Starter problem

[kcope]

Greetings All
Nice day today so I jumped in the P-car to go for a spin turned the key and nothing! Nada! Zip!
No click from the solenoid. Except for the noise from the fuel pump my poor car is deathy silent.
Checked the Ignition switch for loose connections-good, checked the ground strap- tight and in good condition, checked the battery connections- tight, checked battery voltage-13.02.
I guess my next step is to check the connections on the solenoid.
How much of a job is it to get to the solenoid? Do have to pull the starter? And where is it located? I know its at the front of the engine but which side? I'm guessing its on the right.
Thanks for any help you all can give.

(Gues I know what I'll be doing tomorrow...Drat!)

[kcope]

bump

[Jim Sims]

Did you check the ground strap from the body to the front of the transmission? Probably not if you're unsure of where the starter is. This ground strap provides the primary return path for the starter current. It is a flat braided cable with lugs on each end, look for it undeneath on the passenger side at the front of the transmission. One will find the starter up high on the passenger side of the transmission bell housing (towards the engine). One can access the solenoid connections fairly easily but if you have to remove the starter there is a barrel or cylinder nut on top which is difficult to reach. Cheers, Jim

[Jim Sims]

clear

[kcope]

checked the ground strap- tight and in good condition. I was able to check it without jacking the car. but the car has gotta go up on jack stands to check the starter. I can't hear the solenoid click so I suspect a loose wire on the solenoid.
If those wires are tight I'll check the voltage to the solenoid.
Beyond that I don't know what I'll do.

[kcope]

ok got the car up. found the starter.
Bad news the connections all look good and tight new washers etc.
Going to test the wire from the ignition to the solenoid.
Since I dont hear the solenoid actuating I'm going to concentrate on this for now.
Wish me luck LOL

[kcope]

Interesting, the voltage from the battery to the solenoid is only 4.2 volts, way below the 7 required for the solenoid to actuate.
I know from the wiring diagram that theres several connections that the wire runs through any one have any ideas where these connections are?

[Jim Sims]

Check 14 pin connector on driver's side of engine compartment. Jim

[rfix'n]

On the '78 its pin #1, solid yellow on the 14 pin harness. Should be solid yellow on your year as well, just not sure of the pin #.

[kcope]

diagram shows solid yellow. I'll check that after I put the car back down. Thanks.
Even with the good reading I'm still thinking maybe the battery is going bad.

[Joe Bob]

Next time it happens, get a BFH and whack the solenoid....

[kcope]

hehe Thought of that but the service manual says the solenoid needs 7 volts to operate if I only got 4.2 no amount of whacking is gonna get it to work.
Hooked the meter up to the battery and tried the starter the battery only dropped to 12.4 volts
First stupid move was not jumpering direct from the battery to the solenoid while I had the car up on the stands.
Need to jump the ignition switch also. switch could be bad.
Right now I'm tired and dirty. Going to take a shower and relax tomorrow is another day.

[Gunter]

Consider installing a starter relay right next to the starter. After 25+ years, the wiring gets tired. With an auxillary relay, the juice will come right from the big wires, not just from your ignition switch.

[davis911s]

Try another battery or try boosting the battery, see if this works. Could be that the battery has proper volts but NO AMPS and the battery is no good.
Try to do the easy stuff first before you start pulling things apart.

You could also take the battery out and bring it to any battery shop. Most shops will test for free.

Shawn

[kcope]

Ok back at it. I think I may have found the problem.
I have a weird battery setup. Its a gates (Like an optima) mounted on its side. When I wrestled the battery out I found that one of the bolts on the clamp was loose and wire was somewhat corroded. It seemed ok just looking at it with the battery in the car but only with a close up hands on inspection was it evident.
The battery box needs some housekeeping then I'll throw it back in and see if it works.
Fingers crossed.

[kcope]

Great! I found the problem!
It wasn't the battery ground. It was the other 14 pin connecter. Theres one going into the electronics console and another going out. It was the outie.
Pushed on it and it moved in just a little bit so I turned the key and it cranked. Shoulda known. That was the one they would have disconnected to drop the engine. It was only a little bit out. Thats what threw me, it was making enough contact to provide an electrical path but not enough volts to actuate the solenoid.
Just goes to show that you must check everything before replacing parts.
I need to check out why it came loose. At least I know everythings clean and tight now.
Thanks to everyone for your suggestions.

[stealthn]

Ken,

Funny you should post, I have the exact same problem right now. Which connector are you talking about? and what was the wire that was the issue?

Thanks in advance,

[kcope]

the yellow wire is the solenoid wire. this is the plug that came loose. and a pic showing both plugs.

[stealthn]

You the MAN. I actually took off the other plug and cleaned it up and boom she started. (Although I don't know if it's related) I guess I am in bad need of a wiring manual.

Thanks very much!!

[kcope]

Glad I could help!