would like to make it into management some day. Part of me has no tolerance for the politics that comes with the territory. Tonight was a real eye-opener. Perhaps I will go back to Plan A and just become an indispensable technical authority--some of them can be paid as well or better than management.

My .02 worth. NO one is indespensable, and don't ever lose sight of that fact. That said, there is nothing wrong with your "Plan A", and you are correct with your last assessment... different strokes for different folks.

[tabs]

I thought you were going to say that you had a close encounter with a UFO...and were abducted by aliens.

You only become indispensable if you write a million lines of computer code for their main software information storage program that is undocumented.

To be in managment you have to be tolerant of being bent over and fked in the a$$.

[KFC911]

Originally Posted by tabs

I...You only become indispensable if you write a million lines of computer code for their main software information storage program that is undocumented....

Nope...

[Jeff Higgins]

I tried a short stint in management in my company about 15 years ago. I found out I'm not a "people person", in that I have little tolerance for sniveling, incompetence, and laziness. Especially if they are all manifested in the same employee. On top of that, I had little tolerance for, and refused to participate in, the shameless ass kissing in the ranks above me. I lasted a year and went back to the technical end of the business.

[cl8ton]

Anyone can be thrown under the bus at anytime!
Chris I think you’re in IT? Programming or Networking?

Either one, you’re only as good as your last project, mostly in the private sector in todays economy.

Btw, you’re old manager was tapping it

[legion]

Perhaps "indispensable" was the wrong word. I fully realize that no one is truly indispensable. We have a lot of smart people, and I think even if I wrote the most cryptic program that performed the most vital function, it would only take someone maybe three months to figure out at most.

I guess I meant "indispensable" to mean "important and knowledgeable enough to command a high salary and be among the last to be fired". I think that's about as "indispensable" as is possible these days.

I guess this was my first real look into the world of middle management and I was a bit shocked. I need to do some serious pondering on where I want my career to go.

[legion]

Originally Posted by cl8ton

Anyone can be thrown under the bus at anytime!
Chris I think you’re in IT? Programming or Networking?

I'm a programmer. I work on some pretty cutting-edge stuff concerning business rules and predictive modeling.

Originally Posted by cl8ton

Btw, you’re old manager was tapping it

Nope. While I have no doubt that he was trying, much of the conversation concerned how much the "dump-ees" resented his sexism and abdication of responsibility. These are smart women who recognized immediately what was going on and contacted the appropriate people above him.

[nostatic]

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins

I found out I'm not a "people person

no! Say it ain't so!

[cl8ton]

Originally Posted by legion

I guess this was my first real look into the world of middle management and I was a bit shocked. I need to do some serious pondering on where I want my career to go.

I kind of know what you mean by this statement…

I have been programming since the Clipper 87 days, fast forward to today, I still get a thrill out
of programming something complex and have it work and also get paid to do this!

I could never, IMO sit around all day in meetings and discuss mundane issues that most middle mgt
have no concept of how to solve it programmatic.

That’s not to say I start off in Rambo mode, but rather work with biz analysts for the general
direction and biz rules needed and only then consult with mgt.

[cl8ton]

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins

I found out I'm not a "people person"

[911Rob]

"spooky" Ha!

Maybe this was an insight into something that you don't want? We'll never know what we want until we know what we dont want; that's why we should welcome the contrast in our lives.

I highly recommend that you forget about what ANYONE thinks about you or your abilities; then focus on what you do want in your life.... then go and get that! Do it NOW!

Now, Now, Now, NOW!

Life is too short and too full of joy not to enjoy it! Step out.... you're a winner, there's not a person on this board that doesn't think so; SO if Legion can't have everything that he ever wanted in life, what about us other poor saps? What's in store for us?

[aap1966]

Originally Posted by KC911

NO one is indespensable, and don't ever lose sight of that fact.

We tried to install a new Health Records system. Complete disaster. Lots of problems all dumped on one of the junior (but very good) IT girls. Great kid. Always keen to help. She was the only one that had any idea how to retrieve certain data.
She asked (begged) for extended leave for her wedding / honeymoon.
She was told she could have 1 week off.
"No one is indespensible"

She was.
Never saw that data again.

P.S. When an IT manager rings to say "I know you resigned because I wouldn't give you time off for your honeymoon, but any chance of helping me out with the data retrieval?" the answer is apparently concise, unambiguous and anatomically detailed.

[Schumi]

Well leeg... sounds like the same ole same ole here. But I cannot think but to bring up- if these are PCA members at the bar and the one boss is friends with PCA folk... couldn't they potentially find their way to PPOT sooner than later? You always lead us to enlightenment with your current job's situations... it just begs me to ask the question.... how would they feel if they found you talking about all of this to us, the PPOT?


Mind you, I work in a near confrontation-free environment and I have had a bit to drink tonight.... so take that into consideration-

but I expect discussion on this after I come out of my slumber tomorrow afternoon..

[KFC911]

Originally Posted by aap1966

We tried to install a new Health Records system. Complete disaster. Lots of problems all dumped on one of the junior (but very good) IT girls. Great kid. Always keen to help. She was the only one that had any idea how to retrieve certain data.
She asked (begged) for extended leave for her wedding / honeymoon.
She was told she could have 1 week off.
"No one is indespensible"

She was.
Never saw that data again.

P.S. When an IT manager rings to say "I know you resigned because I wouldn't give you time off for your honeymoon, but any chance of helping me out with the data retrieval?" the answer is apparently concise, unambiguous and anatomically detailed.

She still was not indespensible "in the big picture", it is what it is. Data may get lost, companies may lose billions (or even cease to exist), yet complete systems, IT depts, etc. may get overhauled, replaced or outsourced with disastous results and the beat goes on. Happens all the time...BTDT.

[Jim Richards]

Originally Posted by tabs

I thought you were going to say that you had a close encounter with a UFO...and were abducted by aliens.

So that explains everything.

Chris, management is OK, and the level/odor of politics varies from company to company. I would recommend you focus on project leadership to see if you have a taste for the issues associated with dealing with various personality types, without getting saddled with a lot of administrative tasks. It's also less political than the move into low/middle management, and it's good preparation if you do want to move up. Another thing to remember, there's more movement in management, and the politics you suffer today, may be completely different tomorrow.

One more thought, if you ever want to start your own business, it might be useful to have a little management experience...although it's certainly not a requirement.

[Monza_dh]

Originally Posted by legion

and see some PCA people and a manager from my area at work who likes to hang out with the PCA crowd (he owns two Corvettes, a '60 and an '08--we're not picky ). What surprises me is that next to him, is his boss, who is my boss's boss.

Maybe he's lurking here and could chime in to discuss.....

Just a grassy knoll theory....

[billybek]

Originally Posted by legion

y. Tonight was a real eye-opener. Perhaps I will go back to Plan A and just become an indispensable technical authority--some of them can be paid as well or better than management.

My suggestion....
Stick your finger in a glass of water.
Pull it out.
Examine the hole you made....
There is no indispensable positions anymore, but good luck moving up through the ranks.

[David]

I'm constantly battling the management vs engineering path. I really enjoy the engineering side of things, but in my business, power generation, the money is in management or consulting.

I don't mind the politics side of things (although maybe it's because I'm not exposed to it enough), I worry more about the HR side of management.

My manager reminds me that I don't make much less than he does so I guess I'm OK for now. Besides, there's more money in engineering consulting for my skills than anything else I could imagine after retirement.

[911Rob]

I disagree. I have an indespensible position.

the golden rule