Why AR and not AK?
 

Snipe's ammo thread got me thinking. Why doesn't he just get an AK or something that shoots a larger caliber than the AR's 5.56 ammo. The AK is so common and ammo is cheaper. The AK packs more punch and doesn't give much away for accuracy. It's a proven platform.

So are we stuck on ARs because we're American?


The AR versus AK has been kicked around on other forums but Pelicans tend to be more objective and without the immaturity found on some forums. So let's hear it. Why not
just buy an AK?

I have an AK variant, a MAK-90.

AKs are very reliable, but mounting optics on them is a bit of rig job. The receiver of an AK flexes quite a bit, and that hurts accuracy.

You get what you pay for. AKs are cheaper, but thats for a reason.

MY reasons:

1) I am intimately familiar with the M16 series from having carried one in the infantry, and i am supremely confident in my abilities with one.

2) The 5.56mm is actually a more destructive round in soft tissue (especially when restricted to FMJ rounds), and at long ranges it is vastly more accurate.

3) The M4/CAR-15 is a lighter, and much better looking weapon than the AK.

4) The M16 series is the most accessorizable black rifle around.

4) The AK's only real advantage is it's reliability in severe duty scenarios- something that is of very little importance to a civilian or a professional soldier with a ready supply of cleaning materials.

5) the AK just says "bad guy" to me, and has an extremely negative reputation that could be very harmful in any kind of justifiable homocide or jury trial scenario.

6) Normy has an AK.

Those are my reasons, others may differ.

If you want a sniper rifle, buy a sniper rifle. That's the way I look at it. I have several AK variants. WAY cheaper overall to own and operate, and ammo is easy to find. I'll probably pick up an AR variant at some point, but they're still awfully expensive. Returning to more normal, but still too costly right now.

Didn't Tabs have an AK for sale that has a milled receiver? Does that make it a more stable/rigid platform? How common is it to find something like that?

BTW, i would pick a Mini-14 over an AK in a heartbeat too.

Mini-14s are phenomenal rifles.

He wanted more for that one than you can get a nice Colt AR HBAR for though.

BTW, 80 countries use the M-16, including virtually every specops group in the entire non eastern bloc world (m-4).

He did, I think it was an Arsenal. You can get some well made AK variants that are more refined weapons, but then prices start to approach that of a nice AR.

http://www.ak-47.us/USmade.php

I figure that by the time I am shooting at anything with my AK-47, civil society will have pretty much melted down.

Tabs AK was a bit pricey. I see some now for about $500 and a 1000 rds of ammo for it is like $250. So yeah it's cheaper to own and operate. Is a $500 AK (there I go again with the $500 benchmark) really that bad?

IMO an AR isn't the finest machine. The design is archaic and the fit isn't great. Sure it works and has been proven over and over again, but it isn't the Porsche of the rifle world. Having said that, if the AK (for those who live with them) is really far more clunky than an AR, then it's probably not something for some of us anal Porsche drivers :)

That AK was shipped last Friday to a guy in LA....not LA CA BTW..got $1150 for it.

MIlled recievers are a bit heavier then the Stamped variations. However the rigidity of being milled makes the receiver flex less, thus the accuracy improves. I sold it because the length of pull was 12.5 inches which is too short for me and would tend to bite me when firing. Wicked weapon.

Arsenal AK's are the the cream...trigger pull is sweet, workmanship is superlative. And milled receivers are TOUGH TO GET and are drying up as we speak.

I still have two of the Arsenal 30 round poly mags for sale and about 400 or so rounds. Will sell the mags at $25 apiece one was never used, and the rounds at 25 cents apiece plus shipping via UPS.

I still have my Colt AR15 Tactical Carbine...1 in 9 twist, heavy barrel. I also have about 2000 rounds of Green Tip..Lake City and Israelie..In that gun I use the HK mags.

On the same platform I have a Knights SR25 Match rifle with Leupold Tactical MKIV scope...in 308....capable of sub minute of angle at 600 yards.

If I were looking for an AR I would WANT a Knights SR15...they make Daddy want to cum..I have talked to those folks at the Shot Show...and only one word comes to mind PRECISION.

A very likely possibility.

The other 223 that I kinda am fond of is the SIG 556...but I am not really a Black Rifle kind O person. So what I have will do.

Actually I would rather have a nice single shot or percussion rifle.

I would say that the AR is the Corvette C-5 of the automotive world, the AK is the Mustang GT. The Mini-14 is an LS-1 Camaro.

I shot my brothers SIG 556 about a month ago, when i first got my Bushmaster AR. My AR outshot it. My brother sold the SIG within 3 days afterwards. :D

The AK74 is as destructive to tissue as any Nato round. Built well, however, the guns aren't much cheaper. However, they are rather robust-built to be dumped from helicopters on pallets, rolled around in the mud etc. The 5.45 ammo is relatively cheap now, but once the surplus stuff is gone, it'll likely be really pricey.

I hated my Bushmaster Varminter...but it was as accurate a gun at distance I have ever owned. The gun was great, my relationship with it was less so.

I traded it, sans scope and for a lot of ammo, for a Ranch Mini-14 with scope. I am a lot happier.

