A Photo Diary of a top-end rebuild. Or, The Tale of a one-armed rebuild.

[wilke3169]

I did register. Really not sure I'm ready for the DE. I am going to Roebling Road next Friday. It's such a slippery slope you know.
Let me Know if you need any help with anything.

[Don Ivey]

How do you subscribe to this thread? Thanks,

Don Ivey
'87 Carrera

[4flyboy]

Don "click" Thread Tools at the top right of this page. When the drop down menu drops click on subscribe.

S.

[charleskieffner]

subscribed

[gregwils]

"I took the day off from work to pick up the heads. Luckily all valves were good. But I did need twelve new guides. It still added up pretty fats."

Rob - I am anticipating this same project next winter. I know that you posted some costs early on, but based on the scope of your project what would you estimate someone should budget for machine shop work for a similar project? I'm kind of asking what you paid Protech without asking what you paid Protech. Thanks.

[Gunter]

If your valves and springs are still good, and you only need valve guides, I think $700.- to $1000.- to do the heads.
It would include checking the springs, measuring the valve stems, installing new guides, 3-angle grind and shaving off ~0.002 equally from the heads.
Most important is to find a shop with experience and a good reputation.
Depending on Mileage and condition, other machining could show up when disassembling.
Hope you'll find Mahle P/C's.

[Dixie]

what would you estimate someone should budget for machine shop work...

Over the years I've learned to take the estimate given when you drop the parts off, and double it. That way you won't be shocked at the cost when you pick the parts up..

The work on my heads came in a few dollars over $1,000. That covered, 12 guides, 12 additional shims, new seals, valve job, cleaning, plus surfacing the flywheel. (Labor rate was $88/hr.)

So the total cost for replacing the guides, the divlar studs, new tensioner oil lines, all accessible seals/gaskets, and other general minutia (Minutia may be a misnomer. Those "small" items add up fast when they’re Porsche parts):

$2,500.

[mca]

Rob,

I am also starting a rebuild soon. In fact, I am waiting on you to finish so that I can use Kevin's stand!

My "spare" engine is being delivered tomorrow. Can't wait to dig in.

A few posts back you included your expenses to date. It would be great if you could keep posting that info every week or so with the breakdown - it certainly helps others get a better idea of costs involved. Is $2500 your total so far?

Also, were you satisfied with Protech? I will likely send my heads to them as well since they are geographically closest to me - should save a little on shipping.

Many thanks and thanks for starting this thread.

Craig

[Dixie]

Sure Craig,


But the list is getting pretty long. Especially when you factor in the clutch project.

[mca]

Craps ... that reminds me. I need to add a new clutch to my Projects List.

Sure does add up fast!

You have enough on your plate with your rebuild - don't worry about compiling a list of expenses. Maybe after you finish and have some free time.

[Dixie]

A few posts back you included your expenses to date. It

Here ya' go. Adjusted for all the seals I bought that were already in the top-end gasket kit.

Qty Price Cost Part
4 $1.50 $6.00 911 CV Joint Bolt
1 $81.75 $81.75 Reverse Light Switch
1 $72.00 $72.00 Cam Bar tool
1 $25.20 $25.20 Heat Exchanger Nut Removal Tool
1 $54.25 $54.25 Thermo valve
1 $163.19 $163.19 Fuel line
4 $4.00 $16.00 Ball Socket Retaining Clip
1 $1.20 $1.20 Cable Holder
2 $97.00 $194.00 Position Sensor, Motronic Ignition
1 $73.75 $73.75 Temperature Sensor
2 $7.50 $15.00 Chain Ramp
24 $4.50 $108.00 Rocker shaft RSR seals
1 $27.00 $27.00 Cam oil line RH
1 $46.00 $46.00 Cam oil line LH
1 $19.75 $19.75 Pulley Seal
1 $218.00 $218.00 Cylinder gasket kit
12 $13.50 $162.00 Head studs
4 $12.75 $51.00 Oil return tubes
6 $0.50 $3.00 Copper exhaust nuts
6 $3.00 $18.00 Exhaust barrel nuts
1 $9.00 $9.00 Assembly Lube
1 $4.25 $4.25 Converter to muffler seal
1 $9.00 $9.00 Mahle oil filter
1 $30.00 $30.00 Case sealers, thread lockers
12 $3.00 $36.00 Brake cleaner
1 $7.00 $7.00 Mineral Spirits
1 $51.00 $51.00 Resurface G50 flywheel
6 $160.00 $960.00 Machine work (12 guides, 12 shims)

