SSI install on 79' SC...tips?

[Hulley]

So I'm removing a stock exhaust and replacing it with SSIs and a M&K 2/1 sport muffler. I just received the SSIs, oil lines and exhaust gaskets and waiting on the M&K muffler.

I only found one video of installing SSIs and it was in German but it looks like I may need some special tools, a couple of crows feet, a really long allen socket and some weird looking, "C" shaped wrench.

The video showed using a different muffler bracket but the SSIs in the video were a little different, they had extensions from the muffler to manifolds.

Is this correct? Anything else?

The video showed a 30mm and 36mm crows feet (closed captions) are these the correct, what size allen socket 8mm? what about the weird wrench?

Any tips on doing these? I'm pretty mechanically inclined but no lift, doing this on my back under jack stands.

[na2ub]

I got the weird C shaped wrench with my SSIs. Double check the bags / box they came in.

[Hulley]

Originally Posted by na2ub

I got the weird C shaped wrench with my SSIs. Double check the bags / box they came in.

Just checked both bags and took everything out of the box, no wrench.

[snbush67]

Spray the old nuts with pb blaster, soak them, don’t hold back. Plan on having a way to extract broken studs and have replacements on hand. Looks like you have the thin flanged SSI’s without sleeves, so you’re stock studs should be long enough.

[roblav]

Instead of that wrench, I use a 6 point 13mm socket universal, 3/8" drive. Bought it at Sears 32 years ago.

For all the through tube allen nuts, I use 1/4" drive ratchet, extension, and 8mm socket. 1/4" drive helps to prevent overly manhandling those studs... I don't hesitate to use the oxy-acetylene torch on those.

[sean m]

Watching this install........

[Hulley]

Originally Posted by snbush67

Spray the old nuts with pb blaster, soak them, don’t hold back. Plan on having a way to extract broken studs and have replacements on hand. Looks like you have the thin flanged SSI’s without sleeves, so you’re stock studs should be long enough.

Yep, I have the PB blaster on hand, will start soaking this week.

Supposedly this motor had a the top end resealed about 4k miles ago so hopefully I won't have any broken studs, I don't have paperwork to support that though.

[Hulley]

Originally Posted by roblav

Instead of that wrench, I use a 6 point 13mm socket universal, 3/8" drive. Bought it at Sears 32 years ago.

For all the through tube allen nuts, I use 1/4" drive ratchet, extension, and 8mm socket. 1/4" drive helps to prevent overly manhandling those studs... I don't hesitate to use the oxy-acetylene torch on those.

I have on of these on hand so I'll give that a shot.

[na2ub]

In the same process now with my 79. Agree, an extension with a 13mm swivel end works well to remove the old HEs. I have not installed the SSIs yet, so not sure if the C shaped wrench is necessary, maybe not. I had my engine out and upside down, but the important part is not to snap a stud, removing the old HEs. I did use an oxy-acetylene, and found that when they are ready to come loose, they only need about 15-20 lb feet of torque (measured by my hands). If you find any stubborn ones, do not force them. I ended up with no broken studs, with 1 stud coming out of the case, which I later re-installed with red loctite.

The next challenge, is removing the oil lines from the T stat. I failed at this, even though using heat and penetrating lube. I tried to remove the outer line (to the oil tank) first, and those threads came right off with the nut. Then I took extra special care, on the inner line (t stat to engine crossover) and even with extra special care, those threads came off too. I ended up buying a new t stat. (yes I know there are some weld on repair fittings).

The final challenge is the cross over (actually cross under tube). Seems like all the aftermarket ones, including on Pelican, are poorly fitted, and neither clear the engine case nor the SSis.

This is a good thread, including my experience.
https://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/1004113-ssi-install-derailed-out-spec-oil-lines.html
You may be able to send your tube to Len (page 3) to have him bend you tube to spec. I think I would recommend this, as getting my tube to fit was a PIA, and that was on the engine stand. Though you may well be more handy than I.

