School Me On Collectable Hand Guns

[aigel]

I would like to add some hand guns to my safe. The goal is to get something that is collectable and holds its value. I am not opposed to 'safe queens', I understand that those may be the best "investment", but just like cars that are drivers, it'd be actually more enjoyable to be able to take the gun out a few times to the range or a hunt.

What would you look for to buy? What do you predict will hold its value or increase?

Some thoughts on revolvers, where I am probably the most literate. We will really have to educate me on pistols, so I will post more on those later!

Revolvers:

Colts:

Double action Colts such as python are very pricey because they are not made anymore. They sure are pretty ... You read on shooters forums and it turns out they may actually not be the best revolvers out there, if you plan on using them. Safe queen territory? Should I even bother? It looks like >2k for anything nice.

Single action Colts SA army. 1st gen is probably not an option. 2nd gen is the go to? Are these still as hot with brand new SAA available now? Would a brand new SAA make a good gun to own? I'd imagine it will be tracking wit the new price. I have seen some posts by Jeff who liked the new SAA.

S&W
The modern double action 357s and 44s in stainless seem to hold their value well even in shooter condition if they are pre-lock. These are nice guns to own and use and maybe a shooter quality .44 (629) is something to target?

The model 29 as seen in Dirty Harry seems still popular, but will it remain so, with that movie slowly disappearing in the past? Who still remembers that in 20 years? Seems also pricey and the long barrel versions aren't what you'd call practical or even easy to store!

Other S&Ws seem to be collectors items, but I am not sure I am that excited about an early 38 or 357. One gun I always thought was cool was an old Lady Smith. I could pretend it is a gift for my wife ...

Any of the hand cannon stuff like the .500 seem just silly. I don't want to shoot that.

Ruger

Makes nice revolvers. But are they too pedestrian to qualify for "collecting"

A nice .22 single six should be on the list? What to look for on one of those?

The vaquero and blackhawk SA seem solid guns but pretty basic?

I do like the Ruger "Alaskan". I know, that's a hand cannon, but with a purpose? What caliber would be best? Is the casull chambering obsolete with the .480 Ruger available? Or is a .44 enough?

Thanks!

George

[Steve F]

Pricey, but nice

FS or Trade: Smith & Wesson Model 629-1 and Glock 30, Orange & NSD Counties, No Ship - Calguns.net

Not the Glock

[tabs]

Originally Posted by aigel

I would like to add some hand guns to my safe. The goal is to get something that is collectable and holds its value. I am not opposed to 'safe queens', I understand that those may be the best "investment", but just like cars that are drivers, it'd be actually more enjoyable to be able to take the gun out a few times to the range or a hunt.

What would you look for to buy? What do you predict will hold its value or increase?

Some thoughts on revolvers, where I am probably the most literate. We will really have to educate me on pistols, so I will post more on those later!

Revolvers:

Colts:

Double action Colts such as python are very pricey because they are not made anymore. They sure are pretty ... You read on shooters forums and it turns out they may actually not be the best revolvers out there, if you plan on using them. Safe queen territory? Should I even bother? It looks like >2k for anything nice.

Single action Colts SA army. 1st gen is probably not an option. 2nd gen is the go to? Are these still as hot with brand new SAA available now? Would a brand new SAA make a good gun to own? I'd imagine it will be tracking wit the new price. I have seen some posts by Jeff who liked the new SAA.

S&W
The modern double action 357s and 44s in stainless seem to hold their value well even in shooter condition if they are pre-lock. These are nice guns to own and use and maybe a shooter quality .44 (629) is something to target?

The model 29 as seen in Dirty Harry seems still popular, but will it remain so, with that movie slowly disappearing in the past? Who still remembers that in 20 years? Seems also pricey and the long barrel versions aren't what you'd call practical or even easy to store!

Other S&Ws seem to be collectors items, but I am not sure I am that excited about an early 38 or 357. One gun I always thought was cool was an old Lady Smith. I could pretend it is a gift for my wife ...

