The utlimate tire review thread...

[SCWDP911]

I apologize if this has already been done and is out there somewhere, but after staying up way too late again tryign to decide what new shoes I should put on my baby, I am still without a choice. I have also been on the tirerack and other sites reading their reviews, but honestly, while some are OK, I think most would not apply much to 911 drivers.

Also, tires change a lot year to year, so maybe a running thread on this topic will be helpful to others besides me.

That in mind. It is time for new shoes. I am running standard 6/7 x 16 Fuchs. I know not everyone has the same size wheel, so how about we do it in a standard format for each post, as follows (if anyone thinks the stuff listed below should be modified, please PM me - I am not a tire expert)

Wheel Sizes:

Tire sizes:

911 model year:

Tire make:

Tire model:

Price paid:

Where purchased from:

Majority of use (track, street):

Mileage on tires at time of review:

Rate the following 1-10, 1 being worst, 10 being best:

Dry Straightline Traction:

Dry Cornering:

Wet Straightline Traction:

Wet Cornering:

Sidewall Rollover:

Wear(mileage):

Noise:

Comfort:

Overall Street Rating:

Overall Track Rating:

Comments:

[charleskieffner]

geez just drop the credit card on some michelin pilot sport cups and be done with it. played this game with dunlops then yoko es 100's(a joke) and finally took some advice from some hardcore track rats and made the plunge.

NIGHT DAY DIFFERENCE!

if ya wanna haul ass and not be singing the 911 mantra over and over at extreme decibels "WHEN IN A SPIN BOTH FEET IN" buy the damn michelins and be done with it.

had some confidence with the dunlops at the track and street. after spinning my 911 at the track on the yokos and a bead busting off rim that was all it took to become shell shocked.

michelins = confidence

i can promise you from personnal experience you will not have the chance to DO ANYTHING but start singing the 911 MANTRA at the TOP OF YOUR LUNGS and if yer really good(like i am, ha ha) planting your left foot on your clutch fully and your right foot firmly on the brake when the ass end decides to pass you!

please ask CUL8R and LEEH as they witnessed this at firebird intl raceway.

until you correctly pull this maneuver off ,CORRECTLY ,(key word)w/out hitting anything you have not POPPED YER CHERRY with a 911!

cheap tires get ricky racers killed!

[sagolfer]

I'm also looking for new tires. Reviews are very confusing as you may get a great review then a poor one on the same tire model. Further confusion is added by what vehicle the tire is actually tested on. I read a review that a certain model performed great on a 911 but poorly on another make/model.

Maybe a catagory or just comments on intended use (track, track and road, low milage, everyday driver, etc.) coud be added.

I look forward to your results.

[SCWDP911]

bump - I will give a review on my Fuzion ZRi's once I have them broke in. Just installed yesterday.

[RWebb]

I think you will be MUCH further ahead if you simply use the TireRack web site to select the top 2 performance categories of all tires that will fit your 911. It will be a short list - very short if you have 15" wheels, short if 16"

Then post those and ask for subjective opinions.

You will STILL have the problem that most will say how great their new tires are compared to their old ones. Two strong types of bias are operating:
[1] placebo effect,
[2] old tires are just that - old. The posters cannot compare 2 new tires (except rarely). Instead they are comparing a worn tread tire that also likely has hardened rubber with a nice new one.

[SCWDP911]

I agree with you Randy, except, it really is not meant to be a comparison between tires, but a opinion of the tires you have on the car now. I understand your point though that often the thoughts expressed of the current tire are as they compare, if perhaps only the reviewers mind, to the previously used tire.

I guess to follow up further on your thoughts, does everyone typically agree with the reviews that tirerack or other sites give?

[ramonesfreak]

I have the Fuzion ZRi's on the stock fuchs. love em. im positive there are better tires out there. but, when i bought my car last april, my first 911, the tires that came on the car were about 10 years old and totally dry rotted and dangerous and i was broke from the purchase, but was not willing to drive the car for even 2 days without getting new tires...came across the Fuzions and they were very cheap and figured they were certainly better than the dangerous tires on the car and if i hated em, could replace em when my budget was better. 10K miles later, i love them and they still look brand new. I cant remember what i paid exactly without looking, but im pretty sure they were less than $350, mounted and balanced. no complaints so far. i dont track the car, dont drive it in the rain or snow and am very "careful" when i drive the car so.....

[laughac]

Oh boy. I could really bore ou with all of my tire combos but I wish empircal data was available.
Useful results could include maximum g force before slipping in various conditions and vehicle weight. Also wish they would identify the rubber compound along with the current wear rating.

I juice want tires that weight under 15 lbs, can make 900 lbs stick to 95' F tarmac at up to 1.2 g, and will last 7 years or 50,000 mile. That may sound like a ridiculous statement but putting tire performance in those terms should be relatively easy for manufacturers. Curent treadwear and traction ratings are too broad.

I really like the predictable slide I got from Bridgestone RE950s. After a few months my Kumho Ecstas are also predctable. Right now I predict that they won't last through the summer.

[911s55]

Originally Posted by v8_ranch

I guess to follow up further on your thoughts, does everyone typically agree with the reviews that tirerack or other sites give?

The only information other than actual specs I consider are the "test" reports.

Grab bag reviews on different vehicles by amature drivers, most of which aren't similar to me and mine in type or style makes no sense for me. Good for the marketing folks though.

David

[911st]

I am looking at two tires currently for street/tt/autoX/value:
Bridgstone RE-01r's in 225 & 205/16, and
Hankood R-S2's 245/45 & 225/45/16's .

Have not pulled the triger yet, any input on size and tire is appricated.

Kumo MX's also hold some interest also.

