The right thing to do...

[mikester]

I'm predicting two things:

1) I'll regret this
2) It'll end up in PARF

I noticed a thread from our resident 'lubricant specialist' and it got to me. Now, I think it is a wonderful post from our friend and I have no argument about it. Clearly he's a fine father raising a fine son. I hope that I am as successful with my boys as he is with his but still one word got to me.

Originally Posted by LubeMaster77

Our Son...


...sometimes the right thing is the tough thing...

...It’s a pretty true Christian thing to do as well...

Excellence all around and the only 'beef' I have is that it is the 'Christian' thing to do. Isn't it the 'human' thing to do? I mean if that's the 'Christian' thing to do what's the Jewish thing to do? My kids aren't Christian and I would like to think that they would do the right thing as well. That is what I teach them; they are Scouts (well, the older one is - the younger tags along and isn't quite old enough yet) as well - just not Christian.

I know I know, I'm being a d[i]ck and I don't mean to be but being in a largely Christian society has its pitfalls and this is one of them. I'm taking some frustration out on Lubie partly because I know he can take it and partly because generally speaking I just have to bottle it up and throw away the bottle opener. My oldest started school last year and both years when the school board was working on their yearly schedule the small group of Jews in the community went to the board meeting to try to get the children days off for the high holy days. A very important time of the year for folks like us and both times we have been denied our request. The schedule would not take into account our meager request of a two days off for this year. I think it was 1 last year. The problem last year was that it was the FIRST day of school all we wanted was for them to push a day - not a big deal. They even said it wasn't a big deal but in the end they wouldn't do it and wouldn't explain why. This year instead of giving us our couple of days they decided the kids should have Halloween and Valentine's day off. YAY!

Now why can't my kid just take the day off for these religious holidays? Well they can (And did) but then the district loses money because the kids are absent and they ask the parents to reimburse the school for that lost money. $35 a day...

I tell them 'oh, it's a reasonable request but I can't do it and I can't tell you why.'

Lubie, please forgive me I did not mean to single you out and I know you meant no harm with your wording - it just got to me. I'm not asking you to be 'PC' for the sake of us non-Christians I'm just using as a point to vent a little frustration.


I know PLENTY of Christians who are considerate - I grew up in a scout troop myself that was mixed Jews and Christians - we all got a long fine and every year we sold Christmas trees (which our current organization does too). It just seems that none of these considerate and thoughtful folks are on the school board...

[masraum]

Originally Posted by mikester

My oldest started school last year and both years when the school board was working on their yearly schedule the small group of Jews in the community went to the board meeting to try to get the children days off for the high holy days. A very important time of the year for folks like us and both times we have been denied our request. The schedule would not take into account our meager request of a two days off for this year. I think it was 1 last year. The problem last year was that it was the FIRST day of school all we wanted was for them to push a day - not a big deal. They even said it wasn't a big deal but in the end they wouldn't do it and wouldn't explain why. This year instead of giving us our couple of days they decided the kids should have Halloween and Valentine's day off. YAY!

Wow, Halloween and Valentines? Really? Those were never holidays when I was growing up. And yet they wouldn't do the 2 Jewish holidays.

The ONLY semi-justifiable reason that I can come up with for NOT scheduling the Jewish holidays is that it would set a precedent for other religions to request days off, and isn't the school supposed to be "separate" from religion? No prayer in school and all that. Are any other religious holidays still observed? I believe Christmas is now often called "Winter break", and I don't think most places get "Good Friday" or "Easter" holidays any more. So technically you were asking for something that no one (religious groups) else gets which if you'd gotten it would allow (and apply pressure to the board to give) EVERY OTHER religious group to ask for days off. If every Hindu, Muslim, Christion, Buddhist, Jewish, Kwanza, etc... holiday was observed, kids would have to go to school year round.

Now why can't my kid just take the day off for these religious holidays? Well they can (And did) but then the district loses money because the kids are absent and they ask the parents to reimburse the school for that lost money. $35 a day...

Wow, really, the school asks parent to pay $35 every time a kid misses school? that's absolutely bizarre!

[stomachmonkey]

Originally Posted by masraum

The ONLY semi-justifiable reason that I can come up with for NOT scheduling the Jewish holidays is that it would set a precedent for other religions to request days off, and isn't the school supposed to be "separate" from religion?

Not a high enough percentage of Jews would be my guess.

.......Are any other religious holidays still observed?

