Another CCW Saves the day..

[ODDJOB UNO]

hmmmm lets say the ccw guy was in a bank and YOU were in the bank. and exact same thing went down.


i think you'd be kissing mr ccw's azz you didnt get killed by these thieves.



and ...........................NO the ccw dood(dude) will NOT BE HELD LIABLE for stopping an armed robbery.


the ccw dood(dude) will get the key to the city and VANNA WHITE for a NIGHT!


it doesnt matter if its a lemonade stand/a lousy dollar store/ the u.s. mint/biggest bank in yer area......................ITS ALL ARMED ROBBERY!


i'm waiting for the 90 year old grandma ccw to thwart a armed robbery story.



that will make the headlines i promise ya.



gun(any type-pellet pistol/toy pistol rifle etc.) + "stick 'em up"=armed robbery = "yer gonna git dead real damn fast-cuz EVERYBODIES GONNA BEE SHOOTING AT CHOO(you)!"

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by porwolf

The question is: Was the shooter threatened?

It does not matter. He was present at a robbery and have every right - I say obligation - to protect the innocent people around him from harm.

Originally Posted by porwolf

Did the robbers have guns?

Again, it does not matter. This is not a game, and there is no obligation to be "fair" about it.

Originally Posted by porwolf

If not it is just a case of instant execution without a legal judicial process. Just like in the Middle East. Is that what we want the country to be.: A lawless society ruled by guns, like in Hollywood Westerns?

No, this is far, far different than the "executions" we see in the Middle East. This was a pair of criminals thwarted in the middle of an unprovoked act of criminal intent and potential violence. They were breaking the law and very clearly threatening those in their presence (such is the nature of robbery). Far different from the religiously driven wanton violence of the Middle East.

In a perfect world, any such robbers would place their lives on the line any time they attempt such nonsense. They are only emboldened by the notion that their victims are unarmed, and weaker than they are. Maybe the tables will turn one day, to where cowardly criminals really have to consider their own death as a possibility. That would be a good thing. Our judicial system sure can't seem to handle them.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by dennis in se pa

Pic in post #17 - just kids being kids - to me.

The pics of the kid could be ANY kid. Also the profile or statement from Facebook could be any teenager trying to sound cool or tough to other kids (which is 75% of them).

Even if he had been a relatively good kid, and if his one serious mistake was this one incident, it's unfortunate, but there is a price to pay, and he knew what he was doing.

It's unfortunate, and I'm certain it has caused his family pain, but I'm also quite pleased with the outcome.

There was a note at the end of the article that said that this was the sixth time in the past 18 months that an armed robber was kileedmyou by a CHL holder. I like that statistic, even if it is smaller than would be nice.

[skipdup]

Why does it seem the bad guy(s) always run the moment they face armed resistance.
Hmmm....

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by masraum

The pics of the kid could be ANY kid. Also the profile or statement from Facebook could be any teenager trying to sound cool or tough to other kids (which is 75% of them).

Even if he had been a relatively good kid, and if his one serious mistake was this one incident, it's unfortunate, but there is a price to pay, and he knew what he was doing.

It's unfortunate, and I'm certain it has caused his family pain, but I'm also quite pleased with the outcome.

There was a note at the end of the article that said that this was the sixth time in the past 18 months that an armed robber was kileedmyou by a CHL holder. I like that statistic, even if it is smaller than would be nice.

what if he panics & shot someones Grandmother, better to have the CCW guy take out this punk before he hurt someone. I know the area, it is a local story and not the nice side of town.. Course some are trying to make it about race, when it is about the crime..
Check out this Dumbass and his comments...

https://www.facebook.com/zachary.i.anderson

achary IamLegend Anderson commented on a link.
2 hours ago
If It Was A Black Man That Shot A White Man Everyone Of You Red Necks Would Be Saying Hang Him Let One Of You Family Members Get Gun Down Then See What Side You On I Never Said What He Did Was Right Just Upsets Me When People Are On Here Talking About Thank God Or That's Another One For Us And Don't Talk About The Bible When You Obviously Pray For Others To Feel Pain And Misery I'm Just Standing Up For Someone I'm Done With You Cowards On Here Just A Bunch Of Happy Ass Rednecks.

1 suspect killed, 2nd on run after store robbery
News 4 Jax | Jacksonville News, Jacksonville, Florida News, Weather, Sports | WJXT Channel 4
When two men tried to hold up a Dollar General store on the Northside on Monday night, a customer pulled his gun and shot one of the men twice.
Like · · Follow Post
24 people like this.

