Replacement footwell blower motor solution

[ianc]

Hi Folks,

recently I posted asking for some help in locating a replacement motor for the footwell blower motor, but didn't get any solid leads:

Please help me spec alternate footwell blower motor

I remember back on the first page somewhere that Wavey suggested the AC condenser motor might be the same as the footwell blower. Didn't think anything of it at the time, but I was poking around in the garage last nite to see if I had any oil filters left when I noticed I still had the AC condenser fan assembly sitting on the shelf from when I amputated the AC. I decided to pull it apart and have a look.

At first glance, the motors look the same. Indeed, they are the same form factor, but when you look more closely, there is a difference in the way the electrical connectors connect to the motor. The motor on the left is the stock footwell blower motor, and on the right is the AC condenser fan motor. Note how the spade connectors are higher up on the AC motor:



It is still very easy to adapt this motor to fit in the footwell blower housing however. Here is a second shot of how I did it. You just need to make a couple of wire pigtails to wrap around the body of the motor to connect to the footwell blower's electical plug. Notice also the small bit of red plastic brush mount that needs to be cut away to allow access to the screw hole to mount the cover on the top of the motor. That red plastic brush mount sits a bit higher, so you will also need to clearance the small lug inside the cover with a dremel to make it sit properly on top of the motor. There is somewhat limited room under the cover, so you'll need to be careful to keep your wires the correct length and not use too thick a gauge either. Another clever thing to do would be move the felt oil pad from the footwell blower's top bearing over to the new fan before replacing the cover:



The AC fan motor had this Bosch part # stamped on it: 0130007081, and it is readily available. I found it in the IMC parts database at my friend's shop for (jobber's price) $52, and it can be found on the web. I say this because I am unable at present to locate this motor on our host's site, but I have sent Wayne an email with the part # asking him to consider carrying it, which hopefully he will consent to.

If you can locate this and do the fiddly bits, it will save you a cool $100 over the cost of the entire replacement blower assembly.

Hope this helps someone!

ianc

[Mitch Leland]

Ianc,

Great information, this one gets book marked...

[Mitch Leland]

Ianc,

Great information, this one gets book marked...

[RWebb]

nice - I guess they have the same rpm?

[Wavey]

Into the archives... Thanks Ian!

[Mysterytrain]

NICE FIND! Cheap replacement but it appears to be the same bearing type..or lack of.

[ianc]

Yeah, it's the same kind of chintzy motor. I believe the other one is made by AEG(?) from something I saw, but this one's made by Bosch. Funny how they both use what looks like the same weird casting for the body of the motor. Not mucn alternative to this motor unless you want to go the Dayton route however, which (although cheaper), is a lot more work...

Dunno about the RPM's...

ianc

[RWebb]

at a guess there is some other company that makes the motor body castings & has a lock on the market....

[Mysterytrain]

ok, thought I would waste some corporate time and did some searching online today. Found a BMW Radiator Fan Motor that looks like our beloved front condenser fan motor.
Specs: Bosch, 12 volts, 28 watts, 4 amps 4500 rpm. BMW part numbers are 174 01460 427 and 51331460427.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/BMW-K75-K100-New-BOSCH-Radiator-Fan-Motor-1983-95_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ35617QQihZ024QQitemZ 370053723606QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

[Mysterytrain]

Hey wait it gets better lookie here: http://www.boschmotorsandcontrols.co.uk/elektromotoren/produkt/0130007027/index.htm

A bosch motor: BPA 12 V 28 W

Then I found this: Bosch fan for K radiator fan
Date: 6/23/2004 2:54 PM
From: Eamon Stanley

Bosch part # 0 130 007 027, available from a good auto electric store under that number. 55-80$ list( I was low), and I got one for 55$. Used in earler 911's as the A/C condenser fan motor, seen discounted on the net to the mid-50's. The Porsche part dies in exactly the same way. According to the ETK, the same fan ass'y is used in all the k's up to the K12, so the same motor ought to work in all of them. I haven't found out yet if they're rebuildable under the Bosch part#, but I will. Also if just the brushes and bushings can be had. I'd be unshocked if VW and/or Audi use a motor from the same series (BPA) for some similar application.

[ianc]

Nice find Ron!

I looked over your Bosch link and found a couple others:

http://www.boschmotorsandcontrols.co.uk/elektromotoren/produkt/0130007343/index.htm

http://www.boschmotorsandcontrols.co.uk/elektromotoren/produkt/0130007342/index.htm

Looks like the 0 130 007 343 would be the best choice since it spins a little faster, and its current draw of 5.5A is still well within limits. At least I think it's within limits... I can't remember the amperage of the fuse that protects the motor. I was thinking it was 10A?

The pics don't show the electrical connectors very well, but I imagine they're adaptable in a similar way.

Where can these motors be bought? Does Bosch sell directly, or could you order one from a dealer?

ianc

Edited to say: funny that they don't list the 081, which was what I found in my condenser. Perhaps it's obselete?