FYI on Long Island we got both Christian and Jewish Holidays off. See my previous comment.


I believe Christmas is now often called "Winter break", and I don't think most places get "Good Friday" or "Easter" holidays any more. So technically you were asking for something that no one (religious groups) else gets which if you'd gotten it would allow (and apply pressure to the board to give) EVERY OTHER religious group to ask for days off. If every Hindu, Muslim, Christion, Buddhist, Jewish, Kwanza, etc... holiday was observed, kids would have to go to school year round.

I think it's fair for schools to shut down for the major religious holidays proportionate to the representation of any given religion. Remember it's not just the kids, you have teachers and administrators who also observe.

Wow, really, the school asks parent to pay $35 every time a kid misses school? that's absolutely bizarre!

That's BS. I'd tell em exactly why my kid was out and tell them to pound sand.

In Dearborn they close for Ramadan and the HS football teams practice after 11pm.

[stomachmonkey]

Originally Posted by mikester

I'm predicting two things:

1) I'll regret this
2) It'll end up in PARF

I noticed a thread from our resident 'lubricant specialist' and it got to me. Now, I think it is a wonderful post from our friend and I have no argument about it. Clearly he's a fine father raising a fine son. I hope that I am as successful with my boys as he is with his but still one word got to me.



Excellence all around and the only 'beef' I have is that it is the 'Christian' thing to do. Isn't it the 'human' thing to do? I mean if that's the 'Christian' thing to do what's the Jewish thing to do? My kids aren't Christian and I would like to think that they would do the right thing as well. That is what I teach them; they are Scouts (well, the older one is - the younger tags along and isn't quite old enough yet) as well - just not Christian.

I know I know, I'm being a d[i]ck and I don't mean to be but being in a largely Christian society has its pitfalls and this is one of them. I'm taking some frustration out on Lubie partly because I know he can take it and partly because generally speaking I just have to bottle it up and throw away the bottle opener. My oldest started school last year and both years when the school board was working on their yearly schedule the small group of Jews in the community went to the board meeting to try to get the children days off for the high holy days. A very important time of the year for folks like us and both times we have been denied our request. The schedule would not take into account our meager request of a two days off for this year. I think it was 1 last year. The problem last year was that it was the FIRST day of school all we wanted was for them to push a day - not a big deal. They even said it wasn't a big deal but in the end they wouldn't do it and wouldn't explain why. This year instead of giving us our couple of days they decided the kids should have Halloween and Valentine's day off. YAY!

Now why can't my kid just take the day off for these religious holidays? Well they can (And did) but then the district loses money because the kids are absent and they ask the parents to reimburse the school for that lost money. $35 a day...

I tell them 'oh, it's a reasonable request but I can't do it and I can't tell you why.'

Lubie, please forgive me I did not mean to single you out and I know you meant no harm with your wording - it just got to me. I'm not asking you to be 'PC' for the sake of us non-Christians I'm just using as a point to vent a little frustration.


I know PLENTY of Christians who are considerate - I grew up in a scout troop myself that was mixed Jews and Christians - we all got a long fine and every year we sold Christmas trees (which our current organization does too). It just seems that none of these considerate and thoughtful folks are on the school board...

I understand your frustration. My kids are Jewish. The girl is particularly militant about it. Primarily because she took some heat from some of the neighbor kids when we first moved here which was a big mistake on their part.

I don't see how your school system could legally charge or even request you to pay for the kids being out for religious observance. If the school officially closes or allows absences for even one Christian high day I'd say you have grounds for a very nice discrimination suit.

When we take the kids to service that conflicts with school we just send them in with a note explaining the absence was due to religious observance. We never hear a peep from anyone.

[mikester]

There is another school district that supports a different part of my small city and they did have those days off this year but I'm not sure if they always have or just this year.

With that in mind - I can't just switch because the services are different.

They school administration doesn't give me any trouble; they request the reimbursement for ANY absence - excused or not. It is a request, not a requirement and I do tell them to take a hike.

=-)

I do find it irritating that winter break happens around Christmas and Spring break is around Easter. It isn't a coincidence - when I was a kid winter break was called Christmas break though spring break was spring break. Back when I supported operations and was on call I always volunteered for Xmas on call duty in exchange for new years off. If I wanted any of my religious days off - which I never made a stink about - I had to take PTO or Vacation.

[vash]

Hey that thread had Christian and Retard in the same conversation. Don't they cancel each other out?

