Ok Pilots - what are your thoughts on the Air-Cam

[daepp]

I'm not a pilot - just a wannabe. But this thing looks like a whole lotta fun. Any thoughts?

[afterburn 549]

slippery slope.
Get a helicopter.
In the states fixed wings have a low AGL limit 500/1000 I think.
Helicopters just safe and prudent.
For 50K you can buy a whole lot of airplane today .
Each their own.

[Dantilla]

Originally Posted by afterburn 549

Get a helicopter.
In the states fixed wings have a low AGL limit 500/1000 I think.

Helicopters are very expensive, and very maintenance-intensive.

Airplanes are required to stay at or above 1000' over heavily-populated areas. In rural areas, 500 feet vertically or horizontally from any people or buildings. Skimming the tree tops is perfectly legal in many areas.

[afterburn 549]

I know where there are two Hiller helicopters right now all basic parts 10 G each
I know where there is a completely overhauled Hiller, low time components , less then 60K.
The market is super soft on everything.
Hillers are pretty economical to operate.
Dont get caught in the rotorway vortex.
Buy a real one NOW.

[cashflyer]

Originally Posted by afterburn 549

I know where there are two Hiller helicopters right now ....

Hillers are pretty economical to operate.

Early Hillers use a vertical Franklin engine, which has not been produced in a long time. Late Hillers used a vertical Lycoming engine, and Lycoming has not produced vertical configured cases or oil sumps in a long time. These are not issues as long as you never spin a bearing or damage the case or sump.

Who owns the Hiller TC and PMAs now? Anyone making replacement parts for the airframe? Anyone making blades?

No helicopter is economical to operate when compared to a fixed wing aircraft. A Cessna 172 can be bought for around $30k, leaving enough money for your flight training - and a 172 has no life limited parts to replace.


The AirCam design has been around since the 80s. I haven't read much bad about them. They are an ultralight, or light sport class airplane, depending on configuration. As a single seat ultralight you won't need a pilot license. As a light sport you will. What do you want, daepp?

[Cajundaddy]

Looks like they did a lot of things right. Very confidence inspiring ultralight aircraft. It is similar in design to the ultralight that Walmart heir John T. Walton crashed in 2005. I never heard the final NTSB report on that.

I have mixed feelings on these. Major fun factor but so fun and free that one might forget that when you make a mistake, the ground comes up really fast.

[afterburn 549]

Franklin parts in Tex . Call susan
There are at least two places still doing blades for Hillers. We all try to keep the wood ones (no TBO)
There is lots of stuff available.
Its a "you need to know who to call deal" LOL
PS -yes of course you are right about fix wing comparison to rotorwing .
The twirly things cost more to operate...

[GH85Carrera]

That looks like a lot of fun for summer time flying. It would sure suck BIG time in the cold winter months.

[Mark Henry]

Originally Posted by afterburn 549

For 50K you can buy a whole lot of airplane today .

$50k is just the airframe kit, the two engines/props are another $50K+.

[flipper35]

Originally Posted by cashflyer

Early Hillers use a vertical Franklin engine, which has not been produced in a long time. Late Hillers used a vertical Lycoming engine, and Lycoming has not produced vertical configured cases or oil sumps in a long time. These are not issues as long as you never spin a bearing or damage the case or sump.

Who owns the Hiller TC and PMAs now? Anyone making replacement parts for the airframe? Anyone making blades?

No helicopter is economical to operate when compared to a fixed wing aircraft. A Cessna 172 can be bought for around $30k, leaving enough money for your flight training - and a 172 has no life limited parts to replace.


The AirCam design has been around since the 80s. I haven't read much bad about them. They are an ultralight, or light sport class airplane, depending on configuration. As a single seat ultralight you won't need a pilot license. As a light sport you will. What do you want, daepp?

I was under the impression that LSA only required a drivers license.

[flipper35]

Originally Posted by afterburn 549

I know where there are two Hiller helicopters right now all basic parts 10 G each
I know where there is a completely overhauled Hiller, low time components , less then 60K.
The market is super soft on everything.
Hillers are pretty economical to operate.
Dont get caught in the rotorway vortex.
Buy a real one NOW.

One could buy a J3, Champ, Tri-Pacer... and still have a lot of cash for fuel over ANY rotorcraft, save for maybe a single seat gyrocopter, and fly as a recreational pilot, or in the planes under 1370# you could fly as an LSA. The J3 or Champ can nearly hover if there is a steady headwind.

If you like the open air, the above aircraft looks like it would be the ticket.

[Flieger]

What's a helicopter?

[cashflyer]

Originally Posted by flipper35

I was under the impression that LSA only required a drivers license.

A valid driver's license substitutes for the medical certificate requirement, however you still need to receive training and earn a "sport pilot" license. (IIRC)

[widgeon13]

Is a multi engine rating required for the twin?

[flipper35]

Originally Posted by cashflyer

A valid driver's license substitutes for the medical certificate requirement, however you still need to receive training and earn a "sport pilot" license. (IIRC)

I knew you had to be "certified" but I wasn't sure it was like a PPL. Like a type rating for each. I don't follow the LSA very close though.

In other news, sounds like the drivers license in place of a Class III for PPL flying 6 seat or less and under 6000# gross is getting passed.

[Mark Henry]

Originally Posted by widgeon13

Is a multi engine rating required for the twin?

I don't think so, I read this in the FAQ's

2.Can I get my multi engine in the AirCam?
You can get your multi engine rating in your AirCam but you must demonstrate your ability to feather a prop in a complex type airplane and have a log book entry.

[widgeon13]

Originally Posted by Mark Henry

I don't think so, I read this in the FAQ's

That refers to getting a twin rating but not what the FAA requires to actually be PIC of a twin Air-Cam. I truly don't know the answer.

[afterburn 549]

The trouble with Exp. AC is there is usually no re sale value .
Like i said , for 20K you can buy a LOT of airplane right now.
Get a Wichita Turkey like a C 150 or 170
dont even look at the air frame hours, make sure there is 500 left on the engine.
If it is out of annual dont it it scare ya.
OR
make a compromise you pay if it passes.
Or
go 50/50
you will be most happy (IMHO)

[dar636]

I've certified two in the last five years, I thought it would be a fun airplane to have access to for a few flights a year to chase seagulls and throw rocks from. Simple construction but I would not call it something that was built to aeronautical standards. It's construction looks like a cross between a hang glider and a lawn chair. It really doesn't need to be built much more robustly than that for the purpose it was designed for, just be aware of the design philosophy. There is no heater.

Otherwise, experimental amateur built aircraft don't interest me for resale (primarily) and other reasons. I wouldn't invest in one. As stated, there is a lot of value in used production aircraft and several retain or increase their values.

If you assemble one, for fun or buy one outright and fly it often - hey go for it. The more pilot/owners the better.

You do need a multi-engine rating to act as the pilot in command (seaplane rating too). You can take 95% of the training needed in the aircam but you'll need to use another aircraft equipped with feathering props to complete the check flight for the multi engine rating.

[widgeon13]

Thanks, I'll stick with the Maule.