TOTAL $2,461.34

[Dixie]

Clutch project:

Qty Price Cost Part
1 $186.25 $186.25 Improved shaft & Bushings
9 $1.50 $13.50 Pressure plate bolts
1 $28.00 $28.00 Throttle shaft arm
1 $50.00 $50.00 Clutch slave line
1 $6.50 $6.50 Engine Oil Switch
9 $2.00 $18.00 Flywheel bolts
1 $304.25 $304.25 Clutch disk
1 $8.00 $8.00 Pilot bushing
1 $409.00 $409.00 Pressure Plate
1 $113.00 $113.00 Throw out bearing
1 $202.00 $202.00 Improved release fork
1 $89.00 $89.00 Slave cylinder
1 $71.00 $71.00 Throwout guide tube
1 $12.50 $12.50 Mainshaft seal
1 $13.00 $13.00 Shift seal
1 $14.50 $14.50 Flywheel seal
1 $1.75 $1.75 Engine int. shaft seal
1 $8.85 $8.85 Clutch align. tool

TOTAL $1,549.10

[mca]

Great! Thanks for taking the time to put that together.

[Gunter]

Good list.

6 $160.00 $960.00 Machine work (12 guides, 12 shims)

What shims are those?

[Dixie]

What shims are those?

Spring shims. Think about it. Cut the valve face. Then cut the valve seat. Now the valve stem sticks up through the valve spring a touch more than before.

[TibetanT]

Originally Posted by Capt. Carrera

I tried gently prying the washer off. I thought I'd post here before getting medieval on it. And yes, there's some kind of hard, shiny, green stuff around the inner rim of the fitting.

I know what you mean! I am finding this as well with a '78 3.0L engine I'm working on, not to mention lots of RTV. WWT? Must be a "quick and temporary" fix is my guess.
Whatever works at the time I suppose.

[Gunter]

Originally Posted by Capt. Carrera

Spring shims. Think about it. Cut the valve face. Then cut the valve seat. Now the valve stem sticks up through the valve spring a touch more than before.

I am thinking............

If it isn't excessive, the extra amount sticking out is absorbed by the adjusting screw.

To be clear: 12 new thicker OEM shims?
Do these shims come with various thickness?

Or adding shims to the existing ones?

Please, clarify.

[rick-l]

Originally Posted by Capt. Carrera

Spring shims. Think about it. Cut the valve face. Then cut the valve seat. Now the valve stem sticks up through the valve spring a touch more than before.

I think it might be more along the lines of F = k * x. With the valve higher the spring isn't compressed as much.

[Gunter]

Originally Posted by rick-l

I think it might be more along the lines of F = k * x. With the valve higher the spring isn't compressed as much.

That's how I see it and when my heads were done by a very experienced shop the springs were checked for tension etc. but the same OEM shims were re-used.
I discussed the issue of how the stems stick out a little more after grinding the seats and was told that the adjuster screw will absorb it.
That made sense to me but there may be something new to learn.

12 new OEM shims? Why?
Or what exactly, please.

[ianc]

I discussed the issue of how the stems stick out a little more after grinding the seats and was told that the adjuster screw will absorb it.

The adjusting screw will absorb the decreased clearance as the valve stem moves out.

If the spring is less compressed as the stem moves out, then there will be less preload on the spring and less force required to open the valve?

ianc