[nostatic]

fwiw the Jewish holy days are off in Santa Monica and were in LAUSD on the westside. They were not however "official" days off but rather just listed as "NO SCHOOL" on the calendar. I guess that they happened to coincide with Yom Kippur and Rosh Hashana were a coincidence

Then again there is a significant Jewish population in west LA and SM. But they are not official religious holidays on the school calendar.

[onlycafe]

it's not a Christian thing to do, it's the christian thing to do.
that takes the religion out of it and makes it humane.
at least that's my opinion anyway.

and i think the $35 charge is ridiculous!
telling them to take a hike is way more christian than what i would say.

[Evans, Marv]

When I was a kid in school they called 'Winter Break," "Christmas vacation" and "Spring Break," "Easter vacation." That was before the hated PC thing. Adding two more days for religious observance to the schedule would call for a change in the schedule. They could do it, but would be understandably resistant to it. I don't know why they don't just understand parents can keep their kids out for the few days like that. Parents keep their kids out of school just because they want them to go shopping with them.

[Por_sha911]

Tell the school you will pay the $35 but that you want a refund for each time your child has had a substitute teacher since they pay the subs a fraction of what a regular teacher is paid.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by Evans, Marv

When I was a kid in school they called 'Winter Break," "Christmas vacation" and "Spring Break," "Easter vacation." That was before the hated PC thing. Adding two more days for religious observance to the schedule would call for a change in the schedule. They could do it, but would be understandably resistant to it.

Except that they still added 2 days, they were Halloween and Valentines. I guess technically, those are "religious" holidays, right, pagan and formerly Catholic?

[Zeke]

Jesus.... what a thread.

[Noah930]

Odd that the school district is giving you grief over the high holidays. But that's my personal frame of reference. Growing up in LA, as nostatic pointed out, you're surrounded by a huge Jewish community. I went to an Episcopalian high school, but probably a third of the kids were Jewish. So while the high holidays weren't days off, realistically none of the Jewish kids came to class and the teachers purposefully did nothing that couldn't easily be made up. Now that my kids go to public school, we're in a neighborhood where the most commonly spoken non-English language is Hebrew. IIRC, my kid was off from school for those couple days, too.

Funny aside: we recently had our 20th HS reunion. It was held on the Friday of Rosh Hoshanah. Two of the 3 kids on the organizing committee are Jewish.

[masraum]

I had no idea that there was such and extensive Jewish community in LA. I'd have just never expected it. I guess it comes up a bunch for the North East in TV and movies, but not so much in Cali.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by mikester

\

Now why can't my kid just take the day off for these religious holidays? Well they can (And did) but then the district loses money because the kids are absent and they ask the parents to reimburse the school for that lost money. $35 a day...

You are fined for being observant jews? Do you live in American or some eastern European country?

[GWN7]

Halloween can only be considered a holiday if your a Druid.

[widebody911]

Originally Posted by vash

Hey that thread had Christian and Retard in the same conversation. Don't they cancel each other out?

No, it's redundant, so it's additive.

[Superman]

He was just using that as a manner of speech. Another phrase might have been " the unselfish thing to do." All sin is a matter of selfishness. So, to a Christian, selfless deeds are "Christian.'

As a matter of fact, there is an interesting logical connection between belief in God and the feeling we have that we "ought to' be less selfish. It is, in my humble opinion, as CS Lewis so deftly pointed out, that part of us made in the 'image and likeness of God." I'm not going to go into the logical, philosophical details of his analysis, but it's pretty brilliant. It appears in his astonishingly simple and compelling book "Mere Christianity," which is a book for people whose intelligence gets in the way of their spirituality.

Now.....somebody send this to PARF where interesting discussions go to be censured.

[M.D. Holloway]

No probs dude, actually I refer to Christian thing only becasue we try to be Christian in our family. Its a religion that works for our family. It could have been a very Hebrew thing or a Zen thing but we ain't dat.

We all need a code and when your young religion helps form that. I can honestly say that if it wasn't for the kiddos we would not do the church thing. Also, we actully are better, calmer, safer people because of the kiddos.

[mikester]

Originally Posted by wdfifteen

You are fined for being observant jews? Do you live in American or some eastern European country?

No, that isn't what I said.

Any absence by any child - the school requests that if possible they be reimbursed for the day since they will not receive the funding for the child for that day.

Doesn't matter the day or the child.