What I paid and what I got for it are 2 different things....
your benchmark price is about what I paid. But that was before the rush, and I knew a deal when I saw it...:D

MINI 14's barrels heat up and accuracy goes DOWN>

Same thing happens with a military AK barrel or an M-16A1 pencil barrel.

Most combat occurs inside 100 meters, and most civilian combat inside 10 feet. IMO it's a total non-issue.

If it's actually something you care about they do sell mini-14 HBAR's though.

AK-74s have never caught on in the US, i think they're still banned under the import ban from the early 90s.

Everyone uses the 7.62x39 round, and almost everyone uses crappy wolf JHP ammo that doesn't perform very well in ballistic gelatin.

That being said, no way in fk i want to get shot ANYWHERE by an AK!!!

Just like my Porsches, I prefer to build my own AR. This after I bought the first one and realize how simple and crappy (my quality standard may differ from most) a lot of them are. The majority of ARs use the same damn parts with different marketing and price. So anyhow I probably wouldn't mind spending a lot of money on a well built AK but I fear I'll be disappointed. But the extra punch would be fun.

Tabs what's a good price on a milled receiver rifle these days?

What did you hate about it?

My BM has only had about 500rds through it. Except for a the time i used a Sig magazine it's never jammed or hiccuped in any way (it jammed every other round with the sig mag, what a POS). It is aslo freakishly accurate. It has to be an aberration how accurate this rifle is.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b3...iper/ARHK2.jpg

Hornady is starting to product 7.62 (with Russian casings). Maybe they would be good rounds to hord while practicing with the Wolf stuff.

Most likely. Hornady is not in the business of making junk, that's for sure.

I have seen the Milled Norinco's NIB go for $1450 plus buyers premium at auction. New Arsenal Milleds are going for $1750.

So I would guess that anything under a $1000 would be better buy it today...for it will be gone tommorow. That said the guy who bought my AK didn't even argue about the price. He was the one would told me they are getting harder to find and wanted to buy it before they dried up.

The limited edition Arsenal Milled SIDE FOLDER (metal tube skelton buttstock) is the one to find. Only 300 of those were made. Those are about $1700 now. Had one and used it as part of my SR25 deal. They were 1300 when new.

First of all, the Bushmaster is a great gun. It never jammed, was stupid accurate and had fit and finish.

But I didn't like how it felt on my shoulder...it just felt wrong: trigger pull, weight, balance.

Preference in fire arms is so subjective, Snipe. The mini-14 is a better fit, for me.

I love my Rock River Arms Varmiter. It is dead nuts accurate as well. I also like my M1A.

Bill

A friend of mines Daddy once told me that the best isn't always the best. His meaning was the top of the line product...That is certainly true of Washing Machines, Refrigerators and TVs. However in Spoons quality is always the best. So always buy the best quality you can afford. It may hurt you when you pull the wallet out, but later on you will be pleasantly surprised.

That is not to say you don't try an find the best deal. when buying a used spoon of the same model as new the price structure should be just below the price that it can be bought from a Distributor. Thus a Glock at 450 Distributor a good price for a used like new should be 425.

I thought this was gonna be a hillbilly vs Eskimo thread.

Bulgarian AK-74s are still being brought in and can be picked up for around $700 and up. The 5.45 stuff won't become popular until the 7.62x39 ammo or guns get expensive.

Well, the cost of living is very low in AR, but it's damn near impossible to get good homeowner's insurance. AK is beautiful, but if you. . . . . . .. .

Oh. Sorry.

The Eskimos want to know what you guys think of this AK?

http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/Hungarian_FEG_AMD-65_7.62x39_Rifle.html

http://www.centerfiresystems.com/AKAGUN20.aspx
http://www.centerfiresystems.com/bulgarianak-74545x39riflepartakagun-bul-1.aspx
http://www.centerfiresystems.com/DRA-GUN.aspx

I was just on the center fire website :)

My room mate just spent about 1200 with them. Following about 600 2 weeks ago.

The 74's aren't banned, you can get them from several sources. I had a 74U built by a gunsmith from a parts kit with the requisite number of American parts (and the stupid tax stamp). The real advantage from a shooters standpoint isn't so much the ballistics (I agree, either round will stop ya) but the relative lack of recoil compared to the 47, which has tons more recoil than an AR variant.

The wire shoulder stock is flimsy..and will flex on ya. I have generally heard good things about HU AK's but I am no expert on the matter.

Henderson Defense Industries builds one he11 of an AK or AR for that matter.

http://shop.hendersondefense.biz/main.sc

Skip the Romanian AK's

Thanks for the warning on the wire stock.

So what I'm hearing is that the AKs are crap because of cheap commie manufacturing. The only good ones are going to run $1200 with a milled steel receiver. At that point guys just buy a nice AR. Too simple a conclusion?


If I find ARs clunky and cheap for what some sell for, I'll probably regret buying an AK. So what's another semi- that eats 7.62x39?

Or do I just buy as much 77 and 80 grain 5.56 as I can find. Thems are no cheap rounds. I would build a 6.8 SPC but ammo availability is a little questionable and I don't reload.

I'll just stick to my lever guns and be better armed than all the fools with their plastic mouse guns.

Maybe I go this route and pickup a bolt action .308 first. Still looking for one. Just haven't been able to catch a show yet. But my FFL had a couple of Howas in stock that felt pretty good.