Just inspected my rental property for the first time in two yrs.

[fintstone]

Better be careful to research the law where your property is regarding keeping damage deposit money to cover disputed or unpaid rent. AFAIK, in most places, they must be kept seperated...and interest must be accrued on any deposit.

[mistertate]

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

The lease says that tenants are responsible for the first $50 of any service call.

Wow, I've been renting since 1993 and I'm glad I never had an agreement like that on the lease. Does that include normal wear and tear items? How old was the garage door opener? Is that to keep people from calling you every time a lightbulb burns out? I think most people would neglect a place that wasn't theirs if it cost them $50 every time something went wrong. Or fix it themselves and then you never know what you're in for. People that rent typically are poor, otherwise they would buy their own place.
How important is it to change an AC filter?
Cost of carpet shampooing seems reasonable.

[RoninLB]

a landlord has more control in a 2 family when he lives there

a high end 3 bd apt goes for around $2,300/mo + they pay heat and electric

even after a one yr rental the apt always gets new paint and dolled up etc

taking tenants to court for any reason is usually a waste. For an eviction you have to find a lawyer that does those cases routinely to see any action.


being how this is a beach town small 1 or 2 bd apts go for $15k and good 3 bds for $30k. Often is city people with few options besides the Hamptons. Season is 10 week lease. A few still available.

[silverwhaletail]

Rick;

It's a FK'ing rental. Lighten up.

The carpet was not new when the tenant moved in, correct? So you got the use out of it for the time that you lived there AND two years of rental. That's a decent return on investment. Get over it.

As the other guys stated, Tile/Linoleum/ or my favorite .72 Cents a square foot laminate. Buy from Home Depot or Lowes and KEEP THE RECEIPT. (you should be doing this for taxes anyway.

Where you HAVE to have carpet, call any property management company and ask them where they buy their carpet. Carpet/pad and install should be $9 a yard. ( I think, my wife could tell me for sure.) It should be brown and it looks like motor oil was swirled into it when it is new. That is how you know that you have the right carpet.

Renters don't receive substantial deposits back unless YOU are trying to get rid of them and you use the deposit as an incentive to get them to move out immediately.

Rape them on the cleaning fee. Rape them on the doorbell repair. Rape them on the interior walls (not the paint) that the cable guy punched holes in. Rape them on the door knobs that they broke. Rape them on the parts that are damaged/missing from the stove. Rape them on the missing/broken dishwasher rack. Rape them on the broken closet sliding doors. Rape them on the door keys, mailbox keys and laundry room keys that they didn't return. Rape Rape Rape.

Sodomy is your friend.

Landlording is a blood sport.

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by motion

Rick, I'm with you... I am terrified about doing inspections while tenants are still in the home. I know I won't like what I see, so I prefer to stick my head in the sand...

Same here. I have one rental that I have not been inside of since 1985. The same (initial) tenants are still there. I guess that since they paid the mortgage off for me in 1995...the house could be destroyed inside and I would still have done quite well. When we drive past that home, even after the tenants have paid us rent for 25 years...my wife wants to jump out and run up to the door and scream at/evict them, because one of the small bushes (cost about $5) we planted in 1981 has died/is gone.

If it is a home that you bought to live in yourself (and not initially as an investment), it is really hard to get over the pain of having tenants not take care of your home as well as you would have. Just remember that it is a business. The way to make money is to keep tenants a very long time. You save the costs of vacancy, advertising, refurbishment and any damage is amortized over a long period so that it becomes only pennies per month.

[fastfredracing]

Dont feel too guilty about keeping whatever amount of the security deposit that you feel is neccessary to cover cleaning/repair costs. Just make an itemized list, and document it. If they broke the lease early, I would keep the whole ammount. A lease is a contract for the full amount of rent divided into 12 payments.

[Rick Lee]

They didn't break the lease early. They tried. Lease goes until April 20th and I expect to have a check for the pro-rated month waiting when I get home. I'm in NJ now.

