Unions

[Por_sha911]

Someone needs to do some review of the effect that unions had on the Big 3 American Auto industry back in the 60's-70's and how it led to the dominance of import cars in the 80's.
Back in the 60's, the big 3 were making money hand over fist and it was cheaper to just give in to the unions over and over again. By the late 70's, American auto workers were so highly over-paid (my FIL was one of them) that the companies became unprofitable. To hedge against this, they cut corners in quality to keep costs down. They also had workmanship going down the toilet because the UAW was invincible and could retain 100% of union members regardless of the problems. Enter the imports with lower cost, higher quality, better workmanship and the rest is history.
Unions had (and in some cases still have) a legitimate reason to exist. Forcing a part-time teenage bag boy to join is protection racketeering at its best. Can you honestly say the union cars if the kid works for less than minimum wage or loses his job?
Oh, one more thing. I have several uncles that worked in the aerospace industry back in the 60's-70's. Over and over the unions bargained away benefits in order to gain a 25 cent hourly increase (the dues were based on the percentage of income not counting benefits).

[Por_sha911]

Someone needs to do some review of the effect that unions had on the Big 3 American Auto industry back in the 60's-70's and how it led to the dominance of import cars in the 80's.
Back in the 60's, the big 3 were making money hand over fist and it was cheaper to just give in to the unions over and over again. By the late 70's, American auto workers were so highly over-paid (my FIL was one of them) that the companies became unprofitable. To hedge against this, they cut corners in quality to keep costs down. They also had workmanship going down the toilet because the UAW was invincible and could retain 100% of union members regardless of the problems. Enter the imports with lower cost, higher quality, better workmanship and the rest is history.
I also have several uncles who worked in the aerospace industry back in the 60's-70's. Over and over the unions bargained away benefits in order to gain a 25 cent hourly increase (the dues were based on the percentage of income not counting benefits).
Unions had (and in some cases still have) a legitimate reason to exist. Forcing a part-time teenage bag boy to join is protection racketeering at its best. Can you honestly say the union cars if the kid works for less than minimum wage or loses his job?

[intakexhaust]

One name Jimmy Hoffa - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[speeder]

You can say that again.

[intakexhaust]

McCormick Place - Chicago conventions. UNION EXTORTION IN YOUR FACE
I've personally experienced this >>>

Contractors, trade associations squeeze convention exhibitors at McCormick PlaceCrain's Chicago Business : Subscription Center

I recall it used to cost $150 to have an extension cord plugged in at McCormick! It was illegal to do yourself and as an exhibitor. Oh and thank goodness they do give the extension cord a 5 second glance inspection. Another time I had to wait until 1:00 am, final day of the Chi. Auto Show with RRNA to remove vehicles because the law required an electrician come to the exhibit and attach the negative 12V terminal to the battery.

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by atcjorg

Well bad to generalize, first off our union "officials" do come from the bargaining unit, membership is VOLUNTARY About NATCA .
The grocery bagger may need a union that bargains for future pay raises and chances at advancement butcher, baker, checker etc that do get him benefits and raises, because we know business owners don't want to pay 1 red cent more than they have to, so they work everyone 32hrs a week so they don't have to pay benefits. yes the union spends 90 percent of their time defending 1% (the dumb-ass effect) but eventually they are weeded out.

I call Bull****, I grew in a Union household and my father was the union agent for the south east for the NMU. Like the racists naacp, unions did have a place, now
other than actual trades (Plumbers, electricians,) they serve no useful purpose other than a funding arm for the dem party & other organized crime. The man who invested his money, invested his time, took all the risk is entitled to make the rules, if you don't like them, you can go work elsewhere, and I'll tell you, as a business owner, it makes sense to treat employees well because it cost money to replace, and good employees can make or break a business. If a bagger shows talent to be a butcher, he can either be moved up or go work for a butcher, talent & work should dictate the value of an employee, not a blood sucking union. Why the hell would a bagger deserve a pay raise, if he is good, promote them. It doesn't take a lot of brains or skill to fill a bag or push a broom.

[intakexhaust]

Every year around the country one will hear of teachers striking on the first day of school. Great examples about the well being of our childrens future.

Chicago's failing and resulting shuttered schools tops it all. During 2012, the Chicago Teachers Union successfully negotiated a very generous pay raise for its members from a broke city and they went on strike anyways. The results are higher take home pay today from a system where the pension fund has been abused and is vastly underfunded.

[asphaltgambler]

Originally Posted by Rick V

No advice but I detest unions. Nothing more than extortion and a safety net for under performing workers.
We have no place for them in today's economy

^^^^^^^^^^The absolute plain truth^^^^^^^^^^^^

[sammyg2]

Where I work (in Ca) joining the union is OPTIONAL!