Any of the hand cannon stuff like the .500 seem just silly. I don't want to shoot that.

Ruger

Makes nice revolvers. But are they too pedestrian to qualify for "collecting"

A nice .22 single six should be on the list? What to look for on one of those?

The vaquero and blackhawk SA seem solid guns but pretty basic?

I do like the Ruger "Alaskan". I know, that's a hand cannon, but with a purpose? What caliber would be best? Is the casull chambering obsolete with the .480 Ruger available? Or is a .44 enough?

Thanks!

George

I have a friend who has lots of Rugers in his safe. I would say he probably has one of the better collections in the USA. Rare variations on a theme is what to look for.

Post war pre 1970 Colt 1911 autos are on the move....the pre wars have gotten expensive... then in the future look to the Series 70's they also have interest in them and are going up...

SW N Frame dash 2's are on the move... look to the "S" SN prefix's. Pinned and recessed SS model N frames...629 no dashes for instance particularly in 4 inch then 8 3/8 inch. Only one year produced.

Both of these ideas while they are not inexpensive are still modest in price compared to potential.

You can not have it both ways the best ROI is going to be in those mint condition pieces. There your money can go exponential. So what do you want to do, invest or to play? Your $$ are tied up either way.

Dirty Harry has little to do with collecting the mdl 29's...that belies your ignorance.

You would do well to invest some money into books on the type of spoon you are interested in. It is called research material. Some books when they go out of print can command quite a bit of money. Years ago I bought the 4 volumes of Springfield Research Serial numbers...it is just lists of serial numbers and disposition of those spoons..for under $200...today a set is about $1500. Put a price on knowledge.

If you are knowledgeable you can even beat the bushes for the already older and much more expensive stuff. Here you are not going to gt it for a song, but in relation to it's current price structure it will be a bargain.

[sc_rufctr]

I've always liked revolvers. Anything classic would be cool.

Something like this?

[tabs]

Originally Posted by sc_rufctr

I've always liked revolvers. Anything classic would be cool.

Something like this?

What kind of custom job is this?

Customs generally dont command much PREMIUM $$$. U buy em because you like em.

[Bill Douglas]

It's certainly worth a punt. Much more fun than having money in the bank. A collectible I'm looking to buy is a made in Israel full auto Uzi. I saw a nice one a few years ago that had Hebrew writing on the top and a very "carried" looking patina - I wish I'd bought that one.

[tabs]

Originally Posted by Bill Douglas

It's certainly worth a punt. Much more fun than having money in the bank. A collectible I'm looking to buy is a made in Israel full auto Uzi. I saw a nice one a few years ago that had Hebrew writing on the top and a very "carried" looking patina - I wish I'd bought that one.

Only dropped once by a Masad hit squad.

[John Rogers]

If you want the REAL collectibles try this:

Man at Arms Magazine for the Gun and Sword Collector

There are lots of listings of those folks that have pistols that are very collectible!

[Taz's Master]

Don't spend any real money until you know how to grade condition and spot a refinish.

N Frame Smiths, 25's, 27&28's, 29's, 57's

3 screw and flat-top Blackhawks, and Speed-Sixes (a 9mm could be nice)

Learn what they generally go for and buy good deals. But start with a small target and learn about it, then branch out from there.

[dmcummins]

I'd really like a sig P210.

[Jeff Higgins]

Gun collecting, like any other form or collecting, can be pretty darn fickle. If you are looking to buy purely for "collector value", just about anything you will look at is already pretty well vetted by the guys who incessantly watch this stuff. They will always beat you at this game, as with any "collector" market. The casual enthusiast will always be one step behind, buying high and selling low. The real "players" depend on that. They drive the market - unless you are willing to expend the energy to become one of them, through a great deal of time spent in very thorough research, a great deal of money spent in getting to know the real "players", and in gaining some level of influence in their circles - you are no more than baitfish swimming in their shark tank.

