Roflmao.

Here are a few studies on handheld vs. hands free cell use. I know most of you can find this stuff on your own, so this is for Denis' benefit. Not that he will care any more about these studies than he does about anyone (or their families) when he's out on the road - he is, after all, some kind of superhero who can safely carry this off. If only the rest of us were as skilled and good looking as Denis...

Drivers on Cell Phones Are as Bad as Drunks - University of Utah News Release: June 29th, 2006

June 29, 2006 -- Three years after the preliminary results first were presented at a scientific meeting and drew wide attention, University of Utah psychologists have published a study showing that motorists who talk on handheld or hands-free cellular phones are as impaired as drunken drivers.

Mobile phones and driving safety - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Handsfree device[edit]
Hands-free car kitDriving while using a handsfree cellular device is not safer than using a hand held cell phone, as concluded by case-crossover studies,[20][21] epidemiological,[1][2] simulation,[9] and meta-analysis.[11][12] The increased cognitive workload involved in holding a conversation, not the use of hands, causes the increased risk.[22][23][24] For example, a Carnegie Mellon University study found that merely listening to somebody speak on a phone caused a 37% drop in activity in the parietal lobe, where spatial tasks are managed.[25] The consistency of increased crash risk between hands-free and hand held cell phone use is at odds with legislation in many locations that prohibits hand held cell phone use but allows hands-free.

Again, I could go on and on, posting links to studies and quotes from those studies, but most of you would find that insulting. It would make Denis' head hurt, too, so I'll leave it at these two.

Jeff, you seem like a very pissed off individual who likes to call people you don't know all manner of derogatory terms and likes to ride a Harley with straight pipes and a Honda with a loud pipe. I think you need some stress management in your life, dude. I feel badly for the people around you, doing things you don't like.

there is this
Ironically hilarious.
Me too, and it is not nearly loud enough.
No kidding, about time someone thought about the children.
So is drunk driving okay too? Similar level of impairment, in every study I have seen on it.

You get into these debates because you are one of those really strange people.
No kidding, ought to be something more along the lines of one of these. Well, not the one on the left, stupid Miata parking in the doctor's lot.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1405534567.jpg

In other words, having chimed in on the "cell phones are not dangerous while driving" side of the debate (clearly without having done any research whatsoever), you now have to fall back on painting me as some stressed out, pissed off biker with straight pipes on his Harleys (both actually have stock mufflers, as I've stated and shown many times on this forum). Typical tactic, unfortunately, here on PPOT.

"Anger", of course, never entered into this encounter - go back and read my first post. I was chuckling to myself, bordering on laughing my ass off. The "pissed off" part is purely your construct. Yes, it does piss me off when they actually almost hit me, but I suspect that holds true for you as well. Two different things - having some harmless fun with some dick head yammering on his phone vs. dealing with some dick head who just about hit me. Try not to confuse the two.

Back to the latest topic at hand - the dangers of cell phone use. I see now that information has been presented that thoroughly contradicts your stated position, you are shying away from the topic and attempting to distract with your accusations. Boy, I wish I had a dime for every time a conversation on PPOT takes this turn. You guys all read from the same playbook.

.
Lou Grant: "You know how you are, Ted?"
.
Ted Baxter (Proudly): "Yeah, Lou."
.
Lou Grant: "Don't be that way."
.
:D
.
Sometimes when we have an uncomfortable inner experience, instead of being there with that experience and learning the lesson from it, we ask the universe (and those around us) to change so that we don't have that uncomfortable inner experience.
That was a hard lesson for me to learn.
Thank you, EST & Werner Erhard.

I enjoyed the juvenile, pace the BMW with loud pipes, story. I get it. Nothing illegal.

But, and this is from someone who has done it, regrets it and won't do it again, I don't get the chase them down and damage their property schtick. There are way too many variables and, frankly, putting others at risk in any scenario I can come up with.

I get it, Jeff, I really do. I lost my pristine 1994 Targa to a lady who ran me off the road, blithely unaware that her Chevy Suburban was taking up half my lane as she rambled on to her BFF: I can still she her as she rumbled by giving me the cell phone salute.

