When did we...

legion · 11-11-2009, 06:05 AM

Go from celebrating victory to "remembering the fallen"?

It seems we don't celebrate when we win anymore.

Joeaksa · 11-11-2009, 06:22 AM

Kinda like "Merry Christmas" to "Happy Holidays" it seems.

Am an "old fashioned" kind of guy and we do things the old ways in my house. Oh yea, we plan on winning or do not even leave the house...

Joe A

ckissick · 11-11-2009, 06:27 AM

Huh? If you're talking about today's holiday, Veteran's Day, it started out as Armistice Day, in honor of those who died in WWI, which we won, BTW.

After WWII and the Korean War, it was re-named Veteran's Day, to honor the fallen in those wars. We won WWII, and sort of won the Korean War, although you could argue that it's not yet over.

It is an interesting question, though. I think it's human nature to reflect on the heroes. When a big war ends, the people celebrate for a few days, then they remember all those who died. It becomes unseemly to celebrate. Instead, we look back with sadness and reverence on those who cannot join in on the celebrations. That sadness and reverence is what endures.

Laneco · 11-11-2009, 06:29 AM

My humble opinion is that there are two factors at work here...

One is that it is not "politically correct" for a country to celebrate victory when watching every newscast, are those who were defeated.

Second factor is that when most of those who fought were alive, we celebrated a victory. But now that most of them are gone (WWI and WWII), we remember the fallen, both in battle and much after the fact.

I don't know when this shift occurred, but I agree that it has occurred.

angela

daepp · 11-11-2009, 06:30 AM

I have always thought that there would be no better way to celebrate veterans and Veterans Day than to allow them - and only them - to have the day off from work with pay. Why do the rest of workers get the day off with pay?

stomachmonkey · 11-11-2009, 06:30 AM

Because the fallen made the ultimate sacrifice for that victory.

I'm ok with honoring them over celebrating victory.

Gogar · 11-11-2009, 06:32 AM

I"m with Chris. I move that we change the name of "Veterans' Day" to

"Eleventy-leven."

And pay tribute by draping American flags on our cars, blasting our stereos, cruising our cars up and down the street, shooting into the air, and getting completely hammered on Tequila,

a-la "Cinco de Mayo."

widebody911 · widebody911's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by daepperson

i have always thought that there would be no better way to celebrate veterans and veterans day than to allow them - and only them - to have the day off from work with pay. Why do the rest of workers get the day off with pay?

+1

rcecale · rcecale's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by DAEpperson

Why do the rest of workers get the day off with pay?

So they can hit up all those department store Veterans Day sales, silly!

Randy

M.D. Holloway · 11-11-2009, 06:40 AM

I like the fact that its about the Vets. As for the win, well in Amerika these days everyone gets a trophy...and don't smack talk...play nice...don't hurt anyones feelings...and give to those who don't want to work...

74-911 · 11-11-2009, 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DAEpperson

I have always thought that there would be no better way to celebrate veterans and Veterans Day than to allow them - and only them - to have the day off from work with pay. Why do the rest of workers get the day off with pay?

That is exactly what we did at our business. Out of 25-30 employees we had 9 vets (including 3 of the 4 partners). Only the vets got the paid day off. Some of the others *****ed and moaned but life just ain't fair sometimes...

legion · 11-11-2009, 06:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DAEpperson

I have always thought that there would be no better way to celebrate veterans and Veterans Day than to allow them - and only them - to have the day off from work with pay. Why do the rest of workers get the day off with pay?

People get the day off today?

My employer (who is a HUGE recruiter of ex-military) has a white-tablecloth breakfast every year for veterans and encourages them to wear their uniforms to work on this day. They are also highly supportive of people in the various "reserves". The head of my whole project (1,000+ people) is Navy reserve, and spends a month out of every year out at sea teaching college classes...

(The ONLY way to walk into a high-level position and not work your way up from within where I work is through the military. We snagged Colin Powell's chief of staff a few years ago when he retired.)

The Gaijin · 11-11-2009, 07:55 AM

11/11 was the end of World War I. But we already had a "remembrance day" in the form of Memorial Day. So it became Veterans Day. In Europe and Canada it is a different holiday.

"VE Day" in England is the only holiday I have experienced celebrating a victory, but that is less and less as that generation passes..

Joeaksa · 11-11-2009, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 74-911

That is exactly what we did at our business. Out of 25-30 employees we had 9 vets (including 3 of the 4 partners). Only the vets got the paid day off. Some of the others *****ed and moaned but life just ain't fair sometimes...

Will be glad to trade you. There are some us who are vets and who are as well unemployed right now. We would be happy to have a job and a paycheck, even if it meant watching those who deserve it taking a paid day off.

red-beard · red-beard's Garage

Massachusetts mandates 12 paid holidays a year, the 2 extra are "Patriots Day" and "VJ Day".

Tishabet · 11-11-2009, 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by red-beard

Massachusetts mandates 12 paid holidays a year, the 2 extra are "Patriots Day" and "VJ Day".

That's only for state employees, who also get Evacuation Day. I am not a state employee, thus I work on all three.

DanielDudley · 11-11-2009, 04:04 PM

For many of us, it is Veteran's Day. For some of you it sounds like Beech about it day.

There was a gunman in our local school yesterday, and I think he was a desperate veteran. No one was hurt or killed, thank God and the Police, FBI, etc.

I really don't want to hear your sorry azzed whining. There will be plenty of money to take care of him NOW. Remember Vietnam, remember Desert storm, and remember our veterans. I for one remember when all they got was dirty looks from the public, and a lot of them are still getting the runaround.

But go ahead and tell us how it should be done...

DanielDudley · 11-11-2009, 04:17 PM

Joeaksa, my apologies. Thank you for serving, and I wish you well. I used to be Carpentry Supervisor for Grand Canyon National Park Lodges. The jobs there don't pay great, but the benefits are very good, and there is decent housing.

Probably not what you need, but I would be happy to write you a letter of recomendation. Good people up there.

BLEW911 · 11-11-2009, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ckissick

Huh? If you're talking about today's holiday, Veteran's Day, it started out as Armistice Day, in honor of those who died in WWI, which we won, BTW.

After WWII and the Korean War, it was re-named Veteran's Day, to honor the fallen in those wars. We won WWII, and sort of won the Korean War, although you could argue that it's not yet over.

It is an interesting question, though. I think it's human nature to reflect on the heroes. When a big war ends, the people celebrate for a few days, then they remember all those who died. It becomes unseemly to celebrate. Instead, we look back with sadness and reverence on those who cannot join in on the celebrations. That sadness and reverence is what endures.

The VFW's Davis said some people remain confused about who the United States' various military-oriented holidays honor.

Memorial Day, the last Monday in May, is set aside for Americans to honor those who died in service of the country.

"Veterans Day is about everybody who wore or continues to wear the uniform," he said. "It's a very select group of American citizens that have had the opportunity to do that."