Understanding that, I buy what I like. And I shoot them. Quality firearms will never depreciate. Granted, run of the mill "shooters" will never appreciate (nor depreciate, for that matter) like sought after "collectibles". They do, however, represent a solid investment that you can still have fun with, that you can still shoot, and that you will always realize a return on, assuming you keep them long enough.

[Craig T]

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins

Gun collecting, like any other form or collecting, can be pretty darn fickle. If you are looking to buy purely for "collector value", just about anything you will look at is already pretty well vetted by the guys who incessantly watch this stuff. They will always beat you at this game, as with any "collector" market. The casual enthusiast will always be one step behind, buying high and selling low. The real "players" depend on that. They drive the market - unless you are willing to expend the energy to become one of them, through a great deal of time spent in very thorough research, a great deal of money spent in getting to know the real "players", and in gaining some level of influence in their circles - you are no more than baitfish swimming in their shark tank.

Understanding that, I buy what I like. And I shoot them. Quality firearms will never depreciate. Granted, run of the mill "shooters" will never appreciate (nor depreciate, for that matter) like sought after "collectibles". They do, however, represent a solid investment that you can still have fun with, that you can still shoot, and that you will always realize a return on, assuming you keep them long enough.

This could not be written better, nor is there better advice.

[tabs]

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins

Gun collecting, like any other form or collecting, can be pretty darn fickle. If you are looking to buy purely for "collector value", just about anything you will look at is already pretty well vetted by the guys who incessantly watch this stuff. They will always beat you at this game, as with any "collector" market. The casual enthusiast will always be one step behind, buying high and selling low. The real "players" depend on that. They drive the market - unless you are willing to expend the energy to become one of them, through a great deal of time spent in very thorough research, a great deal of money spent in getting to know the real "players", and in gaining some level of influence in their circles - you are no more than baitfish swimming in their shark tank.

Understanding that, I buy what I like. And I shoot them. Quality firearms will never depreciate. Granted, run of the mill "shooters" will never appreciate (nor depreciate, for that matter) like sought after "collectibles". They do, however, represent a solid investment that you can still have fun with, that you can still shoot, and that you will always realize a return on, assuming you keep them long enough.

You make it sound like a conspiracy or sumthin.

I personally never had the shekels to go to the deep end of the pool. But as my long passed friend said, when you start breathing that rarefied air you have a lot fewer buyers who can breath that deep. Better to stay in the mid level collectibles that have popular appeal. I have always been a cruiser looking for a cheap meal, where i have instant equity or am in a break even position without trying too hard. There were a few times that I was a chaser and went deep into the end zone. Those have not always worked out well for me. But then again that game ain't over...Yes stay with what you like but always keep an eye on the exit. This is money ya are talking about and due diligence is required. Knowledge, knowledge and more knowledge.

The idea is to stick with desirable name brand stuff that is of good quality then look for condition and rarity. High Standard 22 lr target pistols are under priced and are moving a bit. SW N frames have and are moving, Colt postwar 1911's are set to make a jump, now that the pre wars have gotten expensive. If you asked me Colt snakes have already made the jump, and unless somebody is asleep at the price switch forgit it.


Then like most collectible things get hot and then cool for awhile before making the next jump. Lugers made a big jump in the 70's remained steady for over twenty years and all of a sudden doubled in price overnight. Prewar SW Registered Mags went 5X your money in about 6 months. You might want to look at what is cold now, and wait for spring to come again.


.

[sc_rufctr]

Originally Posted by tabs

What kind of custom job is this?

Customs generally dont command much PREMIUM $$$. U buy em because you like em.

That's the point. I wouldn't buy something I couldn't shoot for the fear of devaluing it.
I collect film cameras. Most of mine are run of the mill Leicas so not terribly valuable but they won't depreciate if properly cared for & you can actually use them.
This is my "daily". Not a lot of value here. The body is worth about $1,500 and the lens maybe $2,000 on a good day.



Then you have to Pro Collectors who go after the ultra rare Black Paint MP, M3, M2, M4 Leica's.
Very collectible and valuable but most haven't seen a roll of film in decades.