I was fine, car was totaled.

Where we'll part ways is in the chase. I've done it. Not no mo'.

From the beginning of this thread, I was thinking about a recent incident on the highway. I was driving up to the Bay Area on the 5 last month in a PU truck. While passing two tractor trailers using the left lane, one of them started moving over into my lane as if I wasn't there. I could not believe it was happening. I was forced onto left shoulder, standing on brakes and leaning on the horn. This was a Fed Ex truck pulling two trailers.

At the last possible moment, the truck driver noticed me and pulled back into his lane. Of course I was shook-up and pissed, I pulled up next to him and just stared at him with an incredulous look on my face. The driver looked like he was about 16 years old, his dad must have been sleeping in the back. He made all kinds of apologetic gestures and I just shook my head and continued passing him.

Never once did it occur to me to catch up with him at the next fuel stop and punch him or call him some choice names. Road rage is stupid and people who do it are stupid.

Paul, I respect your opinion, so please let me clarify.

"Chase" is probably too strong of a word - I have never actually "chased" anyone, unless recovering into traffic and falling in behind them could be construed as "chasing". When I do catch up, like at the next intersection, most get away with a verbal tongue lashing.

The actual property damage, the busting off of mirrors, has universally been "real time" - when I am next to them (with horn blaring most of the time) and they are merging into me. The smashing of something on their car has been a last resort, "hey!!!! I'm here!!" desperation move. Admittedly fueled by a lot of anger, some fear, and lots of adrenaline. I've never actually chased and caught up to anyone and damaged anything after the heat of the moment.

Of course, none of that matters to the cell phone jockies justifying their behavior, and demonizing mine in their efforts to do so. They are convinced by their own egos that they are right, and have every right to endanger the rest of us. I kind of feel an obligation to remind them that they don't.

The next time some D-Bag with loud pipes comes roaring past.....I'm gonna catch up and throw my cell phone at his head just to even things out!!!:D:D

Truck driver etiquette is not what it used to be. Remember those days?

In other words, you are finished addressing the "dangers of the cell phone while driving" issue as well. Boy, right on que, you drop it altogether. Like I said, if I had a dime...

now that is just too sensible and has no place in this thread.

;)

Nice back peddle.

Nice out of context quote. Another well established PPOT tradition.

Thankful you live on the opposite coast from me.

Thanks for the tip. Never would have thought of that. I always knew, given time, the collective wisdom of the PPOT brain trust would come up with a workable solution.

I agree. And I get the in situ confrontations. Just be careful.

As a pilot, I am always wary of those that defend the use of cell phones in a car. I will use Bluetooth but it is completely weather, road condition and traffic related. I never talk on a hand held device while driving, let alone text.

Aviate, navigate, communicate applies to cars as well.

I am street riding again so my pledge not to chase down an idiot may be premature.

Best.

Full-on avoidance mode.

Unfortunately for me (and other motorcyclists in my area), it does not matter where you live. There are far too many of your kind around here, who see no problems with yammering away on the cell while driving. As a motorcyclist, you should be ashamed of yourself for putting your fellow riders at risk. You are clearly just to self centered for that, however. That's really a shame.

fwiw, I run into Jeff fairly often - a few time a year. Never by arrangement, always by chance. Anyway You couldn't be more wrong. He's one of those soft-spoken guys who is keenly aware - more than most, and often chuckles quietly at the idiots.

But otoh, if you think that your leaning on him with social pressure will keep him from leaning on others with social pressure-and annoying pipes, then ... I dunno. :cool:

There seems to be an ongoing 'link' between disapproving of boorish behavior and supporting driving while chatting on a cell phone. I'm sure a lot of people here don't support either.