I'd be willing to bet your next paycheck it's optional where he works too. If the union is strong-arming him when it's OPTIONAL, pretty good chance you could get one of them mobsters thrown in jail.

Contact a lawyer who specializes in that sort of thing.

I've been fighting a couple union thugs for about 10 years now. Eventually enough others figured it out and joined in the fight, and now at least one of the bastages is going to jail. Sure feels good getting a union crook locked up.

[Icemaster]

“ rejection earned them praise from far-left labor supporters, including newly elected Socialist Seattle City Councilwoman Kshama Sawant. The only response we can have if Boeing executives do not agree to keep the plant here is for the machinists to say the machines are here, the workers are here, we will do the job, we don’t need the executives,” Sawant said at a Monday rally."

What the fuch...........?

The machines will go where the company moves them; the workers will become 'former' employees.

Unions in their current form are the death knell of any efficient and lean delivery organization.

Probably why they're so strong in governments.

[Icemaster]

Originally Posted by intakexhaust

McCormick Place - Chicago conventions. UNION EXTORTION IN YOUR FACE
I've personally experienced this >>>

Contractors, trade associations squeeze convention exhibitors at McCormick PlaceCrain's Chicago Business : Subscription Center

I recall it used to cost $150 to have an extension cord plugged in at McCormick! It was illegal to do yourself and as an exhibitor. Oh and thank goodness they do give the extension cord a 5 second glance inspection. Another time I had to wait until 1:00 am, final day of the Chi. Auto Show with RRNA to remove vehicles because the law required an electrician come to the exhibit and attach the negative 12V terminal to the battery.

BTDT. Many times. All you can do is live with it.

Had to wait 6 hours to spin up a router once because the union electrician had to plug in the power. Then another one had to come out and plug up the network cabling. Gotta love state governments.

[intakexhaust]

Originally Posted by sammyg2

Where I work (in Ca) joining the union is OPTIONAL!

I'd be willing to bet your next paycheck it's optional where he works too. If the union is strong-arming him when it's OPTIONAL, pretty good chance you could get one of them mobsters thrown in jail.

Contact a lawyer who specializes in that sort of thing.

I've been fighting a couple union thugs for about 10 years now. Eventually enough others figured it out and joined in the fight, and now at least one of the bastages is going to jail. Sure feels good getting a union crook locked up.

Only 10 years... wow! - Unfortunately probably wouldn't work in Chicago because Crook County has always been run by infiltrated mobsters LOL. Although there's been an improvement the last few decades but Rosemont is one that's full of it.

For the trades, the carpenters union is ridiculous. I've witnessed the muscle men pesty tactics trying to shut down non-union projects. A more tame method they use today is padlocks constantly changed at fenced in yards and they still have a GIANT INFLATEABLE RAT they display when in battle against non-union shops or scab workers. No Joke!

When construction fell out in 2008, union members were laid off and scrambled for any do job - NON union moonlighting! Many were even underbidding the illegal alien workers... LOL!

Some day I'd like to see this heavy 'Union Chucked' upon them -

[intakexhaust]

In Crook County, IL, here's what happens when a non-union worker messes with Scabby the Rat. Jokesters Local 000

George Koukos Stabs 'Scabby,' The Teamsters' Giant Inflatable Rat Used During Union Protests (PHOTO)

On another related comedy, I knew of a contractor who lost his deal with building a Walmart and they (yes, that Walmart) had to have union labors. Contractor got the bid but had non-union labors. Union found out, got Walmart involved and he lost the contract. In a rage he threw and trashed all the scaffolding. Glad I'm away from all the screw em' mental cases.

[intakexhaust]

More Union comedy:
Chicago Teachers Union boss and that even Chicago Mayor Rhammit Emanuel told her in 2012 'eF You' during negotiations. You can't make this stuff up

[strupgolf]

Originally Posted by cashflyer

He should pay.

The union serves a vital function, ensuring that the boy is properly trained for the important task of sorting and packaging the groceries for the trip home. They work for him to make sure his health and welfare are being properly taken care of by Ralph's, ensure that he is safe on the job, ensure that his benefits are commensurate, and protect him from unjust labor practices from Ralph's management.

He should be thankful that the union is there to look out for his best interests.

Now thats funny. Great writing skills and so much to the point. Right, should be in green.

[sammyg2]

Originally Posted by intakexhaust

Only 10 years... wow! - Unfortunately probably wouldn't work in Chicago because Crook County has always been run by infiltrated mobsters LOL. Although there's been an improvement the last few decades but Rosemont is one that's full of it.