[CatSkynr]

Originally Posted by ianc

Where can these motors be bought? Does Bosch sell directly, or could you order one from a dealer?

ianc
?

Try here,

Chief Enterprises
Bob Socha
545 W, Lake St.
Elmhurst, IL 60126
630-530-1154

http://www.chiefenterprises.com/dnn/bigpbigroducts/motorspumps.aspx

Part 0 130 007 343 shows, just need to get a quote or call.

[GH85Carrera]

Digging up an old post. I called Chief Enterprises. They don't deal with small orders. Maybe Wayne can order 500 motors but I am real sure I don't want to get into the reselling business. The gave me some leads that I will chase down. I will post what I find.

[88911coupe]

Just a follow on to this. My a/c evaporator fan has crapped out (VERY hard to turn) and I'm wondering if the footwell blower's are a possible replacement. Our host does not sell the evap motor (part # 0 130 063 043). Is there some way to tell the specs on the original part to see what would be a suitable alternative? I can't do the "hurricane" fan upgrade since it only works for the earlier Carrera evap. fan set ups.
TIA

[GH85Carrera]

I called a local Bosch dealer. They did some checking. The motors are only in stock in Germany. It takes three days to get it and ONLY cost $258.00! That does not include the sales tax. There must be some other source.

[ianc]

$258!??!!! That's absurd!

I think my AC evap fan might finally have died, so I'm thinking about this again myself. Thanks for checking...

ianc

[86 911 Targa]

I just sent Wayne an email asking to stock this item indicating various member efforts to locate an exact replacement. (Form-Fit-Function).

Let see what happens......

[wrxnofx]

I wanted to add to this awesome post and provide a bit more detail and photos in terms of "modifying" this AC condenser motor to fit in the footwell blower housing.

First, since this thread was written, this motor seems to be a lot more available. I happened to purchase mine at auto hausAZ (there is no space between the words, but the forum removes the name if I make it all one word). Our host also sells it here.

I didn't want to modify the black blower housing cover like Ianc, so I took my dremel and removed enough of the red plastic so that the cover would not interfere:


In separating the two halves, however, they are now free to move. So I used a little JB Weld to secure them back to the metal motor housing. You can see it in the pic above, although I had to add more after making the connections.

Next, I had to bend the original connector's leads out so that they clear the sides of the motor:


What's not shown in this pic is that you should add some heatshrink tubing to the right connector lead so it doesn't touch any of the motor brush connections. More on that later.

The main issue with the new motor is that the (+) and (-) connectors are higher than that of the original motor. Plus, one of the connectors is male. Thus, you need to create some wire pigtails to make the proper connections (the smaller one is in process):


You then just wire it up:






Notice the heatshrink tube on the original (-) connector lead in that last picture.

Some of you may notice that the picture of the pigtails I made are NOT the ones in the final wiring. The reason is because I naively assumed that I needed to pigtail the left connector lead to the left female motor connector and the right connector lead to the right male motor connector. And that's what I did. Without first testing the direction of rotation. When I then applied power to the motor I realized it was spinning in counter-clockwise (when looking at it from the top). This is the wrong direction for the squirrel cage in the housing. So I had to remake the pigtails and wire the left (+) connector lead to the right male connector on the motor, and the right (-) connector lead to the left female connector on the motor. This enables the motor to spin the necessary clockwise direction. This also made it necessary to add the heatshrink tube to the right (-) connector lead so it didn't touch the metal leading to the right brush (remember this connector lead is wired to the left motor connector so it can't touch the right brush wires).

So lessons learned:
1. If/when I do this again for the passenger footwell motor, I'd JB weld the red plastic to the metal motor BEFORE using the dremel to remove the material.

2. I'd remove the red plastic material LAST, after the motor is totally wired up. It takes a deal of effort to push the pigtails onto the motor connectors, so better to do this before the JB Weld is the only thing holding the red plastic in place.

3. TEST the motor BEFORE making the pigtails to verify how you need to make the connections for proper spin direction instead of being an idiot like me.

I hope this helps someone else out. I was able to use a brand new motor for the same cost of buying a used footwell blower assembly from one of you lovely people on our host here.

[NathanR]

Guys,

First, thanks Ian and WRX for posting this great solution to the FW blower problem. I did this project today but am still scratching my head as to whether I got the polarity right.

Can you confirm a couple observations for me?

1. When viewed from below, the squirrel cage should rotate clockwise?
2. The connector leads wire to the brush arms on the same side, even though they don't line up? You're not crossing each lead to the other side of the motor, right?

My new motor is wired up and installed, but it seems to produce very little airflow, which has me wondering if I got it backwards (as I did with the rear blower ).

Thanks all!
Nathan

[NathanR]

Was reading an AC thread yesterday that implied one could get more air through the front condenser if one subbed a footwell blower for the above motor. Implication being this AC blower is less powerful. Does anyone know if that is true?