Tyrik FreeSlim Latreall smh its crazy how it was a man in the store with a gun durring the same time they was robbing it.
2 hours ago via mobile · Like · 1

Jeff Garrett it's not crazy, it's KARMA!
about an hour ago · Like

Sindia Ilderice Man ****KKK YALLL CRACKERS !!!!!!!!
about an hour ago via Text Message · Like

Ed Scheidde Rogers Tonsing He was robbing a store and earned himself a pair of bullets in his guts...No black or white here bro, this is a case of criminal versus law abiding citizen....When the day comes that a black guy with a legal and lawful conceal carry permit blasts a white guy that is robbing a store, I will jump up and down celebrating that true equality has finally reached the street level....
about an hour ago · Unlike · 3

Maureen Johnson Dude **** every ******* who has something negative to say! These are probably the same ass backward people who were standing behind Zimmerman & Casey Anthony. They don't know what a real struggle is so they talk side ways about someone who isn't here to defend himself... like you said, let one of their family members be put in a predicament where they can't find a job but have to feed their kids and see what they won't do.
about an hour ago via Text Message · Like

Ed Scheidde Rogers Tonsing This numbnut earned every grain and gram of lead that hit him....Any offspring he had are now eligible to collect the Social Security he never paid into (you have to have a job to do that)...Raising his children is now the problem and responsibility of the American taxpayer...That's the only downside I see in this....
about an hour ago · Like

Maureen Johnson Robbing someone is not the same as taking a life. Yes, what he did was wrong, but never the less a mother under any circumstances should never bury their child. Point blank period, Rakeem was not armed. If the customer wanted to play hero he should have detained him, not kill him.
36 minutes ago via Text Message · Like · 1

Rayann RipHorace how bout yall just shut tha **** up cuase yeen know my niqqa forreal ! he aaint earn his self no bullets that cracka wanted to be a hero and shoot somebody ! its okay doe cuase wehn iqet my concealed weapon permit yalll qon see my ass in jail cuase iaaint loosinq nobody else ! yall crackas play a dirty qame ! and yeah im white too buhd now people see why iqot so much hate built up foe white people ! yall jusst always wanna down talk black people ! like "yay another niqqer dead" or "im qlad this niqqer dead" ! iwish one ov you cracka's wuld come up to me sayinq some **** like that or een sayinq niqqer dass so disrespectful cuase yo ass qon end up on tha news dead ! you crackas aaint nothinq better than black people and ^^ this muh****a talmboud karma yeaa we cuh qet on that subject cuase ill shoot me a cracka str8 up no remorse cuase thats how yall makinq . its always some black person qettinq killed and dey dont do **** just talk aboud waht they done wronq buhd if its a white person they talk about what they accomplishments were and how qood of a kid they were ! yall sittinq here judqinq people by they race you aaint een know bruh you just know they version of the story !
4 minutes ago · Like

Check out the comments here.. http://www.news4jax.com/news/1-suspect-killed-2nd-on-run-after-store-robbery/-/475880/16290236/-/xmxlxsz/-/index.html?fb_comment_id=fbc_10151005811372191_225 38649_10151006600602191#f196e8d904

[widebody911]

Rayann RipHorace how bout yall just shut tha **** up cuase yeen know my niqqa forreal ! he aaint earn his self no bullets that cracka wanted to be a hero and shoot somebody ! its okay doe cuase wehn iqet my concealed weapon permit yalll qon see my ass in jail cuase iaaint loosinq nobody else ! yall crackas play a dirty qame ! and yeah im white too buhd now people see why iqot so much hate built up foe white people ! yall jusst always wanna down talk black people ! like "yay another niqqer dead" or "im qlad this niqqer dead" ! iwish one ov you cracka's wuld come up to me sayinq some **** like that or een sayinq niqqer dass so disrespectful cuase yo ass qon end up on tha news dead ! you crackas aaint nothinq better than black people and ^^ this muh****a talmboud karma yeaa we cuh qet on that subject cuase ill shoot me a cracka str8 up no remorse cuase thats how yall makinq . its always some black person qettinq killed and dey dont do **** just talk aboud waht they done wronq buhd if its a white person they talk about what they accomplishments were and how qood of a kid they were ! yall sittinq here judqinq people by they race you aaint een know bruh you just know they version of the story !

