Can I ask some 3.2 vs 3.0 questions

[confused]

Hey guys, I have a 914-6 with a '83 3.0SC in it. I was thinking of adding cams and new pistons to increase power but by the time I do all that I might as well buy a running 3.2 instead.


First question: are the tachometer guage different between the SC and the Carrera? What is the redline of the 3.2? The orange line on the SC tach starts at 6200RPM is this the redline? or can it rev up to the end of the orange area 7000RPM? I haven't gone over 6200 yet.
The reason for asking the difference between the two tachs is I may have my tach modified by Hollywood Speedo to accomodate a gas guage, so could I still use it on a 3.2?


Current engine: stock 1983 3.0SC with Weber 40s and 1-5/8" headers into a stock early muffler (2 in 1 out). What do I have.... around 200HP - 210HP?
Problems: Engine not perfectly setup for carbs, I have CIS cams and the compression could be higher than 9.3 (like 9.8), the gas mileage is bad (I think its 16mpg, but its not a big problem).


So if I get a 3.2 then what kind of hp can I look forward to? Andersons books has a case study that states a possible increase in a 3.2 from 213hp to 240hp with a mass air flow, exhaust, and chip. And I am assuming that gas mileage will be better with injection. There is no need for any emissions equipment as it is a early non-smog car.


I'm trying to weigh the benefits and expenses. I can sell my 3.0 with webers to cover the bulk of the cost in buying a used 3.2. Does anyone know if the flywheels are the same between the two engines? I think the rest of the 914-6 conversion parts will transfer over. I guess I will need to change the fuel system over to a FI fuel pump etc.

If anyone has any answers or suggestions please let me know. Thanks, the info found on this board is awsome!

[catuck]

Other things to consider, are:

to use a 3.2 with motronic injection will require a DME and harness.
If you want heat, you will have to re-plumb your car a little. Not a big deal in a 911, I'm not sure about a 914-6.

Your tach should work, redline in a 3.2 is 6800 with a performance chip. A stock chip is set lower in most DME's.

If you are using a 915 trans. then a flywheel from an 84-86 will work. You cannot use a flywheel from a 3.0 on a 3.2.

I think you're pretty close on your hp figures. I think you can get 230-240 hp with just ssi's, good muffler, and a chip.

[Superman]

You are raising good questions, and appropriate ones, but I do not know most of the answers. I can tell you that, on a recent Dyno Day here, the SCs all dyno'd about the same peak horsepower regardless of various small modifications (backdated exhaust, 20/21 cams, etc.). About 200 hp at the flywheel.

If you're coming down with a bad case of torquosis, then you might consider leapfrogging the 3.2 idea and go directly to the end game, which is a 3.6. Less expensive if you just admit that you have the sickness now, and that only 260+ hp will cure your itch. In fact, some say that the itch remains, regardless of hp. Ask Juan (800 hp).

[dd74]

"torquosis?"

[Randy Webb]

I thought it was torquitis.

Maybe its the amount of inflammation that is the difference?

[dd74]

Well by my understanding of the computer game "Zoo Tycoon," it is a mating proceedure performed by tortoises.

[ChrisBennet]

If you are running a pre-915 transmission I would be wary of pouring lots of torque through it.
-Chris

[BURN-BROS]

If you do a 3.2 you will be very very happy. I rode in one(914) last weekend and it flat out ran.

[confused]

Or is it spelled: torquoitis? Ha ha, funny guys.

Right now I am pretty happy with the power, I am going to set up the car's suspension a little better before I change engines. Yes I am using a stock 901 914 transmission so in the future I may get into some transmission breakage.... but I have 3 extra 914 side shift transmissions.... in the end it may be better to just switch them if one should break. There is also the option of a re-enforced intermediate plate which I have not done yet. The cost of putting a 915 in a 914 (damn all these similar numbers) is very high. I think it will cost around $2500 or more, whereas the 901s can be found very cheap and they can handle up to 300hp. The clutch is much smaller though.

