Cash for clunkers question

[Scott R]

I make a lot of my living buying cars at auction and reconditioning them for private sale. This means I spend a lot of time at a few salvage yards getting parts. C for C cars are flooding the isles, you can spot them because in green they say "C 4 C" on them in spray paint, and the engines are painted bright green with the same paint.

Well today I need some Rover parts, lots of them junked now for this program, and I go to pull a timing cover from the block. I take the timing cover and a few other bits to the counter to check out and we get into a debate over what you can and can't pull from a C 4 C car.

Parts guy says "10 bucks." Manager comes over and says you can't pull engine parts. Parts guys tells manager he's been selling everything down to the pistons on these things. We all stand around and try and read the paperwork the yard has on hand and it's not clear. The only direction they have is on how to destroy the engine.

Anyone know how this works, or have a good link to some clear wording on this program? I've been buying everything from injectors to oil pans on these cars for weeks without incident, until today. "Clunkers" like Rovers and late model benz make me a lot of money, but if my parts source dries up I'm kind of screwed.

[teenerted1]

that was one of the major complants about the c4c system for dismantlers. they were supposed to crush the WHOLE car.

[Scott R]

Originally Posted by teenerted1

that was one of the major complants about the c4c system for dismantlers. they were supposed to crush the WHOLE car.

They're not, a good 20% of the yard I use are C4C cars. Some of the best used parts come off them, at least for me.

[aigel]

Sorry to side track, but what were the instructions to destroy the engine?

This program was a huge waste of resources.

George

[MBAtarga]

Selling pistons from a C4C destroyed engine? How in the world can they be usable after being ground to bits with that liquid silica solution they were supposed to use to kill the car?

[Scott R]

Originally Posted by MBAtarga

Selling pistons from a C4C destroyed engine? How in the world can they be usable after being ground to bits with that liquid silica solution they were supposed to use to kill the car?

Internals of the engine I cracked today were looking better than my 911 at 143K. New set of rings and you're back on the road. I don't think whoever came up with the demise of these cars was very bright. I'll post pictures tomorrow, but I was next to a guy pulling a crank from an integra that was perfectly usable.

These are expensive cars being parted, BMW M5, Rover Disco 2's and Range Rovers. Benz 500 series, nice SAABS and Caddys. Seems like a shame that they are sitting here rusting, but hell it's all money for me. Why would people toss away a 8k car for a 4k credit I'll never understand.

The interesting part of all of this is that my brother and I operate a "buy here pay here" car lot and we are dealing with a lot C4C repos, and people that traded nice cars in to be trashed that can not make payments on the new ones.

I hate to say I make money off these unfortunate scenarios, but I do. If I could get like 5 more c4c bills past I don't think I would have to work anymore. On people with repos I'm getting 45% interest (state max) in cash payments, and business is good.

I feel like an ass some days, but these people could be taking the bus I suppose. If I get 3 payments at my rate I've covered the cost of the car, then I repo the car and sell it again when they miss a payment. Been doing this since July now. I'm probably going to hell for this

[m21sniper]

All sounds quite familiar to me, says the repo man.

[nynor]

Originally Posted by Scott R

Internals of the engine I cracked today were looking better than my 911 at 143K. New set of rings and you're back on the road. I don't think whoever came up with the demise of these cars was very bright. I'll post pictures tomorrow, but I was next to a guy pulling a crank from an integra that was perfectly usable.

These are expensive cars being parted, BMW M5, Rover Disco 2's and Range Rovers. Benz 500 series, nice SAABS and Caddys. Seems like a shame that they are sitting here rusting, but hell it's all money for me. Why would people toss away a 8k car for a 4k credit I'll never understand.

The interesting part of all of this is that my brother and I operate a "buy here pay here" car lot and we are dealing with a lot C4C repos, and people that traded nice cars in to be trashed that can not make payments on the new ones.

I hate to say I make money off these unfortunate scenarios, but I do. If I could get like 5 more c4c bills past I don't think I would have to work anymore. On people with repos I'm getting 45% interest (state max) in cash payments, and business is good.