House was PERFECT when we vacated. I had it professionally cleaned and carpets shampooed. Not some Home Depot rental, but done by a pro. I probably still have an email from the tenant saying how nice it looked when they moved in. Can't say the same for it present condition.

[motion]

I love it when they have the balls to show up for the move-out inspection and the place is trashed. I had this happen about a year ago. The house needed $5K just to be livable again. The schlep walked around with me for 2 hours while I wrote down all the damage. He didn't see any of his lousy $800 deposit.

[Seahawk]

Originally Posted by fintstone

The way to make money is to keep tenants a very long time. You save the costs of vacancy, advertising, refurbishment and any damage is amortized over a long period so that it becomes only pennies per month.

I settled on that path after seven frustrating years of tenants staying two years and out. Lowered the rental bit, found a tenant that was long term and haven't raised the rent in eight years. She keeps the place immaculate, the yard looks great and there are zero issues.

Honestly, if she ever vacates I may sell the place. As it is, the place is nearing the end of it's amortization schedule, may need siding soon, etc.

[Rick Lee]

I thought I did pretty well getting the last tenants to sign a two year lease. I'd love to be able to do that again. They would have renewed, but the guy lost his job and found a new one in TX. Honestly, they could have totally screwed me, since he lost in job around December and they could have just refused to pay anymore and have moved to TX before I'd have been able to evict them. But they kept paying.

The guy's wife's father is a realtor and they had him look over the lease before they signed it. He added the caveat about being able to break the lease for a job transfer. Little did I know at the time that the husband's job was with a family business, so they'd have had no problem getting some kind of transfer order written up on company letterhead to break the lease. But I think the company sold or went under. And the lease language says the transfer has to be with the same employer they listed on the rental application. He ended up finding another job somewhere else for a while and then quitting that one to take a better one in TX. So that's not what I call a transfer.

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

...He added the caveat about being able to break the lease for a job transfer...

Just as well. No good would come out of trying to keep an unemployed family in the home when they had an opportunity elsewhere...even if it were to take a better opportunity. Soon the rent would stop...and they would still be there forcing a drawn out eviction. The rules are generally on the renter's side.

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by Seahawk

I settled on that path after seven frustrating years of tenants staying two years and out. Lowered the rental bit, found a tenant that was long term and haven't raised the rent in eight years. She keeps the place immaculate, the yard looks great and there are zero issues.

Honestly, if she ever vacates I may sell the place. As it is, the place is nearing the end of it's amortization schedule, may need siding soon, etc.

Yep. Me too. Except for one I just put into service a couple of years ago, the last time I had a new tenant in one of my houses was '98. Although I talk tough to them if they fall behind, etc...in reality, I would go to great lengths/expense to keep them. I keep rents low and let them do most anything they would like with the home..within reason. The rare occassion that they ask for repair or refurbishment, I quicky do so without giving them a lot of grief. I also have two that I would sell immediately if the tenants moved out since there is really no longer a tax advantage. I would/will probably sell the first vacant one (if the market permits) to pay off the remainder of my properties in an attempt to enter retirement debt free...or possibly do a 1030 exchange for another rental to begin a new depreciation cycle. I guess the best time to sell is after retiring when I have time do any necessary repairs/refurb myself and the tax burden will not be so significant due to my lower tax bracket/earnings/

[nostatic]

Originally Posted by silverwhaletail

Renters don't receive substantial deposits back unless YOU are trying to get rid of them and you use the deposit as an incentive to get them to move out immediately.

Rape them on the cleaning fee. Rape them on the doorbell repair. Rape them on the interior walls (not the paint) that the cable guy punched holes in. Rape them on the door knobs that they broke. Rape them on the parts that are damaged/missing from the stove. Rape them on the missing/broken dishwasher rack. Rape them on the broken closet sliding doors. Rape them on the door keys, mailbox keys and laundry room keys that they didn't return. Rape Rape Rape.