This may be factually true- I am plenty strange. But I have to say that I don't seem to have the problems others here have while either driving or otherwise navigating this life on earth. :)

Denis, that's why I read the dribble and really try to keep my opinion to myself.......Personally, have I ever talked on the cell phone while driving. Yep. Will I in the future ? Probably. Is it illegal? Yep. I'll take my chances if I'm caught on the cell phone, I'll ask for or expect nothing other then the ticket. Now, do I have casual conversations on the phone? No. But, and this is the kicker, if my kids call me or their school calls me, I answer the call. My daughter has a medical issue, so I will always take those very rare calls. So it may bother somebody, but those phone calls are more important to me then you. Obviously my kids know not to call me to chat and quite frankly I'm on a motorcycle for 99% of my time on the road.......Before you ask, Scala Rider G9......

You are, of course, absolutely right. Many dissaprove of my boorish behavior (or "juvenile", "childish", or what have you) while seeing driving while on a cell phone as unacceptable as well. Hell, maybe even I disaprove of my own behavior ("I can be so juvenile at times..."). who knows...

There has been, however, a quite vocal few who have come down firmly in favor of talking while on their cell phones, presenting this behavior as entirely safe. I've presented some pretty solid data from some pretty darn reputable sources that contradicts their position. I've asked them to adress that information. They have, instead, gone completely silent on this issue on which they held such strong opinions and have resorted to attacking me instead. I know, I know - to be expected when engaging some here on PPOT. I just wish they would come up with something new, something more imaginative. *sigh*

No Kidding......

Sorry, but I find it very amusing for you to act like if you were pulled over for talking on your cell phone, you would get a ticket.

That's fine, you can find it as amusing as you'd like.

I've been pulled over. Didn't ID myself and took the ticket like everyone else. Then guess what, I paid the ticket. Its called personal responsibility.

Yet you are perfectly willing to disregard the very law you are sworn to uphold, when it is convenient for you. Laws that are meant to keep all of us safe on our highways.

I'm sorry, your daughter is not more important than everyone else's daughters surrounding you on the road. By all means, take that call - but please pull over when you do. How hard is that? That last question goes for the rest of you as well, by the way.

Higgins is cool.

rjp

So now I'm confused. When you "Higgins", is that when you exhibit boorish behavior towards drivers with cellphones or when you "shart" in the shower?

Well Jeff,

Here we go. There is the letter of the law and the spirit of the law. The law is designed to kept people from driving down the road, completely unaware of their surroundings engrossed in their conversation. Do i write a lot of cell phone tickets you bet. Do i give tickets to everyone I stop irregardless to why they are on the phone, No, I dont. The people I'm concerned about are the ones who drive right by me, while im parked in the open and are completey oblivious to me, or the ones i pull up next to and stare at for two minutes while at the light and they don't see me. At least when I see someone recognize me, and quickly put down the phone, I know they are present.

If the law was absolutely cut and dry about not talking on your cell phone then there wouldn't be certain exceptions in the vehicle code.


In fact this is part of the vehicle code section 23123a CVC


(c) This section does not apply to a person using a wireless telephone for emergency purposes, including, but not limited to, an emergency call to a law enforcement agency, health care provider, fire department, or other emergency services agency or entity.

Did you catch the not limited to part....... obviously if driving while talking on a cell phone was a matter of life or death, there wouldn't be this exceptions as well as others.

Finally, My daughter is more important to me then someone elses daughter. As your children are more important to you then my children. If you received news, on your cell phone while you were safetly parked on the side of the road, that your child had been involved in a terrible accident, would you go over the speed limit enroute to the hospital......you would. doesnt mean you'd drive reckless or in wanton disregard for the other motorists on the road, but i have a feeling you'd drive over the speed limit, violating the law...if I stopped you, merely because of the speed, I'd more then likely let you go. I've done it, I'll do it again.

I try to enforce the laws I'm sworn to protect with some common sense, empathy and compassion. I try to live my life the same way.

One more thing. The GQ guy was a menace to society talking on his cell phone, it can be compared to driving intoxicated. Yet you chuckled to yourself while messing with him. Would it have been as funny if he had been drinking a beer?

Believe me, if I could shart at those drivers, I would.

Michael, I understand the use of a cell phone during an emergency, and have no problem with that. Problem with that loophole, however, is now every call becomes an "emergency". Just like every speeding cop is "on a call...".