I feel like an ass some days, but these people could be taking the bus I suppose. If I get 3 payments at my rate I've covered the cost of the car, then I repo the car and sell it again when they miss a payment. Been doing this since July now. I'm probably going to hell for this

hah! i, for one, called it. C4C, what a joke. and the poor idiots that took the POtuS up on his fool offer have to pay back the credit they got. i love it. i'll keep my rover, my 951, and my forester, thank you very much.

BTW, do you have a line on fan shroud for a '96 disco?

[red-beard]

Scott, the sad part to me is that many of these C4C cars could have been used for people who would work, but need a car, and can't afford one.

[jyl]

Scott said "These are expensive cars being parted, BMW M5, Rover Disco 2's and Range Rovers. Benz 500 series, nice SAABS and Caddys. Seems like a shame that they are sitting here rusting, but hell it's all money for me. Why would people toss away a 8k car for a 4k credit I'll never understand."

Do you think those are the typical clunker trade-in vehicle? That's not true at all.

Here are the facts. 677,000 vehicles were traded in. 3,515 were BMWs, 2,158 were Land/Range Rovers, 590 were SAABs, I can't tell how many Cadillacs, they're all GMs in the report. http://www.cars.gov/files/reports/additional-statistics.pdf

And you think your parts source is going to dry up due to clunkers? That's not likely.

How many Land/Range Rovers are in salvage yards throughout the US. They sold the 500,000th Land/Range Rover in the US back in June 2009 (that's counting since 1987). And they are such pieces of crap that I'd think a pretty large number are in graveyards. For sure we know 100,000 were sold by 1997, most of those have probably been retired by now. So how much is the clunkers program actually threatening your supply of junked Land/Range Rovers? 2,158 vehicles out of at least 100,000 junked so far? 2,158 out of 500,000 to be junked eventually?

Some people have this idea that the clunkers program destroyed valuable cars. Well, people are not that stupid, they didn't dump valuable cars for $4,500. 84% of cars traded in were trucks (includes SUVs), 70% were domestics. Avg mpg of the trade-ins was 15.8 MPG. That's from govt stats. These were old vehicles: according to a large dealership chain, 93% of the trade-ins had >100K miles. Another large chain said avg MPG of their trade-ins was 138K miles. The top ten vehicles traded in were all American SUVs, trucks and vans (list below).

So, the typical clunker trade-in was a old, very high-mileage, Detroit pickup or SUV or minivan. We all know how about how much that vehicle is worth - about a thousand bucks, if in nice shape. As a dealer trade-in, maybe $500.

1. Ford Explorer 4WD
2. Ford F150 Pickup 2WD
3. Jeep Grand Cherokee 4WD
4. Jeep Cherokee 4WD
5. Ford Explorer 2WD
6. Dodge Caravan/Grand Caravan
7. Chevrolet Blazer 4WD
8. Ford F-150 Pickup 4WD
9. Chevrolet C1500 Pickup 2WD
10. Ford Windstar

[nynor]

i can't find a single rover in the junkyards around here. no joke. but i can find plenty of detroit crap.

then again, their engines are based on a buick small-block, if i'm not mistaken.

[jyl]

I used to get my Rangie parts from a place around Sacramento CA, they had them stacked three high, probably a hundred Range Rovers plus bits.

FYI Scott I think the salvage yard is permitted to sell all parts except chassis and engine block. If the trans, rear end, etc are separated they can be sold too. Hopefully some digging will confirm this.

From govt website:

Are there certain parts of the trade-in vehicle that must be crushed or shredded?
YES. The chassis of the trade-in vehicle, including anything not removed from the chassis, the engine block and the drive train (unless the drive train is broken down so that the transmission, drive shaft and rear end are sold as separate parts) must be crushed or shredded by the disposal facility. CARS.gov - Car Allowance Rebate System - Dealer FAQ - Formerly Referred to as “Cash for Clunkers”

[nynor]

only a hundred? there are that many explorers at the pick and pull here....