F80 / 82 anyone?

[Ducman]

Originally Posted by onewhippedpuppy

Most of the people that rave about BMW are the buyers that either buy/lease new cars and trade them in every 2-3 years. The maintenance is taken care of by the dealership's complimentary coverage, they don't wrench on their own cars, and they get a new one at relatively low mileage. If you don't mind the cost associated with that approach, more power to you.

The average enthusiast isn't the original owner of the car. I bet a poll of this BBS would show that only a very small percentage of us purchased the cars new. They are older, higher mileage, out of warranty, and there is a much greater percentage of us that DIY. The new owner doesn't care about accelerated wear, snap together parts, rattles, and mechanical failure, because they don't have to deal with it. This is, BTW, exactly how it's supposed to work to maximize profit. BMW, or any other OEM, could care less what the 2nd or 3rd owner of the car think because they make very little money off of them. If their new car buyers keep coming back, that's what matters.

I'm sure there is a lot of truth to what you've said - I am an enthusiast and I love to do all my own maintenance including drop and crack the engine open - but only on my hobby car. And that's why it is an old 911. I don't touch my daily drivers 1) because they just need to work - where I need to get to is more important than any money I could save to DIY. 2) they are newer cars and newer cars suck to work on. On this last point I can only see that there is a difference between working on a newer BMW and a newer any other brand in so much as the BMW might be more technically complex and/or employ technology that is relatively earlier in life cycle than a similar age vehicle from say Chevrolet. So....I really don't see a knock against BMW any more than all other brands...which think you were sort of saying as well.

[Ducman]

Funny when you really think about it how different some experiences can be. The worst car I ever owned was a new Pontiac....in the shop 8 weeks in total within the first 20 months I owned it. Yes warranty but who can live like that. Dumped it at a loss. I've also owned the most notorious problem mark in history - fiat. The only time it tried to let me down was a burned up distributor rotor....which I honestly repaired by fashioning a makeshift rotor out of a paper clip I found alongside the road. Got me home.

Now-not to hijack my own thread. Let's get back to taking about the new M3/M4. Are the new colors great or do they suck?

[MRM]

They're ok.