Entry price for getting into the RS clone world?

[w21055]

Ok,

So I have been starting to look for a long hood RS clone and wanted to see what the group thought on something.

Obviously I could buy a 71-73 long hood and start hacking it up, but is it better to get one that has already had the work started and finish it off or buy one completed?

I am pretty sure I could handle most of the rebuild, save any type of welding or body work.

I was looking at a couple listed in the for sale forums and you can pretty much see the swing-11K for one that is started and 35K for one that is done.

I guess the bigger question is, on one for 11K with the body mods, could you see it getting up to 35k?

Thanks
Phil

[dd74]

Cars are poor investments unless the market is vastly inflated. A true early Carrera could fetch you some money, but it all depends on the shape of the car, how original, and if people are paying big money.

I'm not sure about the market these days, but if you look in the Pelican Classifieds, it seems like there are quite a few very nice cars there that have been for sale for months; unless the sellers are updating their listings with "Sold."

As far as getting an unfinished clone that's already been worked on, well, it's a crap shoot. If the car's for sale, and you like what's been completed by the P.O., then by all means, investigate it with the idea that you might be able to make a very good deal on it. But be sure to have the quality of the work checked out before buying. There are some clone cars out there which are very dicey.

Good luck.

[pwd72s]

Easy, depending on how accurate you wished your clone to be. To build an RS replica 2.7 engine from scratch? MFI...everything else as done then? Figure $18K So, your 11K car would go to 29K right there...want a 915 gearbox? Then you're better off to start with a '72 or '73 911T...praying that the gearbox doesn't need rebuilding. Most well done, emphasis on well done, RS clones are selling for less than their owners put into them.

[Shuie]

Unless you like pain, buy one that is already done. These cars eat money. You probably wouldn't be the first person here that managed to pull it off, but you'd still be lucky to build a really nice car for less than $35k. Good luck.

[suntoys]

it all depends on your personal standard for accuracy and quality or at the very least taste. some clones are meant to be only admired for accuracy. Some clones are meant to capture the spirit of the car. The spirit of driving, which i think is the essence why we would consider buying a replica. For me, the best replicas ae not the ones that look most correct but the ones that truly capture the "feeling" of driving the real deal or the period from where the car belonged

Chris

[Joeaksa]

Other thing to look at is that the cars were not 100% zinc coated until the 1976 time frame from what I hear. This is one reason why many people take a SC or newer car and backdate it.

The early cars rust and while you are in Atlanta and its not too bad during the winter anywhere that has a lot of moisture rust can be an issue. Rust has claimed far more cars than accidents have.

[randywebb]

define what you mean by clone - do yo mean a wimpmobile with just a ducktail on it?

or a fire-breathing 3.8RS motored monster?

or what?

[artisticent]

You can find good enough deals out there to where you can make money or sell at a wash. I wanted to build a RSR clone. I found a 1973 car with a bunch of extra parts and 993 seat extra for 3K. It was non running, engine in bits and tranny out. I sold bits and pieces for 2K. I used the tranny for another car. I welded on flares, a roof and a little extra. Now I have a TRUE year for an RSR build tub, an excellent place to start for nothing. Because of the year I can install ANY motor and not worry about smog, and piece it together. If I do it right, It could sell for 35K EASY.
Nathan
Here is a pic of what I aspire mine to be.

[rdane]

Originally posted by artisticent
If I do it right, It could sell for 35K EASY.
Here is a pic of what I aspire mine to be.

Yep, done right you'll have $60/80K into the car and sell it for 30 tops...easy

ROTFLMAO :-)

[artisticent]

60K-80K??? I just dont get it. Is that if everything is bought directly from porsche and installed by the Queen of England. Oh well. I guess I will truly only know once I am done. I would love to hear from anyone who has built one and though back to a less expensive way of something being done.
THanks
Nathan

BTW what is ROTFLMAO???

[suntoys]

speaking of slapping on ducktails....



quack quack

[artisticent]

I need one of those ducktails.....