I think I just had an aneurysm.

[craigster59]

That looks like a comment from OJU!

[BlueSkyJaunte]

Originally Posted by widebody911

But seriously: does anyone keep stats on these types of incidents?

Join the NRA and get a monthly copy of American Rifleman. Every month there's an entire page full of documented incidents like this.

BTW, this month's issue has a GREAT article (w/ lots of data) on penetration vs. expansion for many brands and calibers of self-defense ammunition fired through realistic-length barrels. The amount of data collection represented by that single article is downright mind-boggling.

[ODDJOB UNO]

Originally Posted by skipdup

Why does it seem the bad guy(s) always run the moment they face armed resistance.
Hmmm....

ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh......................cuz ITS GONNA BE A "POWERFUL WHUUP AZZ HURT?"


this "race card" crap is enough to make me PUKE!


an ARMED ROBBERY IS AN ARMED ROBBERY...............PERIOD!


yeah lets say this poor black kid never had any education his entire life...........NONE! ZERO ZIP NADA NOT EVEN HOME SCHOOLING.


well let me tell you, that sure as the sun comes up in the east, he saw COPS AND ROBBERS on TV! and he SAW WHAT HAPPENED TO BAD GUYS!


gawd almighty what the hell does it take some people to understand, that there ARE BAD PEOPLE OUT THERE and CCW DOES MATTER LIFE AND DEATH! every stinking day and place ya go. about the ONLY place you can sleep soundly is in a COP STATION! and even then, i think the donut bill would far outpace yer rent/lease/mortgage each month at your original domicile.

the day all 50 states have RECIPROCAL CCW LAWS................will be the day you can walk safer than you have ever walked anywhere in yer LIFE!


and thats a FACT!



yeah i think my sign on my DOLLAR STORE will be "NO MOLESTE POR FAVOR" and see how long my life lasts.


the incredible stoopidity of this kids actions is beyond comprehension. its like "hey lets rob a likker(liquor) store!" well anybody with at least 1/2 a brain cell left in their skull KNOWS EVERY LIKKER STORE IS ARMED TO THE TEETH! DUH!


or my fave "LETS ROB A GUN STORE!".........................it just doesnt get any STOO-PIDER!

[ODDJOB UNO]

Originally Posted by BlueSkyJaunte

Join the NRA and get a monthly copy of American Rifleman. Every month there's an entire page full of documented incidents like this.

BTW, this month's issue has a GREAT article (w/ lots of data) on penetration vs. expansion for many brands and calibers of self-defense ammunition fired through realistic-length barrels. The amount of data collection represented by that single article is downright mind-boggling.

very good informative article on penetration ,mfg vs mfg vs bullet weight.

matter of FACT i got it on my desk.


for 9mm(which is my most common daily ccw due to weight) the remington 147gr JHP subsonic will penetrate 20.5 inches which was #1.

#2 was remington 115 gr JHP

#3 was wilson combat 124gr XTP


i think right now i have remington golden sabres in 147gr in one mag and the other is federal 147gr JHP. they work real damn good and feed and e-ject every damn time. cdnn had a sale on bulk rem golden sabres. the same guy who designed the dreaded "BLACK TALONS" also designed the golden sabres. good enuff fer ME!

[944Larry]

Originally Posted by porwolf

The question is: Was the shooter threatened? Did the robbers have guns? Was the shooter threatened? If not it is just a case of instant execution without a legal judicial process. Just like in the Middle East. Is that what we want the country to be.: A lawless society ruled by guns, like in Hollywood Westerns?

I don't have a problem with it. Won't be long all the crooks will start acting civil.....or be dead. Either way, no more bad guys.

[Racerbvd]

This was not the first thing bad thing he has done. From public records on 8/18/2010 He was convicted of Dealing in stolen property and giving false information when pawning such goods. That really doesn't sound like a good person, does it??

[ODDJOB UNO]

Originally Posted by craigster59

That looks like a comment from OJU!

i would have to go back to college to write that well.


i think i will have to go back to college JUST TO READ THAT!



ahhhh....... misguided anger+ little or no education= this dude.



my question? where is all the donated money going for jesse jacksons rainbow coalition? or where is all of al sharptons money going thats donated to him?


obviously not back towards inner city youth!