Just sharing, since we have same car / same SSIs. I have test fitted mine to be good, at this point, and should be installing them as soon as I get an O2 bung welded on (for EFI conversion).

Also, just saw a video on youtube by Klassic automotive training, where they installed what appeared to be SSIs, and recommended using 12mm nuts, so you can install with a swivel extension. (No c shaped wrench). Maybe something to look into.

[Hulley]

Originally Posted by na2ub

In the same process now with my 79. Agree, an extension with a 13mm swivel end works well to remove the old HEs. I have not installed the SSIs yet, so not sure if the C shaped wrench is necessary, maybe not. I had my engine out and upside down, but the important part is not to snap a stud, removing the old HEs. I did use an oxy-acetylene, and found that when they are ready to come loose, they only need about 15-20 lb feet of torque (measured by my hands). If you find any stubborn ones, do not force them. I ended up with no broken studs, with 1 stud coming out of the case, which I later re-installed with red loctite.

The next challenge, is removing the oil lines from the T stat. I failed at this, even though using heat and penetrating lube. I tried to remove the outer line (to the oil tank) first, and those threads came right off with the nut. Then I took extra special care, on the inner line (t stat to engine crossover) and even with extra special care, those threads came off too. I ended up buying a new t stat. (yes I know there are some weld on repair fittings).

The final challenge is the cross over (actually cross under tube). Seems like all the aftermarket ones, including on Pelican, are poorly fitted, and neither clear the engine case nor the SSis.

This is a good thread, including my experience.
https://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/1004113-ssi-install-derailed-out-spec-oil-lines.html
You may be able to send your tube to Len (page 3) to have him bend you tube to spec. I think I would recommend this, as getting my tube to fit was a PIA, and that was on the engine stand. Though you may well be more handy than I.

Just sharing, since we have same car / same SSIs. I have test fitted mine to be good, at this point, and should be installing them as soon as I get an O2 bung welded on (for EFI conversion).

Also, just saw a video on youtube by Klassic automotive training, where they installed what appeared to be SSIs, and recommended using 12mm nuts, so you can install with a swivel extension. (No c shaped wrench). Maybe something to look into.

Thank you, I'll check out that thread. My engine was out in January of this year so I'm hoping the oil line will come apart easily at the t-stat.

[ross79SC]

The condition of the exhaust studs is what will determine how much cursing will be involved. I got the old exhaust off fairly easily, I found using 3/8" air impact alternating between forward and reverse worked the best. But the studs were done, they twisted off like they were plastic with very little torque applied. The tool from Stomski Racing to drill out the studs worked great (drilled out 8). I messed up one, that was repaired with the Stomski/Time-cert thread repair insert kit, uses the drill out jig for alignment.

One thing I had happen that I've not seen anyone mention is that I had air injection port threads rip out installing the plugs on two ports. Again, a Time-cert thread repair came to the rescue. I actually used their Big-cert that has thick enough wall for the plug copper washer to sit on and seal.

I also replaced the studs and hardware with titanium. Moto RSR on ebay has a wide selection, I got the closest length for the exposed part of the stud and cut the end in the head to suit. Decent hacksaw blade or die grinder and a bit of file cleanup was all that was required. I used normal nuts, no inside hex like stock. The titanium nuts are slightly smaller at 12mm, the 1/4" socket I have just fit through the access holes in the SSI's. A 1/4" drive swivel socket worked for a few more. There was a couple I ended up just using a wrench on, last two inside on the passenger side if I remember correctly.

Got a set of big crow foot wrench for the oil lines. I had the commonly reported fitment issues with the engine cross over oil line.

Every nut, bolt, oil line connection threads etc. got a coating good quality anti-seize... I plan to own the car long enough that I'll be the 'next guy'!

