Eventfull F1 race in Valencia SPOILER

[Jim Richards]

The Red Nags are just PO'ed that they had another crappy race in spite of their illegal testing, ahh, I mean filming session. They really need to on their race pace, not their post-race whining.

[emcon5]

Originally Posted by Joeaksa

Which video are you talking about. The one I saw on Tivo showed all three cars coming very fast down the straight then starting the corner. As they turned the safety car was coming out of the pit exit but unless Hamilton wanted to do a panic stop (and thus have the red cars run into his rear end) he was ahead of the pace car ....

Still, he was given a penality and he preformed it. Rejoined in the same position he was in the beginning. End of story. Any egg on the faces belongs to the stewards from that point on regarding Hamilton IMHO.

See the white line across the track in the photo above? That is the one that matters. The Safety Car isn't on track until it passes that line. The Safety Car had half a length lead on Hamilton when it got to that line.

There is a slow-mo video here (Until FOM yanks it) YouTube - Hamilton Valencia F1-2010 - Safety Car Overtake - what they thought

You can see Hamilton checks up and matches the SC speed for a bit. Had he not, he would have got passed the SC easily before it hit the line, and in all likelihood, so would Alonso and maybe even Massa.

Hamilton checked up to try and get the Ferraris stuck behind the SC, and it worked. He mistimed the pass, but it was no issue with the gap he was able to pull with the field stuck behind Kobiashi before he served the penalty.

[emcon5]

[stuartj]

LOL emcon.

Regardless of whose fault that was, that was an ENORMOUS crash. Came down on his head on the ripple strip, and it was still going a million miles an hour when it hit the barrier.

I was (happily) gobsmacked when he hurled the wheel and climbed out. Amazing.

[GH85Carrera]

It was an amazing crash. I wonder if he will be hit with a fine since he did not put his steering wheel back on.

[ted]

Originally Posted by emcon5

There is a slow-mo video here (Until FOM yanks it) YouTube - Hamilton Valencia F1-2010 - Safety Car Overtake - what they thought

Hamilton checked up to try and get the Ferraris stuck behind the SC, and it worked. He mistimed the pass.

What a move, trying to block the F cars with the SC.
If the SC stripe were the end of pit out stripe Lewis would of nailed it.

[Joeaksa]

One thing the photo does not show is the closure rate. Does not matter if the car had stuck its nose over the white line if the car passing is going so fast that they would have a difficult time slowing or stopping.

Anyways as I said above, Hamilton did his drive through and still came in second. Whats done is done. Its the other guys who now need to worry.

[emcon5]

Originally Posted by Joeaksa

One thing the photo does not show is the closure rate. Does not matter if the car had stuck its nose over the white line if the car passing is going so fast that they would have a difficult time slowing or stopping.

Anyways as I said above, Hamilton did his drive through and still came in second. Whats done is done. Its the other guys who now need to worry.

The photo does not, but the video does.

Here is the link again: YouTube - Hamilton Valencia F1-2010 - Safety Car Overtake - what they thought

Hamilton matched the speed of the pace car, as it neared the line, he accelerated past it. Had he matched the speed of the car slightly ahead of it, rather than right behind it, there would have been no penalty and the Ferraris still would have got stuck behind it.

[Deschodt]

I am generally no fan of Ferrari and/or whining, but in this case you gotta admit they got screw#d! It does seem unfair that the guy who violated the Safety car rule (Hamilton) and who was only a second or so ahead of Alonso's ferrari only got penalised 30 minutes after he fully reaped the benefits of Kobayashi playing blocker ! And then again only for a drive through... A Stop and go right away might have been more appropriate... If Schumi had done this, they'd have thrown the FIA rulebook at him !

If Alonso had broken the rule as well, he likely would have finished 3rd at worst... that sends the wrong message, when the penalties are worth taking (not that McLaren, knew that at the time, I blame the stewards on that one)...

[MotoSook]

Charlie and his crew made a terrible call. They have the benefit of more video and info than we do as TV spectators, and they should have been more immediate with the penalty. 17 laps for them to penalize Hami and 5 seconds after the race for the rest....not appropriate if the FIA wants Safety to be a top priority.

Even the guys on Speed/Fox who are usually Hami-happy thought the drive through was not adequate.

The race wasn't allowed to take its course....

[DaveE]

After only getting a warning following his blatant waving / blocking of Petrov early in the year, is anyone really surprised at this?

It looks like the FIA have a new "Golden Boy".

[legion]

The ruling by the FIA regarding Hamilton was absolutely correct, but it should have been handed down 3-4 laps after the incident. (Where it would have had more of an impact.) I don't understand how NASCAR seems to be able to assess all penalties during the race on twice as many cars...