[rdane]

Build a couple and you'll figure it out. The second will always be cheaper to build but will cost more Or do a search here on Pelican for some of the better project cars. Most will have 30K just in parts. With those parts bought at a discount.

Here is a fun thread to get you going.
The $100K 911

[artisticent]

Assuming I have the tub with the flares done. The motor and tranny all done and interior done. I need a cage, coilovers-suspension,bushings and what other big items.

[randywebb]

I just dont get it.

Dane has been there. You don't need to do your car to the level his was, but you will need to spend a chunk of change - even if all the labor is done by you. That assumes you do engine & suspension work not just a fake piece of fiberglass...

NO need for a cage unlees you race.
NO need for coilovers.
Bushing are not that spendy - the motor is.

[rlh930]

Here is a pic of what I aspire mine to be.

That's my car, and what you say is flattering. The truth is that this car is far from done, and far from the quality of cars like Dane's, and it STILL has cost a lot of money. At the risk of depressing myself, here is a partial breakdown:

Car, with bodywork already done - $11K
Suspension - $5K
Brakes - $2K
Wheels and tires - $3K
Engine - $23K
SSI, muffler - $1500
Steering wheel, Wevo shifter, H4's, ... $2K

This is crowding $40K and consider what's NOT done:

Paint - up close it's not as nice as it appears in pictures
Interior - new carpets, door panels, and probably seats
Wheels - the Fikse's on the car are for AX, but I don't like the way they look on a period car so I have Lindsey's on the way.

This stuff is probably another $10-15K.

Could you do it cheaper? Sure. I thought I could live a while with the used SC motor the PO put in (at a cost of $10K with labor) but it started to hemorrhage oil all over the garage floor so I bit the bullet and put in a hot rod 3.2SS with Motec. Could I have lived with the stock brakes? Probably, but I could also have gotten Big Reds at a cost of $4-5K.

Don't get me wrong, I love old 911's and even a stock one is tremendous fun, but it's a slippery slope.

[artisticent]

Hi Roger.

In my opinion you truly have the most beautiful 911 I have seen. More importantly, its so amazing that my wife actually encourages me to go to the garage and work on it, just to have it look like yours. I would be under the price on the engine, but all the other prices look very fair. What year is yours?? if it is a 73 like mine, I would love to ask a few questions if you didnt mind taking the time.
Thank you
Nathan

[911pcars]

Phil,
I'd suggest finding the nicest early 911 you can find for your budget, RS or not. If you decide to convert a factory-bodied example, set aside an extra amount to convert to RS spec (rear flares, front/rear bumper ducktail, paint).

Many of the clones you see are built beyond RS spec., with a 2.8, 2.9, 3.0, 3.2 or 3.6 or swing the other way with a 2.7, 2.4 or an anything else engine. Most have suspensions beyond what the factory RS cars were equipped with, same with wheels. Many are running 16" Fuchs rather that 15s, again beyond RS spec. Same with brakes, etc., etc., etc.

The clone look is only skin deep. You could spend your initial money on the exterior then build the drivetrain and suspension slowly as finances permit. Most owners follow some sort of build sequence over time. A very few are fortunate to make the transformation all at once.

The key is to start with a sound structure, and there might be more to choose from the entire fleet of available cars than just the RS clones. OTOH, the average RS-clone might be in better shape than the average early 911.

That said, once modified, few cars appreciate much in value; most don't. Someone spending big dollars for an RS upgrade won't recover that investment when it comes time to sell. There are cases of owners who have spent 100K on improvements. Could be those are the ones asking top dollar. They'll never recoup that upgrade investment. That's when buyers such as yourself can take advantage. Same holds true for the general automotive resale market. That's how most of us got our cars from 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th owners who each took a dollar hit but presumably got reimbursed through driving satisfaction.

Good luck with your search,
Sherwood

[artisticent]

sorry, I just saw its a 73. What offset are we dealing with, or is it different for you if you have changed trailing arms. I need a front suspension pan. Should I stay with a 73 or get any year??
Thanks

[rlh930]

[QUOTE I would love to ask a few questions if you didnt mind taking the time.
[/QUOTE]

Sure, PM me! FYI the car is a '73.