2.7L CIS - two throttle return springs?

[kraher]

Hi everyone,

I have a '76 Targa with the stock CIS, and I'm getting it back in the car after way too long.

The throttle seems a bit sticky when the engine isn't running (I haven't tried with engine running). The pedal does come up most of the way quickly, but the last 1/4 throttle is slow to come up. I've lubricated all of the linkage, I even replaced the bushings of the pedals.

The store on this site lists two throttle return springs (long and short), but I only have one (on the throttle body). Is there another one supposed to be somewhere? In searching around it seems there may be one missing on the linkage between the throttle body and transmission (on the engine block)?

Does anyone have any photos or insight? I don't have a good photo of this area from when I pulled the engine (lucky me).

From the look of the short spring in the store, I can't imagine where that would go.

Thanks for your time

[fanaudical]

The "stickiness" may not be near the throttle body.

Be sure to check the throttle rod that runs through the tunnel and check the bushings at the bell crank on the transmission. Try disconnecting the throttle rod at the throttle body and verify the throttle body opens/closes freely. Work backward from there. Sometimes the bushings in the tunnel get gummed up / broken and that doesn't help.

[manbridge 74]

The second spring goes from a small post on cylinder #2 intake runner back to throttle linkage junction assembly. It’s the longer of the two springs needed.

[kraher]

Originally Posted by manbridge 74

The second spring goes from a small post on cylinder #2 intake runner back to throttle linkage junction assembly. It’s the longer of the two springs needed.

Thanks. I'll look for a spot on cylinder #2 intake runner to attach the spring. There is definitely a hole on the linkage itself to accept a spring.

Is this photo of the "short spring" the spring on the throttle body? Somehow it seems too small? I may just have to order one and see it for myself (cheap).

[kraher]

Originally Posted by fanaudical

The "stickiness" may not be near the throttle body.

Be sure to check the throttle rod that runs through the tunnel and check the bushings at the bell crank on the transmission. Try disconnecting the throttle rod at the throttle body and verify the throttle body opens/closes freely. Work backward from there. Sometimes the bushings in the tunnel get gummed up / broken and that doesn't help.

Thanks for the input. I didn't think about bushings in the tunnel, please don't tell me I have to drop the engine again!

[eastbay]

Originally Posted by fanaudical

The "stickiness" may not be near the throttle body.

Be sure to check the throttle rod that runs through the tunnel and check the bushings at the bell crank on the transmission. Try disconnecting the throttle rod at the throttle body and verify the throttle body opens/closes freely. Work backward from there. Sometimes the bushings in the tunnel get gummed up / broken and that doesn't help.

This. Also check the throttle console bushings (or lack of usually) on the engine. Between that, the transmission pivot bushings and the tunnel bushings what are there 8 bushings on the throttle rod?

Unless someone has been there before you they are all end of life if they are even there.

[manbridge 74]

I would disconnect rod at trans and check for smooth movement at pedal. Then lubricate all rod ends and adjust starting at pedal housing (optimum but not absolutely necessary) then rod under car to junction, then rod to throttle body, the goal being to get full throttle AND have throttle body fully closed at idle. Also want to check that there is still the slightest free play left at full throttle for zero binding/stress on parts.

[kach22i]

Originally Posted by eastbay

Unless someone has been there before you they are all end of life if they are even there.

Yea, it's my spring project as well.

Didn't quite get to finish it in the fall.

Got the front and top done, need to go under the car next.

[kraher]

Originally Posted by eastbay

This. Also check the throttle console bushings (or lack of usually) on the engine. Between that, the transmission pivot bushings and the tunnel bushings what are there 8 bushings on the throttle rod?

Unless someone has been there before you they are all end of life if they are even there.

You've nailed it. The bell crank on the transmission is missing one bushing entirely and the other one looks a bit iffy. Both bushings on the throttle console as you call it are there, but both in bad shape.

Do you know if bushings at both locations are identical? I can only find the bushings for the transmission bell crank in the store.

Also do you know any tricks for getting the transmission bell crank off the transmission while in the car? My bell crank hits the suspension arm before it clears its own shaft.

[kraher]

Originally Posted by fanaudical

The "stickiness" may not be near the throttle body.

Be sure to check the throttle rod that runs through the tunnel and check the bushings at the bell crank on the transmission. Try disconnecting the throttle rod at the throttle body and verify the throttle body opens/closes freely. Work backward from there. Sometimes the bushings in the tunnel get gummed up / broken and that doesn't help.

When I disconnect all the linkages it's fine. Free movement at the pedal as well as the throttle body. The linkage on the back of the engine is very sticky, I'll need to replace those bushings, and I'll do the bell crank on the transmission while I'm at it.

[eastbay]

Originally Posted by kraher

You've nailed it. The bell crank on the transmission is missing one bushing entirely and the other one looks a bit iffy. Both bushings on the throttle console as you call it are there, but both in bad shape.

Do you know if bushings at both locations are identical? I can only find the bushings for the transmission bell crank in the store.

Also do you know any tricks for getting the transmission bell crank off the transmission while in the car? My bell crank hits the suspension arm before it clears its own shaft.

I seem to remember that the bushings are longer for the trans pivot but otherwise the same size. I like the bronze if you can still find them.

To remove the trans bellcrank in the car you need to unscrew the pivot shaft from the trans, there are flats machined on the end for a wrench after you remove the cotter pin.

[kraher]

Originally Posted by eastbay

I seem to remember that the bushings are longer for the trans pivot but otherwise the same size. I like the bronze if you can still find them.



To remove the trans bellcrank in the car you need to unscrew the pivot shaft from the trans, there are flats machined on the end for a wrench after you remove the cotter pin.

Okay thanks. I did make a half hearted attempt to uncrew the shaft, but I stopped pretty quick. I'll get some penetrating fluid on it.

I'll have a closer look at the old bushings to see if I can work out if they're the same.

Thank you.

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[Flat6pac]

The bushings are different
The trans bushings are 914 part number
The console on top of engine are 901 part number
Bruce

[kraher]

Originally Posted by Flat6pac

The bushings are different
The trans bushings are 914 part number
The console on top of engine are 901 part number
Bruce

Oh I think I see. They are the same as bushings on the bell crank just behind the pedal?

The store says 4 per car so it makes sense.

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