Something like this. Original "black paint" Leica MP with matching Summicron. (Values vary but you could easily pay $50,000 for a combo like this)

[tabs]

Originally Posted by Craig T

This could not be written better, nor is there better advice.

Except for the fact that it isn't completely accurate. You bet there are a lot of eyes watching for stuff and not only that they remember what is what. That said the real knowledgeable guys can not be every where and see everything.


Then there is the hesitancy factor in an auction where the avg guy says I just don't know about that and will err on the side of caution. There is where the guy with knowledge makes a score. Unless of course someone else knows to, then if is something that they both can not live without...they duke it out with one guy eventually coming to his senses. That is where prices are driven.

For instance in 98 Jeff Faintich auctions in St Louis had a Smith Registered Mag with an estimate of 1800 to 2200. I said I will give it a whirl an will phone bid on that..before I could get a bid in it had blown way past 2K eventually settling at 17000. I said what is wrong with this picture, as in what don't I know. Later from a major Smith collector I found out the catalog misrepresented the barrel length and it was a rare barrel length that two guys knew about. I said hmmmm sumthin is up wid those Reg mags and sure enough a little more than a year later Reg mags went 5X on the money. That is the back story there... From there it was only a matter of time before the postwar stuff started to climb, first the 5 screws, then the 4 screws and now the 3 screws.

The problem with the big auction houses is that the guys who write the descriptions know what is what and fill in the details (sometimes they miss things as well). They do it because a good percentage of their clientele is absentee or phone bidders and they want to inspire confidence in what they are offering so prices won't languish.

The big auction houses get in the big and long term collections of decades where the collector winnowed the dross out and kept the primo stuff. So the guys with the dinero who are savvy collectors do one stop shopping and the money flows like a river. That is where prices are driven. Also Dealers hit those auctions to buy inventory on anything that might go cheap...so chances are....you will get it for one bid more than a dealer will go. Which is still OK. Collectors Firearms in Houston is a big buyer at Amoskeag in NH. I have seen dealers fk up by paying too much to...

The big players are Julia's, Rock Island, Amoskeag, Cowans/Little John, Heritage Auctions and now Carol Watson in OC. . Sotherbys and Butterfields..ehhh. Then there are the regional or state auction houses that do a little bit of everything.

G Shows and Dealers are trying to sell you retail. Sales in a parking lots are for gang banger type of shyte. GB, G International and G America are largely dealer operations with some private party stuff. Then there is G Runner on line only auctions..he gets primo dinero for his stuff. There is the between collectors private party sales...where stuff never sees the light of day except for a transfer between one spoon room and another.

Then there is the great leveler of the knowledgeable and the newbie who does not know the muzzle from the butt end of a spoon...The Blue Book Of Spoon Values or the Standard Catalog of Spoon Values...the prices listed are good orders of value, but the real importance is the ability to identify by make, model, caliber, and SN which leads to a by condition valuation.

[tabs]

Originally Posted by sc_rufctr

That's the point. I wouldn't buy something I couldn't shoot for the fear of devaluing it.
I collect film cameras. Most of mine are run of the mill Leicas so not terribly valuable but they won't depreciate if properly cared for & you can actually use them.
This is my "daily". Not a lot of value here. The body is worth about $1,500 and the lens maybe $2,000 on a good day.



Then you have to Pro Collectors who go after the ultra rare Black Paint MP, M3, M2, M4 Leica's.
Very collectible and valuable but most haven't seen a roll of film in decades.

Something like this. Original "black paint" Leica MP with matching Summicron. (Values vary but you could easily pay $50,000 for a combo like this)

There are guys who just collect, shoot and collect, and just shoot.

[sc_rufctr]

I mostly just shoot but like most things it's easy to "accidentally" become a collector.

[tabs]

Originally Posted by tabs

I know I have become a collector of used shoes...

[svandamme]

If you have a hand gun, eventually you will collect more of them.
The end. Pokemons, gotta catch em all

[on2wheels52]

So I did the right thing selling all the Clerkes and Ravens that came through the pawn shop?