Good luck!
Ross

[MichaelSJackson]

I have a "tip" for breaking rust welds. I can't explain it or defend it; except to say I've been doing it for decades. I don't remember why or how I started doing it. Definitely soak in your favorite penetrating oil. (KROIL for me, but I hear that a home brew of ATF and acetone is the best?) And use acetylene to get them cherry red a couple times. The tip is to try and tighten them first; instead of loosening. I do it just enough to hear the crack of the weld breaking. Then undo them.

My percentage of success has been much higher since adding this to my protocol.

As I mentioned, I can't explain it or defend it.

For the misshaped oil line, I found I had to attach it to the engine first and then I could wedge and pry the other end to make the connection.

Also, I'd bought used SSIs and the PO had hammered a small dent on the front, bottom of the left one to provide the clearance needed. I can't imagine it ever fitting without that small dent.

Michael J
'78 SC w/SSIs

[na2ub]

Just a heads up, but even with your engine out recently, they would not have disconnected the oil line at the T-stat. They (and I) disconnect the other end of that oil line, to remove the engine. The T-stat connections never get removed during engine out repairs.

[911SauCy]

Literally soak the existing hardware, in PB Blast, for days if not a week. Daily reapplication

[Hulley]

Originally Posted by na2ub

Just a heads up, but even with your engine out recently, they would not have disconnected the oil line at the T-stat. They (and I) disconnect the other end of that oil line, to remove the engine. The T-stat connections never get removed during engine out repairs.

Gotcha, I figured they would disconnected it at the T-stat.

Thanks

[Hulley]

Originally Posted by 911SauCy

Literally soak the existing hardware, in PB Blast, for days if not a week. Daily reapplication

Yep, I'm going to start this is a few days, I'm still a couple weeks out from getting the muffler.

[Hulley]

Originally Posted by MichaelSJackson

I have a "tip" for breaking rust welds. I can't explain it or defend it; except to say I've been doing it for decades. I don't remember why or how I started doing it. Definitely soak in your favorite penetrating oil. (KROIL for me, but I hear that a home brew of ATF and acetone is the best?) And use acetylene to get them cherry red a couple times. The tip is to try and tighten them first; instead of loosening. I do it just enough to hear the crack of the weld breaking. Then undo them.

My percentage of success has been much higher since adding this to my protocol.

As I mentioned, I can't explain it or defend it.

For the misshaped oil line, I found I had to attach it to the engine first and then I could wedge and pry the other end to make the connection.

Also, I'd bought used SSIs and the PO had hammered a small dent on the front, bottom of the left one to provide the clearance needed. I can't imagine it ever fitting without that small dent.

Michael J
'78 SC w/SSIs

It's funny you mention this, I've done this in the past on other machinery and didn't even think to do this on the exhaust studs, thanks!

[Brian Cameron]

I don’t remember any special drama when i did this on my wife’s 79 a couple years ago, other than the clutch sigma spring colliding with the SSI. Denting the SSI slightly with a hammer solved that issue, allowing the clutch spring to move freely.

I also used a few rounds of pb blaster, then heat, then tighten nuts slightly before loosening off - no broken studs thankfully.

Crossover oil line didn’t fit perfectly but i don’t recall special difficulty making the adjustments.

Gratuitous pic of installed exhaust:

[Hulley]

Originally Posted by Brian Cameron

I don’t remember any special drama when i did this on my wife’s 79 a couple years ago, other than the clutch sigma spring colliding with the SSI. Denting the SSI slightly with a hammer solved that issue, allowing the clutch spring to move freely.

I also used a few rounds of pb blaster, then heat, then tighten nuts slightly before loosening off - no broken studs thankfully.

Crossover oil line didn’t fit perfectly but i don’t recall special difficulty making the adjustments.

Gratuitous pic of installed exhaust:

That is a beautiful pic!
Thanks!

[Bill Douglas]

John Walker hasn't chimed in so I'll pass on some advice he has given in the past.

He says to get the old exhaust studs and nuts VERY hot (gas torch hot) and they will come out other than breaking.