I like Hamilton, I understand what he was trying to do and why. (I always get a kick out of someone f***ing Alonso, especially in Spain.) It was a smart move, but he failed to execute it properly. A penalty was deserved. He had no idea at the time what the penalty would be. I think he knew he was close and went for it anyway.

As for the other penalty on all of the other cars, I still don't understand WTF happened?

[javadog]

Originally Posted by legion

I like Hamilton, I understand what he was trying to do and why.... It was a smart move, but he failed to execute it properly.

No, it was a chicken**** thing to do. He's starting to generate a pattern of doing things like this. He can drive with the best of them, so he doesn't need to pull stunts like this to get an advantage. It was clear that he deliberately tried to contravene the rules. If I'd been a steward, I'd have penalized him heavily for this.

The kid's getting a little arrogant.

JR

[ted]

Originally Posted by legion

As for the other penalty on all of the other cars, I still don't understand WTF happened?

Was it similar to LH but at a different SC xing line?

[GH85Carrera]

A little arrogant?

All the F1 drivers have big egos, his may not be the biggest ever, but it is close.

[Joeaksa]

Originally Posted by emcon5

Now the wanker Webber is blaming the accident on the Lotus!

From the BBC:

~~~~~

Webber said he had been caught unawares by Kovalainen's driving in the much slower Lotus as they approached Turn 12 on lap nine.

"Initially I thought Heikki was letting me go," said Webber. "Then I thought he was closing the door and started to make little movements.

"I thought, 'What is he doing?' And then he braked 80m before I did on the previous lap - it's a different category (the new teams are in).

He was behind me but I was defending and racing - he was not sure which way to go and at that moment I hit the brakes and he had no chance to react

"Picking up the tow, he goes across to the left, then across to the right, then left, then a little jink and we're still along way from the braking point.

"He was blocking pretty aggressively. The thing that caught me out was how early he braked.

"I still had everything under control. Heikki may have been braking for his corner, but for me it was a massive surprise."

Webber said he felt Kovalainen's defence of his position was pointless against a car that was so much faster.

"It takes two to tango," added Webber. "I've driven slow cars and when someone comes at that closing speed, how long is that going to last for? Another 15 seconds. So it's not worth it."

[Turbo_pro]

Originally Posted by Joeaksa

Now the wanker Webber is blaming the accident on the Lotus!

Wow, I didn't read a whole lot of blame there just a pretty concise explanation.
In the explanation Webber states "I was surprised".
Kovalainen was going too slow and was braking entirely too early.
I think the fault lies in non enforcement of the 107% rule.

I like Webber and the Red Bull team in general but their frustration level must be through the roof.
They've had the pace to be leading in every category and their luck (some self inflicted admittedly) has been horrendous.
At least they haven't blamed Bush

[Joeaksa]

I repeat, "the driver in the faster car is ALWAYS responsible" for the overtaking maneuver.

Especially when Webber says the Lotus was "closing the door" and "blocking him" which is pure BS.

First off Webber cannot assume that the Lotus even saw him so he has to drive in a manner that assumes that he has not been seen. Now Webber is saying that the driver was blocking him?

As far as the Lotus braking early, none of us were in the car with him and had no idea what was going on with the brakes. We know that at least two other cars were having severe brake issues and its not up to Webber to assume anything regarding any other car and their braking points.

Come on now, this is pure BS. Webber made a very high profile mistake and does not want to admit his error. Frankly he has been a jerk all weekend long (see him on the qual session ending where he would not even say hello to Vetel or Hamilton, then barely stood with them for photos?) and is continuing in this vein.

[Henry Schmidt]

I'm not interested in defending Webber but as someone who raced professionally for 12 years, pros have an expectation that the car you are closing on will move once then hold it's line. You do (rightly or wrongly) have an expectation that the driver in front will perform predictably and responsibly.

[Joeaksa]

Originally Posted by Henry Schmidt

I'm not interested in defending Webber but as someone who raced professionally for 12 years, pros have an expectation that the car you are closing on will move once then hold it's line. You do (rightly or wrongly) have an expectation that the driver in front will perform predictably and responsibly.

Henry,

Agree but as someone who also raced professionally that goes out of the window when you are trying to pass someone who is coming into a corner. Until you are 110% positive that they see you, you cannot guarantee that they even know you are there, so its in the hands of the faster overtaking car.

My guess is that the Lotus was concentrating on the corner, saw Webber in the mirrors at the last second and out of reflex started to move away from his line going into the corner. Either way Webber was the overtaking car and should have given him more room.

Joe A