I have to get back to this - if you are indeed discussing an emergency situation concerning your daughter, wouldn't it be far better to pull over and give it your full attention? Do you think receiving possibly very upsetting information about her while driving could lead to a high level of distraction, possibly endangering others?

I guess, in the end, I could care less what the situation is for you, or anyone else. I would even go so far as to say I could care less what the laws are. Driving on the cell is perfectly legal in some states, hands free legal in some, and so on. That does not diminish the danger in any way. Again, how long would it take, how hard would it be, to simply pull over and take that call? As far as I'm concerned, there is no excuse for picking up before pulling over. It's about as self centered and callous as it gets.

Well, we can agree to disagree, in fact, i'd say trying to get over 5 lanes on the 405 while going over the pass, is a lot more dangerous. I guess, in the end, I could care less about your opinion.

oh and no, I'm not concerned with being distracted about any info I might receive.

Will the PPOT cliches never end on this thread? Another shop worn one - lay out the most unlikely situation possible, and hang your whole argument on that.

Spoken like a true cop. Blow off anything you disagree with. Only this time, you don't have the badge and gun props to support your notion that you are "right".

Probably not much of an "emergency" then, is it?

Oh, but wait - you are a cop, with superhuman driving skilz and nerves of steel. Laws don't apply to you - they are for those plebeians you are tasked with policing.

Again, we see just another self-centered driver who is willing to put those around him at risk in the name of his own convenience. Only this one has often touted the "higher standard" to which himself and his kind are held. Uh huh...

Really Jeff, that's it. That's all you got. You pulled the cop card :rolleyes: talk about cliches :rolleyes: I reread my post and funny I couldn't find any mention of my superhuman cop driving skilz or nerves of steel. I didn't see anything in there that I'm the exception or above the law, Guess you missed the part about using some common sense,empathy and compassion.

I'm also not sure what having a gun and a badge has to do with me having a differing opinion then you on this subject.

I didn't think so initially, but Motion is right. Your an angry little man and kinda pout like a ***** when people don't agree with you or your way of thinking. You answer the questions you can, avoid the ones you can't and twist the rest.

I'm self-centered because I don't agree with you. I'm OK with that.

I'm done here. You can have the last word you so desperately crave. ( Damn is that a PPOTcliches)




*

You need:
-an adjustable curved tube attached to the back of leggings,
-an accelerator fan to disburse the shart,
-an actuator and power source for fan,
-possibly an inline spray assembly of gelatinous liquid which can absorb and propel such shart essence further(20 feet at 80mph).

Being called self centered by a raging ass hole just doesn't have the same bite.

No, you are self-centered because you continue to justify your use of a cell phone while driving. There is no possible justification, period. It's like trying to justify drunk driving under certain circumstances. It just cannot be done.

In the case of the cell phone behind the wheel, there is always another answer. Drive up to the next exit, or a safe place to pull over, and return the call. Under the worst possible scenario, what could that possibly take? A couple of minutes?

I'm especially disappointed to see a man justifying this behavior who, through his profession, has presumably responded to an accident or two that was caused by an inattentive driver on a cell phone. I would suspect you have personally witnessed the destruction, injury, and maybe even death brought about through this behavior. Probably more than once.

Yet, here you are, so god damned self important, egotistical, and callous that you have no qualms about putting others at risk when you engage in this behavior. How shameful.

To top it all off, your final response when confronted with this is to lash out at me. Beautiful.

I simply don't agree that talking on a cell phone while driving is tantamount to driving drunk and is extremely reckless. I'd venture that there are tens of millions of people who disagree with you on this, including the people who write the laws.

I seriously find it more distracting to talk to a passenger sitting next to me in terms of not noticing that traffic is slowing in front of me, (for a fraction of a second), than talking on a phone. Maybe because I turn my head towards the person next to me for a second and with a phone call there is no one else to look at(?) IDK.

Equating a cell phone conversation with texting while driving is laughable. They are not in the same stratosphere. Texting requires diverting your visual attention completely from the road for short periods of time, as well as your thoughts.

You can make this your cause celebre but I don't agree or share your opinion. At all.