[white85carrera]

not to divert from notso-Freshboi, but let me "aks" you all a question:

Say this went down without Match shooter dude and it was just a normal CCW guy and he is in the same situation. Pulls weapon and takes out freshboi but also an innocent bystander...... then what? Cops at Empire state building shooting had some collateral damage, but they are LEO and no one else died AFAIK, beside the bad guy. How much training does the normal CCW person get to handle these types of crisis situations? what is the liability for the guy trying to do good, but ends up offing the wrong people?

[flatbutt]

Originally Posted by white85carrera

not to divert from notso-Freshboi, but let me "aks" you all a question:

Say this went down without Match shooter dude and it was just a normal CCW guy and he is in the same situation. Pulls weapon and takes out freshboi but also an innocent bystander...... then what? Cops at Empire state building shooting had some collateral damage, but they are LEO and no one else died AFAIK, beside the bad guy. How much training does the normal CCW person get to handle these types of crisis situations? what is the liability for the guy trying to do good, but ends up offing the wrong people?

thats a "what if"? hence it's all guess work.

[ODDJOB UNO]

in AZ. , ccw or non ccw THEY(me-you) IS RESPONSIBLE FOR EVERY STINKING ROUND HITTING ITS INTENDED TARGET!


for a "miss" meaning ya hit a good guy..............you will be charged criminally. if someone dones gots DEAD(epic fail)...............it will be 1st degree murder, then probably pleaded to 2nd degree murrdurr as the "good" guy wasnt yer intended target(wasnt premeditated). epic fail here.

and then you will be sued into the stone age on the civil side and you will be pushing a grocery cart down yer street with gulf porsche stickers on it. and be very very very POOR for the rest of yer life. if ya get out of jail anytime soon.



so...................with that in mind kiddies.........................doesnt it make ONE HELL OF A LOT OF SENSE TO BE A DAMN GOOD ABOVE AVERAGE BETTER THAN A NEW YORK COP, SHOOTER?????????????


so a word to the wise................if ya DONT HAVE THE SHOT ON THE BAD GUY.........WAIT UNTIL YA DO! it will be far less hassle and expense, trust me.



each of the new york cops are in for some ser-i-ass trouble for their piss poor marksmanship hitting good guys. the badge is NOT going to protect them here. at the least they will be doing a hell of alot more FIREARMS TRAINING! the civil suit is HUGE HERE for the victims.



note to self ............."always shoot BAD GUYS...................NEVER SHOOT GOOD GUYS!" EVAR! its really really poor form along with piss poor people skills.


there is NO EXCUSE for charles barkleys golf swing..................there is NO EXCUSE FOR PISS POOR MARKSMANSHIP!

[widebody911]

Originally Posted by 944Larry

I don't have a problem with it. Won't be long all the crooks will start acting civil.....or be dead. Either way, no more bad guys.

I don't know about that. Right now, the crooks aren't expecting armed resistance, so they're less likely to shoot. If the CCW hero phenom becomes common, then they'll shoot first and ask questions later. Instead of pointing the gun and asking the clerk to open the register, they'll shoot the first clerk and have the 2nd one open it.

Another potential issue with the CCW hero scenario is when some guy gets just a little too trigger happy and takes out a couple of bystanders, or takes out a 'perp' that isn't even a perp.

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by white85carrera

not to divert from notso-Freshboi, but let me "aks" you all a question:

Say this went down without Match shooter dude and it was just a normal CCW guy and he is in the same situation. Pulls weapon and takes out freshboi but also an innocent bystander...... then what? Cops at Empire state building shooting had some collateral damage, but they are LEO and no one else died AFAIK, beside the bad guy. How much training does the normal CCW person get to handle these types of crisis situations? what is the liability for the guy trying to do good, but ends up offing the wrong people?

Well, as a CCW holder, you are expected to make sure you have a clear shot, plus, it isn't likely that anyone would be behind the Purbs, as it would be too hard to cover the victims.