I have the itch... I raced some kid in a Honda Civic the other day and while I didn't push it to hard (for safety resons) the kid was neck and neck with me. He had some turbo'ed Vtec engine that his parents much have bought him. I beat him but he was quick. So I want there to be no competition in future races, I'd like to show people what a Porsche- set up properly- can really do.

Does anyone know what the redline might be on my 3.0 SC engine configuration?

thanks for the input thus far.

[chuckw951]

Have you thought about tweaking the 3.0 instead of going to a 3.2?

While you could sell the 3.0 and get a 3.2 you'll be buying a used motor. Instead you could rebuild the 3.0 with 3.2 P&Cs, high compression pistons (twin plug maybe?), bigger ports (and matching manifolds), cams and a couple of other modifications to get a real screamer...though the MPG will suffer. Seems like you could get to 250hp that way.

[anh911]

You can go either way, 3.2 or since you already have it build the 3.0. If the 3.0 is in good shape you can rev it to 6K without worry. And what's up with the Honda? Your car should leave that POS in the dust. (Not that anyone endorses street racing) Ollie's has better parts for the 901s if you start breaking them.
Spend some cash on track days and instructors, it's great fun and you'll learn more about the car in 1 weekend than you can imagine.

[autoxracer31]

yea, how high can a stock 3.0 motor run in the RPM's 7000 max? or just 6500 top end?

[speeder]

Originally posted by autoxracer31
yea, how high can a stock 3.0 motor run in the RPM's 7000 max? or just 6500 top end?

I think that the rev-limiter cuts in @ 65-6700rpm on a stock 3.0. There is no reason that you would want to rev one higher, there is absolutely nothing there. (HP-wise).

[anh911]

Superduperman,
on your dyno day the stock 3.0s had the same power as the ones with 20/21s etc?

[Randy Webb]

Ya know the 3.2L heads can flow a lot of air -- some have put them onto 3L motors....

If you build it right you can churn 8k on the revs.
check out the Aase (Sp?) Ti keepers, some new race springs, and light wt. valves (CS or use the 993 ones). Some have also used Ti rockers.

The question is, how much do you want to spend?

[iamchappy]

I am going to solve my 3.0 hp problem in my 914 with a bae or rfng turbo kit. I have a 79 3.0 so my compression is lower than yours. The bae kits have been running on SC's for 20 years now with good horsepower gains at 8-9lbs of boost.
If I can get a 40 or 50 hp increase from it I should be happy, If not there are a few things that can be done like intercooler and fuel enrichment that could get you up to 100 hp gains. You have to be willing to bore holes and cut into the trunk and have some welding skills but who needs a rear trunk when you've got a front.

[iamchappy]

Check out this link I've spoken to Thad he is very knowlegable in regards to turbos, he has turbocharge many different cars. and I am convienced this will work in a 914.
911SC Turbo

[chuckw951]

Whew turbo charging looks complicated. A while back there was an article in Excellence about a 914 3.6 conversion. Car was "blacked out" and looked great. As I recall the owner installed a plate to block out first gear b/c of the 3.6's torque. I can't remember if he was running a 901 transmission though. A 914 with a 3.0 must be quick...can't imagine a 3.6 on public roads.

[iamchappy]

When I look at all the effort and money one has to go through to get more hp out of a na engine, by use of carbs,cams,crank pistons, cylinders,money over money, No wonder Porsche choose to turbocharge the engine, way simpler, all external, cheaper, and huge hp gains.

[chuckw951]

Originally posted by iamchappy
When I look at all the effort and money one has to go through to get more hp out of a na engine, by use of carbs,cams,crank pistons, cylinders,money over money, No wonder Porsche choose to turbocharge the engine, way simpler, all external, cheaper, and huge hp gains.

Ah, but you're forgetting about the turbo lag. With a NA motor you hit the gas and you go. And yes I know there are things that can be done to minimize the lag (how much do you want to spend). I had a 944 turbo that was very fast, but for me the 911 is more fun to drive because there's no waiting for the fun. But whatever float your boat ,by all means.