ACDC Thunderstruck - Guitar Explanation

[Bob Kontak]

Want to understand what the guitar differences are.

Is the first guitar the rhythm guitar? At 50 seconds in another guitar compliments the first and the range of the sound expands to where the result is intoxicating. Is it the second guitar that opens the sound or is it a function of a slide bar on a mixing board, or both? Been wrestling with my daughter about what makes the sound at 50 seconds in. She says it is a less complex but complimentary guitar sound (melody?) and she is guessing it may be a bass guitar.

At 1:35, another guitar plays a more routine rock riff.

Can someone briefly note what happens in layman's terms?

Five guys. One singer and a drummer. That leaves three guitars. I hear no deep bass riff but plenty of bass drum thumping. I guess there are no rules, and this is a work of art. Is there a standard protocol that is followed? Like a math equation? Forgive me, just intrigued why this song is so wonderful to listen to.

Wish I could hear it without voices.

[Gogar]

The second guitar, I guess you could call it the rhythm guitar, starts in the left speaker at 50 seconds.

The bass is slowly fading in from about :38 but he's all in at :50 when the 2nd guitar comes in.

There's at least 4 or 5 distinct guitar parts in the song, the third starts at 1:34

The huge "AC/DC" sound like the sound at 2:28 and more importantly 2:43 you hear is when the 1st, 2nd, sometimes 3rd, 4th etc. guitar parts all play the same stuff together to make it sound super huge.

That sound is lots of times called "Doubling" where the two guitars on the 'outside' (one in each speaker) play together to give a super wide sounding guitar sound.

The sound at 3:13 (not the solo, the other sound) is probably the most clear example of "doubling." Fun!

[Bob Kontak]

Yes!!! I hear the bass at 38 seconds in. Separate from drums. Thanks. I thought it was drums when I posted but I can hear the volume increase.

Just curious. Music noob asking questions.

Agree left speaker at 50 seconds in but right speaker volume does not change. Simple stereo effect but they did it right.

[Bob Kontak]

When all guitars are playing at the same, it is huge.

Thanks so much for your insight. Had a beer or two. Alone in shop. Stereo cranked. I get into song critiques across a week or more at a time per each. Odd, I guess.

I have told this story before but my daughter was taking guitar lessons abut eight years ago. I told her to look up the "Can't You Hear Me Knocking" tab and learn that. She said "It's too hard, Daddy" She is still grounded.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by Gogar

The sound at 3:13 (not the solo, the other sound) is probably the most clear example of "doubling."

Yes. Have heard that effect before in songs. Effective.

[Allan Walker]

Great song! Always revs me up! Guitars are really awesome!

[Rick Lee]

On another note, Angus only uses 50w Marshalls and no effects. IIRC, he started using a wireless for live shows and felt they gave a compression effect. So he started using it when recording too. But he's got a pretty legendary, raw Gibson/Marshall tone that you can pretty much only get with a Gibson and a Marshall. That gain is from the amp being dimed, not an internal gain knob or a pedal.

[tabs]

Songs are like the arrangement of furniture in a room. Each piece has its place in a room to create an overall effect or sound. Guys like Richards,Townsend, Angus and Forgerty among others are like conductors who have a sound in
their heads that they want implement. When they play you can see them listening to all the parts and how they interplay with each.other. James Brown was said to fine a musician if he came in late on a part. At the last Stones concert I went to the guy* behind me said Jagger cut a verse from Sympathy to pick up 17 seconds that they were behind on. Now tell me if that isn't down to business.




* The 4 guys behind me were all in their mid 60's and were attending every show on the tour at 500 a pop plus travel food and lodging.Also the 4 people next to me were doing the same thing. Real Stone heads.

[KFC911]

Wow, thanks for that perspective from a pro Gogar! I love music, but other than listening, my brain just doesn't operate in that realm . I do know a few things after attending thousands of shows however....the good ones make it look "easy", and effortless, and it ain't . A local musician used to play in Muddy's band....amazes me when he backs/sits in with someone he's never played with before....it's like they've been on the road for 20 years....

[sugarwood]

Bob,
Here is my take.

Bass: Single note drone for most of the entire song.

Guitar 1: Angus. You can think of the opening hammer on/pull off lick as the lead guitar. He never really stops playing this riff for the entire song. Except the solo and the aforementioned "big double" when everyone playing the same chords....

Guitar 2: Malcolm. Your 2nd guitar at :50 can be considered a rhythm guitar, that is doing a muted staccato picking. All part of the build up.
That 2nd guitar at 1:35 now starts playing the routine rock power chords, which is clearly the rhythm guitar.
You'll notice at 1:30, the :50 thing is gone. All this time, the lead guitar is still playing the opening riff.

[sugarwood]

Bob, I love your curiosity. Are you a big (classic) rock fan?
Have you ever tried to learn guitar?

[sugarwood]

Originally Posted by tabs

At the last Stones concert I went to the guy* behind me said Jagger cut a verse from Sympathy to pick up 17 seconds that they were behind on.

That's not how music works.
More like he forgot the words, and the band had to adjust.

[pavulon]

Needs more cowbell.

[craigster59]

Originally Posted by Bob Kontak

When all guitars are playing at the same, it is huge.

Thanks so much for your insight. Had a beer or two. Alone in shop. Stereo cranked. I get into song critiques across a week or more at a time per each. Odd, I guess.

I have told this story before but my daughter was taking guitar lessons abut eight years ago. I told her to look up the "Can't You Hear Me Knocking" tab and learn that. She said "It's too hard, Daddy" She is still grounded.

Well, looks like you're just going to have to learn it yourself Bob....

[Todge]

In simpler terms.....the first part is Angus
The second part was Malcolm.

Overall its called magic

[Bob Kontak]

Thanks for all the discussion and input. It's a treat.

Originally Posted by Gogar

The second guitar, I guess you could call it the rhythm guitar, starts in the left speaker at 50 seconds.

I did some Googling and the (one) story went that Angus said he had this "thing" he was working on and his brother listened and said he had a rhythm for that. Like, he just had this stash of self-created music in his head he could draw from that fit. Probably why they are called musical artists, eh?

Originally Posted by sugarwood

You'll notice at 1:30, the :50 thing is gone. All this time, the lead guitar is still playing the opening riff.

I listened closely for the rhythm to fall out at 1:30 to free up hands for the 1:35 riff but I can't pick it up. I do notice something changes at 1:30 with respect to range.

FWIW: I only took piano lessons for a year as a kid. Also, bought a Buddy Guy Strat for my daughter. Black with white polka dots.

[aigel]

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by KC911

Wow, thanks for that perspective from a pro Gogar! I love music, but other than listening, my brain just doesn't operate in that realm . I do know a few things after attending thousands of shows however....the good ones make it look "easy", and effortless, and it ain't . A local musician used to play in Muddy's band....amazes me when he backs/sits in with someone he's never played with before....it's like they've been on the road for 20 years....

THAT is what separates a real pro from the mere mortals.

I was smart enough to hire a pro to hang our new fancy front door that my wife insisted we needed. I loved watching him work. Measure twice, cut one and it was perfect. He never stopped to read instructions or back track. That door is still solid and works perfect.

The same is true for concrete work, cooking a meal, driving a race car or a million other tasks. The real pros make it look easy. It never is.

[tevake]

Oh man I love that version with Steve n seagulls.
Fun watching them play, the anvil, the spoons bouncing on the drum, the driving riff from the banjo. Too cool!

[Nostril Cheese]

My ears arent as sensitive due to the Marshall treatment, but it kinds sounds like Angus is panning left to right in some places.