For the trades, the carpenters union is ridiculous. I've witnessed the muscle men pesty tactics trying to shut down non-union projects.

Talk about crooked:

McCarron Brothers Battle Over the Future of the Carpenters Union
PR Newswire
LOS ANGELES, Oct. 9, 2013 /PRNewswire-USNewswire/ --

On Friday, October 4, 2013, Mike McCarron and two other members of the Southwest Regional Council of Carpenters (SWRCC) filed suit, in Federal Court in the Central District of California [Case no. SACV13-1559 JVS ANX; 8-13CV1559 JVS ANX] against the United Brotherhood of Carpenters and Joiners of America (UBC) seeking to overturn a trusteeship imposed upon the SWRCC and Carpenters Local 1506. The suit also names as defendants, Mike's brother Doug McCarron, the UBC's General President, Douglas Banes, the UBC's General Vice President, and Michael Draper, a UBC District Vice President who has been appointed as Trustee of the SWRCC. Mike McCarron and the two other members filed an ex parte application for a T.R.O. and Preliminary Injunction dissolving the trusteeship.

According to court documents Mike McCarron is the elected Executive Secretary-Treasurer of the SWRCC. His brother Doug McCarron is the General President of the UBC. The court documents claim the brothers are embroiled in a bitter personal dispute. The complaint alleges Doug McCarron is abusing his position as General President to gain leverage over Mike and push him out of the union. On July 22, 2013, Doug allegedly caused the UBC to impose an improper trusteeship on the SWRCC, removing Mike from his elected position, and allegedly placed a de facto trusteeship over Local 1506. The complaint filed in this matter alleges the trusteeship violates the UBC Constitution and the Labor Management Relations Disclosure Act.

The court documents further allege the dispute between Doug and Mike erupted in December 2011, over a $66,000.00 raise to Doug's girlfriend. Tensions mounted when Mike discovered Doug was collecting his Southern California Carpenter pension in spite of UBC summary pension plan rules to the contrary. The situation completely deteriorated after the death of their mother on May 21, 2013. According to court declarations, Mike is a trustee to his late mother's estate. This fact infuriated Doug, because he had no control over the estate, and Mike would not liquidate it as Doug demanded.

According to Department of Labor financial reports, the SWRCC has approximately 65,000 members and $250,000,000.00 in assets. The SWRCC is one of the largest in terms of membership and the most profitable council in the Carpenters Union. According to Mike McCarron's declaration the SWRCC has operated and expanded under his direction since his election to its top post in 1999.

And yet the millwright union's annuity they oversaw averaged .01% return on investment over the past 10 years (after the 8% administrative cost was deducted), but suddently started earning money again as soon as they got the boot.
Isn't irony ironic?

[aschen]

The company I worked for moved 51 miles to break up the shop union or at least that was the unofficial reason. What a pita for everybody and a tremendous expense for such a silly reason. I don't deal with shop issues but it must have been pretty bad dealing with the union. Unskilled labor still earn a living wage with full benefits even though they never reorganized.

I think there are always two sides to every story but some of these things are undefendable. The idea that anybody would be forced to join any organization against their will, makes my skin crawl

[T77911S]

Originally Posted by Rick V

No advice but I detest unions. Nothing more than extortion and a safety net for under performing workers.
We have no place for them in today's economy

hang on to the letters. may be a lawsuit there. i dont see how the union can fire him unless the union and management are really tight.
the union CAN make it bad. they can dictate his work schedual giving him little or bad hours. but low man on the totum pole he will get that anyway.



when we had a bad boss the union came down for some reason, maybe the one or two that were in called them, but they said and i quote, "we knew he was treating you bad but we were just waiting for you to get mad enough to join".

i dont see the unions trying to sell themselves with positive actions. they could have come down earlier and said, "your boss is treating you bad, let us help you".
and dont say anything about joining. let your actions reflect who you are are.

i see the union protecting many people here that CAN NOT DO THEIR JOB!.
20 years here and i am the only one that has never been in the union. now i am watching others get out because of how little they do.
since i the ONLY one not inthe union, they could set a work schedual and i would have no input to it even though i have been hear the longest.

i see the union as nothing more than a gang or mob that uses intimidation against there own people to get money. i think now we need an organization to protect us from the union.

[T77911S]

oh, here is a good current story from one of the guys here.

he submitted his paper work to get out of the union acording to the contract he was under at the time which was at the end of its term. the next month the new contract came out and the procedures for getting out changed. the union would not recognize his paperwork since the new contract was out and the procedures changed and they did not let him out. they are still taking money out of his check and will for another year.
he did get a lawyer but i dont think anything came of it.

[kach22i]

What?

I'm not in PARF?