Embarassing....help remove LF side marker

[Wil Ferch]

Man this is embarassing....

I've done this before but not with so much of the car "assembled" and still together.

Car is an 85 Carrera ...short hood/bumper car.

I'm trying to remove the driver's side, (front) side marker light and to gain access, I removed the LF bumper bellows as well as the sheet metal trim piece right behind it. However, I'm having a real issue to get access to the front mounting bolt for this light assembly. The following are all in the way:

- windshield washer bottle/system in front of wheel well.
- fog light.
- neighboring turn signal light ( natch...*it's* mounting nuts are from behind too and inaccessable). ....

....any of which ( if gone) could get me some access space. I tried removing the driver's fog light and the vertical mounting post of the fog light is too long to allow removal ( arrgh!). How would one remove this light ( as a related question?)

One last chance....there is an undercut beneath the bumper over the fog light. It mimics the cut out for improved air flow to the oil cooler on the other side. From there I can "see" the nut I wish to remove, but I would need a triple or quintuple-universal joint ratchet extension that I don't have.

Is there an easier way without removing the front bumper? Am I missing something fairly obvious? I don't recall this problem on the other side where I did this before.

Am I facing a bumper removal to simply remove the driver's side marker light ??

- - Wil

[BER]

Wil,

I feel your pain. I do not have the answer for the driver's side, but do recall all the skinned knuckles and uttering bad words to get the passenger side marker light out. I recall the rear nut coming off as you described for the driver's side. The front nut was the devil to reach. I remember coming up from under the car and working in the blind in a very tight spot. I used a 1/4" drive rachet and a 6" flexible extension to reach the nut.

Hopefully someone else has more specifics for the driver's side.

Bruce
'84 Carrera
'77 911 (RoW spec)

[Wil Ferch]

Bruce, thanks....

Hopefully the 75 "hits" with no further comments by others are only because this question is open for only one day.....and people have to first see/touch their own cars (after work?) to possibly comment further. This could take some time. Still hoping to hear from others in time....

In the meantime, I will search out and borrow those multi-articulated universal joints for possible access....and as a last resort, maybe simply remove the bumper. Once the rubber accordions come off...its simply a matter of removing the front rub strip and you have access to the front bumper shock nuts. But then you need to slightly remove/support the bumper and all the stuff that entails.....would like to avoid that for this kind of work.

We'll see....

Wil

[djmcmath]

Seems like when I was tearing down my fenders, that whole area was impossible. There were no access cuts, no easy ways to get into anything. I determined at that point that German engineers from the 80's were all three inches tall.

I've found that the windshield washer system is relatively easy to uninstall. On my '86, there's one bolt on the bottom of that reservoir that has to go, then you can disconnect the tubing and pull out the whole thing. That frees up at least a little space. If that doesn't do it, I'm at a loss, 'coz that whole area is so poorly set up for actually doing work. I'll take another look this evening, though.

Dan

[ausdilecce]

Personally, I would remove the front bumper.. Its not as much work as you would imagine AND it makes r&r of anything thereabouts SOOO much easier... ( I was very afraid to take off the front bumper before I did it the first time, but once I did it, I wondered what I was so afraid of )..

To remove bumper :
1) remove phillips screws from either side of black rubber strip..
2) peel rubber strip off plastic 'channel' it is attached to
3) remove 4 nuts that hold bumper to bumper pistons
4) remove bumper ( slowly ) and rest it on your thighs as you r&r the marker light(s)
5) when done, just slide bumper back on the studs as you do what you need to do..

You WILL figure out what you need to do to get the rubber strip back on.. ( it's somewhat obvious when you see it )

Good luck

[Wil Ferch]

That portion of the car..at least...was meant to go together easily on an assembly line....I can almost "see" the process., when I see what "can't" be accessed. Sub-assemblies going together rather easily and that "block" of stuff gets bolted-on to the next sub-assembly, etc...

Maintenance afterwards? ....fuhgetaboutit !

Bruce...yeah...the other side is tight but do-able. Yes, you need monkey paws, but the clearance around the oil cooler makes for a completely different situation.

Dan..thanks for the tip. I'll look at Bentley and maybe some exploded view diagrams to get similar hints. Room around the washer bottle would make this do-able.

Wil

[Hetmann]

I remember what a hassle this side was om my car. Getting the washer bottle out was a big help. I liked it so much better without the bottle that I never put it back in.

[Wil Ferch]

I understand how the bumper gets removed....but thanks for the reminder on the sequence, it may also help others who face this. It just seems remarkable that a "bumper" has to come off to replace a "light fixture".....go figure......

Also, depending upon the way you remove the front rub strip, my experience is that you may end up having to buy more of the 7 nylon pin inserts that hold the whole thing together. They tend to get damaged or "stretch" and the resulting re-fit may be loose.

Another hint:...when you re-attach the bumper using the shock mount screws, you tighten these against a small rubber pad that sits between (?) the bumper and the metal shock "foot". Because these bolts for each shock/bumper mount are on a diagonal....you have some latitude in how "tight" you cinch down, and this results in different amounts of "tilt" that the bumper has ( side view..angled up or angled down). Hmm....actually how much "angle of attack" this "wing" has !!!! A little dinking around here makes for a nice straight look with even gaps.

I borrowed a couple of 1/4" universals...and maybe that'll work. Say....how does one remove the drivers's fog? I've had the passenger side out before but I can't see how you do this without ( big surprise here !!..) ...removing the bumper.

I sense where this is going to end up ...

Is the washer bottle a simple matter of one strap screw, or such ??

Wil

[djmcmath]

Yes, the washer bottle is one strap-bolt. The only hassle is getting it back in, afterwards.

[Wil Ferch]

OK....any hints on removing the driver's fog light w/o major disassembly of "other" sub-sytems?

I think the vertical "post" on the backside of the fog mount...goes throught a horizontal yoke...maybe the horizontal piece can be removed....allowing the vertical post to be removed....allowing the fog to come out ...allowing ( hey!) access to the side marker bolts !!!

Anyone BTDT ?

Wil

[djmcmath]

Sorry it's taken me so long to get out there. I finally had time to pick up the car and pull the FL wheel off. I don't see any good way to remove those assys, though. Pulling the fog light, iirc, didn't give me enough room to get at anything important. But then, I was trying to get the rubber trim piece disconnected, and couldn't have cared less about the blinkers.

Any luck?

Dan

[Wil Ferch]

Update..

.....made some progress....will probably do a turn-signal tech article on this later...

No question the driver's side will be the bigger problem with more stuff in the way. New findings.....here's how to remove the fog light:
- the fog attaches to the valence using a pivoting vertical post on the fog housing. This post has a "long" projection beyond what is necessary, and the fog housing dimensions within the valence are "tight" enough to not allow the vertical post to come out past it's mount. The answer is to first remove the black plastic "surround" housing from the front of the fog light. The result is a smaller ( L x W) lamp that can be wiggled more. There is also a cross-pin that the vertical post rides on...do not remove the pin bolt as the pin is "captured" and cannot be removed. Do, however, loosen the nut to allow the vertical post to "pivot" more easily after the black trim is removed. So the fog gets removed "this" way.

Access to the side marker and turn signals screws then is from below ( fog light removal NOT necessary....arghh!)...using 1 or 2 , 1/4" universals on a long ( guessing 10-14") extension. Some wrestling, but CAN be done.

My project/ reason for doing this:

...remove front turn-signal ( T/S) light assembly, to allow straight shot of air into the fender mounted ( stock location) oil cooler. Add an additional , small T/S light, as necessary, but must function correctly as a parking and T/S light.

Details later or as a separate "lighting" thread...

- - Wil