CIS to EFI kit

[flat6pilot]

Going strong after 9 years with a few upgrades along the way...

Absolutely no fails in between.

Tony's original kit upgraded to MSII, Carrera manifold, low boost turbo = 350+hp SC:

https://youtu.be/DCJt2pGYQuE

[arbita1]

I was thinking about doing this when I was rebuilding my engine. I got some pros and cons and ended up just keeping my cis instead. I'm still thinking about it.

One thing I noticed is the fuel pressure regulator that Tony recommends from MSD is not really available anywhere. What is everyone using now?


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[Pazuzu]

I used an Aeromotive 13105, which is small and strong, but it requires either converting to AN fittings, or sourcing a few AN type ORB to barb fittings.

[mikl911]

jjefries I have the same reservations. I bought the kit several months ago and other then wanting to break the fresh motor in first (didn't want o deal with tuning while breaking it in) I have waited because I don't like the way most of the system installs look. Not that I have anything against tuner cars but these are Porsches and so far nothing I've done has been cheap so why would I want it to look cheap, even if it is "relatively" inexpensive.

[wreckah]

i'm running this one, with a gauge:
https://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/sum-220057/overview/

been playing with autoune target afr ratios, and it's getting there...2000 to 6200rpm loads of power, and instant throttle reaction...press the pedal and go!
After 6200rpm it tapers off, but i think that's just stock internals SC engine characteristic and of course set off against the extra torque i'm feeling below that.

I chose the stock airbox look, and i'm quite happy with it. Of course i threw away my A/C and heater blower motor too, so it's quite clean if you take care of the wiring. I'm not too fond of the cut-up airbox with attached podfilter look.

[trond]

I am using a FP regulator from a Saab 900. Works fine

[tbitz]

Hi Folks, this is Tony from BitzRacing.com

Hard to believe it is now 14 years since this CIS to EFI journey started. I still have my original 911 running the EFI conversion.

With respect to the kit, it is the same time tested design.

There have been advancements in the MegaSquirt world with newer CPUs and more features, however my experience is that most folks are not computer savvy and don't want extra complexity. They just want something that is simple and works. That is why the kit comes with a default MAP allowing folks to install the kit, turn the key, and drive. Some fine-tuning is generally needed as some folks have made some engine modifications, but you don't start with hundreds of registers to configure from scratch.

With that said, for those who are computer savvy, and interested in more features, there is a free upgrade path by flashing the firmware to MSnS-Extra. For those looking for hardware upgrades, the CPU can be swapped out to MS2 for little cost.

The original FPR is no longer available, however other alternatives exist that meet the same requirements. I have links to those parts, if anyone is interested.

If folks have any specific questions please feel free to PM me here at Pelican, or send email to INFO at BITZRACING dot COM.

Great to see the Pelican Parts forum going strong after all these years.

Thanks,

Tony

[timmy2]

Tony, nice to see you here.
In regards to updating to MSnS-Extra, does the reverse relay logic for the fuel pump you install in the base version get lost?
If so, do you have a version of MSnS-Extra to use posted in the Bitz forum that retains the relay logic?

[tbitz]

Hi Dennis,

Yes a MSnS-Extra firmware code base "HiRes HR11D" is available that retains the reverse fuel pump logic of the Porsche 911.

Can be downloaded, for free, from the BitzRacing Yahoo forum in the "Files->MS1-EXTRA" Files location.

[timmy2]

Originally Posted by tbitz

Hi Dennis,

Yes a MSnS-Extra firmware code base "HiRes HR11D" is available that retains the reverse fuel pump logic of the Porsche 911.

Can be downloaded, for free, from the BitzRacing Yahoo forum in the "Files->MS1-EXTRA" Files location.

Perfect, thanks for the quick response.

[antares]

Originally Posted by timmy2

My fuel mileage average went from 16 mpg with a well tuned CIS with SSI's and Dansk muffler, to an average of 17.5 mpg with EFI. This has been constant since installing.
The '78 was rated at 16 mpg average when new.
A small but noticed improvement in MPG. 10% average.
Very noticeable improvement in throttle response and acceleration.
Haven't had to adjust anything in about 5 years for tuning.
Just get in, turn the key and go.
No other changes to ignition or timing etc were made.

Dennis, my point exactly, as previously pointed out above and as you state an improvement from 16 mpg to 17 mp … so then, once again, to achieve any real mpg on the fly improvements the additional arts n crafts install of a crank sensor along with dedicated coil packs is needed not to mention of course the required motherboard and software that can properly accommodate and correlate all these logarithms and input and not just the input from a single exhaust pipe sensor plug or air flow meter ...

[timmy2]

Originally Posted by antares

Dennis, my point exactly, as previously pointed out above and as you state an improvement from 16 mpg to 17 mp … so then, once again, to achieve any real mpg on the fly improvements the additional arts n crafts install of a crank sensor along with dedicated coil packs is needed not to mention of course the required motherboard and software that can properly accommodate and correlate all these logarithms and input and not just the input from a single exhaust pipe sensor plug or air flow meter ...

True, many advances and options in EFI and ignition timing systems are available for many more hundreds to thousands of dollars.

If I actually cared about mileage with my sports car, I would dial in my AFR much tighter than I have. Install another O2 bung, install the EDIS system I have on a shelf, upgrade the megasquirt as needed and dyno it all ...
I have a set of maps for better mpg, I choose to use one that gives me more performance results and reliability.

My opinion is this system is more about reliability than MPG improvements or power improvements. For relatively low $$ compared to other options this system is very simple and does what it advertises it will do.

I haven't spent a dime on the system since i bought and installed it, or any real time playing around with it in 5 years.
It meets my needs to have a reliable, low maintenance electronic fuel system that works.

[tbitz]

It's now been 15 years since this adventure thread began. Hard to believe. To put a time reference, the CIS to EFI kit was built 3 years before Apple introduced the first iPhone.

Thought I'd let folks know I still have the same 1978 911SC that started this. It's still running the CIS to EFI kit. Car still starts on the first crank.

Love my 911, and hope to be around for another 15 years enjoying it.

Cheers,

Tony

[Marwil]

Congrats on 15 years of success Tony! Your initiative has inspired many, including myself, to venture down the EFI road. It's a great ride!

Counting the days until we shake the snow and salt.

[wreckah]

congrats Tony,

it's been only 1 year for me, but the perfect -4°C starts and crisp throttle response are already getting boring!

cheers and thanks,
Jan

[mikedsilva]

Curious to know; is there a bunch of CIS componentry in reasonable condition for sale since everyone is converting to efi?

[wreckah]

well, the exact reason why I converted was because all that CIS componentry was getting old and worn and impossibly expensive to replace or refurbish. Fed up of buying 400 quid second hand WUR's just to find out that they are as worn as my original one.
I call my box of CIS leftovers 'junk'.

[Tippy]

I'll vouch for the kit. It is stellar after seeing one in person and running on an SC. Looked so clean and right. People have no idea how much work Tony must have put into this kit to make any profits on his end. There's a lot of bits and pieces plus many hours of research to put a kit together like this. The price IMO is pretty good.

[dfhtrhjn]

Is there any reason why the ECU couldn't be placed in the engine bay?

['76 911S 3.0]

Originally Posted by dfhtrhjn

Is there any reason why the ECU couldn't be placed in the engine bay?

MS1/2 is not a sealed unit and any water would wreak havoc on the circuitry inside.