Sodomy is your friend.

Landlording is a blood sport.

Glad you're not my landlord. Last place I moved out of I got my entire deposit back except for $25 to cover a smoke detector that I lost (long story). I had a cleaning crew come in after the last box left. The landlord originally wanted to charge me for damage to the stove top. I pushed back - the stove was probably 15 years old and the top had damage when I moved in. In the end she didn't charge me because I'd lived in her building for 4 years, paid my rent on time, and didn't make a fuss.

I don't view the relationship as adversarial. I suppose there are crappy tenants out there, but evidently there are crappy landlords as well. If I had a landlord who obviously wanted to sodomize me (you can often tell before you move it), I'm not going to live there. My current landlord is a very nice guy. Part of the reason I moved in.

Sometimes in life you get what you give...

[DARISC]

I once owned 2 houses on a lot, a two unit, two story bldg., and a four unit single story bldg. that I rented out. Made good money on the rent and sold them all for a healthy profit after three years...three miserable years. Never again; not my cup of stress.

[Rick Lee]

Cleaning lady just finished up and called to say she was able to make the carpets look a lot better. I wonder how, since she doesn't have a steam cleaner and my tenants claimed they used one. Oh well, that was $150. I might be able swing back over there tomorrow on my way to DC. Otherwise, I'll have the neighbor inspect and tell me how the carpets look. My cleaning lady was the best money I ever spent when I lived there and I'm glad she's still doing it and remembered where the place was. I have no doubt the place smells like a new house now with a touch of pine.

[island_dude]

Rick,
I have been renting a two family house for 16 years and I have seen my fair share of pain. Fortunately, I had my bad experiences early and learned a few things. I don't know what the rental market is for you, but in 16 years I never had more than a month of vacant days. I stopped bothering with leases. They are basically unenforceable for a landlord. Its a one way commitment. I like tenancy at will agreements because they let me get rid of losers quickly if I want. Its much less expensive to have to find a new tenant than deal with a bad one.

[VaSteve]

Rick, you got lucky. Just dock their deposit for the cleaning, the $50 and maybe a little more for your time and effort and move on. It's a business expense and business to them. People take it personally when renters mess up a place they used to live in (I know I did).

I had 20 somethings rent my place and they deep fried a turkey IN THE HOUSE and ruined the basement carpet in the process.

I told them straight up, they weren't getting any $ back.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

The comments here are very telling about certain individuals' character (or lack thereof)

For the life of me, I've never understood why (some) landlords put the cheapest crap into a unit/building and then wonder why it attracts cheap people to live there. Seriously. If you CHOOSE to outfit your building with crappy "minimum standards" amenities, crappy cheap carpeting, crappy cheap cabinetry, etc. and then are a jackass to everyone who comes to look - trying to saddle them with oppressive fees, terms, etc. from the gitgo, who do you think it's going to attract? Yep, that's right - the people who have no choice but to accept your cheap, crappy building and it's crappy terms. And usually people in those kinds of situations are the ones who are going to give you problems.

Two aphorisms come to mind immediately reading this:

"You reap what you sow" and "if you build it, they will come".

For the same money, consider what will happen if you opt for nicer hardwood floors (which are more durable and you don't have to rip them up every five years), or tile, or virtually ANYTHING other than cheap institutional, "puke-grade" carpet, get some tasteful painting done (not just illegals who slap "eggshell white" all over everything including outlets and phone jacks), maybe a little wainscot paneling here or there and maybe a little crown moulding, paint the window/door frames a contrasting color (not just the aforementioned "eggshell white"), put decent looking plumbing fixtures (not ones that belong in a high school bathroom) and decent-looking light fixtures and who do you think THAT will attract? Yeah, a different demographic that has somewhat less B.O. and probably less likelihood of being a problem.