[lane912]

in my state (Oregon) this is what the law says. the laws in your state may vary, but this is a good example of the nuts and bolts-

166.220 Unlawful use of weapon. (1) A person commits the crime of unlawful use of a weapon if the person:

(a) Attempts to use unlawfully against another, or carries or possesses with intent to use unlawfully against another, any dangerous or deadly weapon as defined in ORS 161.015; or

(b) Intentionally discharges a firearm, blowgun, bow and arrow, crossbow or explosive device within the city limits of any city or within residential areas within urban growth boundaries at or in the direction of any person, building, structure or vehicle within the range of the weapon without having legal authority for such discharge.
(2) This section does not apply to:

(a) Police officers or military personnel in the lawful performance of their official duties;

(b) Persons lawfully defending life or property as provided in ORS 161.219;

(c) Persons discharging firearms, blowguns, bows and arrows, crossbows or explosive devices upon public or private shooting ranges, shooting galleries or other areas designated and built for the purpose of target shooting;

(d) Persons lawfully engaged in hunting in compliance with rules and regulations adopted by the State Department of Fish and Wildlife; or

(e) An employee of the United States Department of Agriculture, acting within the scope of employment, discharging a firearm in the course of the lawful taking of wildlife.

(3) Unlawful use of a weapon is a Class C felony. [Amended by 1975 c.700 §1; 1985 c.543 §1; 1991 c.797 §1; 2009 c.556 §5]




166.250 Unlawful possession of firearms. (1) Except as otherwise provided in this section or ORS 166.260, 166.270, 166.274, 166.291, 166.292 or 166.410 to 166.470 or section 5, chapter 826, Oregon Laws 2009, a person commits the crime of unlawful possession of a firearm if the person knowingly:

(a) Carries any firearm concealed upon the person;

(b) Possesses a handgun that is concealed and readily accessible to the person within any vehicle; or

(c) Possesses a firearm and:

(A) Is under 18 years of age;

(B)(i) While a minor, was found to be within the jurisdiction of the juvenile court for having committed an act which, if committed by an adult, would constitute a felony or a misdemeanor involving violence, as defined in ORS 166.470; and

(ii) Was discharged from the jurisdiction of the juvenile court within four years prior to being charged under this section;

(C) Has been convicted of a felony;

(D) Was committed to the Oregon Health Authority under ORS 426.130;

(E) Was found to be mentally ill and subject to an order under ORS 426.130 that the person be prohibited from purchasing or possessing a firearm as a result of that mental illness; or

(F) Has been found guilty except for insanity under ORS 161.295 of a felony.

of this section

[lane912]

161.209 Use of physical force in defense of a person. Except as provided in ORS 161.215 and 161.219, a person is justified in using physical force upon another person for self-defense or to defend a third person from what the person reasonably believes to be the use or imminent use of unlawful physical force, and the person may use a degree of force which the person reasonably believes to be necessary for the purpose. [1971 c.743 §22]






161.215 Limitations on use of physical force in defense of a person. Notwithstanding ORS 161.209, a person is not justified in using physical force upon another person if:

(1) With intent to cause physical injury or death to another person, the person provokes the use of unlawful physical force by that person; or

(2) The person is the initial aggressor, except that the use of physical force upon another person under such circumstances is justifiable if the person withdraws from the encounter and effectively communicates to the other person the intent to do so, but the latter nevertheless continues or threatens to continue the use of unlawful physical force; or

(3) The physical force involved is the product of a combat by agreement not specifically authorized by law. [1971 c.743 §24]



161.219 Limitations on use of deadly physical force in defense of a person. Notwithstanding the provisions of ORS 161.209, a person is not justified in using deadly physical force upon another person unless the person reasonably believes that the other person is:

(1) Committing or attempting to commit a felony involving the use or threatened imminent use of physical force against a person; or

(2) Committing or attempting to commit a burglary in a dwelling; or

(3) Using or about to use unlawful deadly physical force against a person. [1971 c.743 §23]





161.225 Use of physical force in defense of premises. (1) A person in lawful possession or control of premises is justified in using physical force upon another person when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes it necessary to prevent or terminate what the person reasonably believes to be the commission or attempted commission of a criminal trespass by the other person in or upon the premises.

(2) A person may use deadly physical force under the circumstances set forth in subsection (1) of this section only:

(a) In defense of a person as provided in ORS 161.219; or

(b) When the person reasonably believes it necessary to prevent the commission of arson or a felony by force and violence by the trespasser.

(3) As used in subsection (1) and subsection (2)(a) of this section, “premises” includes any building as defined in ORS 164.205 and any real property. As used in subsection (2)(b) of this section, “premises” includes any building. [1971 c.743 §25]



161.229 Use of physical force in defense of property. A person is justified in using physical force, other than deadly physical force, upon another person when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes it to be necessary to prevent or terminate the commission or attempted commission by the other person of theft or criminal mischief of property. [1971 c.743 §26]