The choices you make (location, amenities, pricing level, terms, etc.) decide your market - and it varies wildly for prospective tenants. Enough of the "guilty until proven innocent" crap as a broad-brush generalization. Not all tenants/renters are problems/jerks. Many CHOOSE to rent - including me. The game is changing guys. The ASSumption that "everyone who rents is an irresponsible problem waiting to happen otherwise they'd be owners" has been utterly turned on its head. It's absolutely no longer the case - there is a potential pool of renters which spans the entire spectrum of incomes, levels of responsibility and general quality of personality. Your CHOICES determine where on that spectrum you're going to draw your renters from.

And frankly, given the current economic climate I can't understand why people would be looking to get into the landlording game right now anyway. I've looked into it several times and it never seems to pencil out. Is it just trying to cut losses in the hope that you'll find that ever-elusive person who's willing to pay 150% of market rate in perpetuity and whom you can bleed dry or what? Good luck with that.

Either way, I'm glad I'm renting right now. And I'm a damn good tenant who always leaves my places better than I found them. I've always gotten my deposits back too - and I can usually tell when the LL is going to be a prick, and I vote with my feet accordingly. Tip for anyone looking to rent - look at the quality of the paint work and look at the cars in the parking lot. That will tell you a lot about who your neighbors will be. Then draw your own conclusions. A word to the wise should be sufficient. Incidentally same logic goes for prospective purchases too - you can tell a lot about a neighborhood by construction quality and by what kind of cars are parked around.

[Chocaholic]

Originally Posted by fastfredracing

Sorry to hear, but be thankful, I have had a home totally destroyed by tenants. It took me six months of work to put it back together, and I had to clean some of the nastiest stuff I have ever seen. Landlording is not for the weak. We keep carpet to a minumum. bedrooms, and maybe one living area. Tile and linoleum are your friend.
All tenants lie. I have heard some great stories. It kind of sucks , but this business will harden you a little. I have some good tenants right now, but I have been through some woozies .
Good advice above, put in some berber carpet that will wear well, and in a color that will not show stains so much, fresh coat of paint where needed, and chalk it up to operating costs.

Ditto here. I'd say....all things considered, you had great tenants. They paid the rent and didn't destroy the place. No feces, fleas, rotting food on the floor, busted ceramic toilets, 2 foot deep grass? Dirty carpet and leaves in the garage have you upset? You may be in the wrong line of work.

After my experience, I'd return their entire deposit along with a note of appreciation for being great tenants. I'm out of that biz.

[Rick Lee]

I'm by no means a professional landlord or doing this because I want to. When I moved to AZ, I could not afford to put the house up for sale and deal with that long process. At the time it would have sat for 6-8 mos. before it sold and my window of opportunity to move to AZ was not going to stay open that long. My boss hired a woman to replace me in the DC office and took my territory away to give to her. I couldn't have stayed there if I wanted to, once all that had been set in motion. I rented my condo out because I had to. It's a nice place, an end unit in a good neighborhood and in a desireable area. The only downside, in terms of finding more tenants, is that they have since built more condo complexes all over the place, which are newer and nicer and cost the same as or a little more than my place. Perhaps I'm too critical of my tenants because they did stuff I never thought of doing as a renter. I've been renting in Phoenix for two years and personally deposit rent in the landlord's bank on the first day of each month. Never even thought of playing games with him, haven't damaged the house in any way and I fix everything myself, because it's faster than calling prop. mgt. and waiting for them to do something. And I know how to fix things. If the garage door opener dies, I'll buy a new one, install it myself and deduct the cost from the next month's rent. I'm not upset at my tenants for calling me to deal with it. But lying to me about having paid the guy was total BS. It shouldn't be the installer's problem to collect from two different parties, but when I'm told someone has already paid $50 and hasn't, that means my check is gonna be short by that amount. Just not adult-like behavior.

I'm still in NJ and staying in Bethesda, MD tonight. I'll try to leave soon so I can check the cleaned house out again before I go to MD. I'm guessing $200 minimum is what I'm keeping from the deposit. But I need to review the lease language at home before discussing this with the former tenants.