[ToddM]

I think what is missing in a lot of these "tire" posts is what experience people have using different sets of tires on the SAME car. Somebody will say that love model "X" because it was better than whatever POS tire was on there beforehand.

Then, some people love a tire because of how well it lasts, some because of how quiet it is, and some because of how well it sticks. Everybody drives their cars different and everybody had thier own personal preference about what is important. Maybe somebody who just farts around and isn't power sliding wouldn't even notice or care thatthey truly have a set of tires that don't work on the car - they are quiet and last long and they are elated with the rubber.

To me, the single most important aspect when selecting tires for a 911 IF you really drive the thing is the REAR sidewall stiffness, support, and repeatability (as laughac stated); this is where all the weight is and this is where most of the work is happening.

Michelin Pilots and Bridgestone S02s have repeatedly proven to me that they work on a 911 on the street with a demanding driver. Both of these tires provide excellent rear sidewall support, wear evenly with a proper setup due to their lack of deformation, predictability, and dry grip down to end of life.

Other tires I have tried on the same car were FK452, RE050 (avoid on 911), G-force TA KD (good but not as good), SP8000, SP9000, Pzero, S03 (hunts & wanders).

So I agree with Charles regarding the Michelins and everytime I need tires for the 911, I run out and buy S02s. Both of these tires just work right on a 911. Everytime I have played "tire tester" I have wasted my time, my money, and have been disappointed.

Track is a whole different story

[RWebb]

I generally agree with Tire Rack's own comments on tires - not that I have compared dozens or anything...

You can bet that the only tires to look at for performance will be in the top 1 or 2 categories for that. If you add in rain or all-season ability it gets to be ... ah... a stickier problem.

laughac - "can make 900 lbs stick to 95' F tarmac at up to 1.2 g, and will last 7 years or 50,000 mile"
- I don't think you will find that. Those two criteria are diametrically opposed to each other. Maybe someday...

[twin plugged targa]

Very un impressed with my Michelin Pilot Sports currently on my Golf GTI 1.8T.
Yup know its not a porsche but the tires have a weak point. My missus curbed the tires not hard but at 30-40mph and blistered them! no damage to the rubber - barely a scuff, but huge blister.
This has happened twice!!!
I have never had this with any tire before!.
Grip is 'OK' and wear is very quick - I would be lucky to get 20K out of them and this is with rotating them - front to back.
However I am hard on them -fast driver.
I would rate my old Toyo proxies TS1 which I had on the Carrera as MUCH better grip!.
Rgds Ben

[Miguel Antonett]

I decided to try the Sumitomos = great price. Took them to the track and I'm impresed... outstanding grip and predictable heat cycle. Have not try them on wet payment yet, but when wet always go slower regardless of any tire. For the money ++

[Buckterrier]

Originally Posted by Noah

Street tires are street tires. No need to get stressed out.

LOL, +1

[911nut]

Originally Posted by Miguel Antonett

I decided to try the Sumitomos = great price. Took them to the track and I'm impresed... outstanding grip and predictable heat cycle. Have not try them on wet payment yet, but when wet always go slower regardless of any tire. For the money ++

Miguel, that's good to hear. I'm going to buy Sumitomos for my car this spring.

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by ToddM

I think what is missing in a lot of these "tire" posts is what experience people have using different sets of tires on the SAME car. Somebody will say that love model "X" because it was better than whatever POS tire was on there beforehand.

Then, some people love a tire because of how well it lasts, some because of how quiet it is, and some because of how well it sticks. Everybody drives their cars different and everybody had thier own personal preference about what is important. Maybe somebody who just farts around and isn't power sliding wouldn't even notice or care thatthey truly have a set of tires that don't work on the car - they are quiet and last long and they are elated with the rubber.

To me, the single most important aspect when selecting tires for a 911 IF you really drive the thing is the REAR sidewall stiffness, support, and repeatability (as laughac stated); this is where all the weight is and this is where most of the work is happening.

Michelin Pilots and Bridgestone S02s have repeatedly proven to me that they work on a 911 on the street with a demanding driver. Both of these tires provide excellent rear sidewall support, wear evenly with a proper setup due to their lack of deformation, predictability, and dry grip down to end of life.

Other tires I have tried on the same car were FK452, RE050 (avoid on 911), G-force TA KD (good but not as good), SP8000, SP9000, Pzero, S03 (hunts & wanders).

So I agree with Charles regarding the Michelins and everytime I need tires for the 911, I run out and buy S02s. Both of these tires just work right on a 911. Everytime I have played "tire tester" I have wasted my time, my money, and have been disappointed.

Track is a whole different story

I think those are great points you make. One person who has done just that is Jack Olsen, I believe he's currently on Toyo RA 1's, but he has uber wdie rims and a modified suspension setup. So, the data may not be useful to others.

[jazzbass]

Originally Posted by Noah

I have the Fuzion HRTZII's on my 993 and they're terrific. Dirt cheap too. Street tires are street tires. No need to get stressed out.

What he said. Unless you track your car, all of this is pointless and you can't really tell the difference. Buy whatever "performance" street tires you think look cool & fit your budget and move on with your life.

[SCWDP911]

I am going to have to respectfully disagree with Noah and jazzbass. Tires selection does make a difference on the street. I have had tire changes before where the new UHP tire was highly rated by even tirerack, but the first trip to my travelled-everyday cloverleaf ramps on the way home, and it felt like the tires were going to roll off the car sideways (those were a Bridgestone Potenza - can't remember the exact model).

I agree with you if what you meant was that it is more of a factor on the track - that part is obvious. But I cannot see a basis for the argument you make that we should not stress out about our street tires, and I for one hardly find it pointless. I think that takes it justa little too far to the other side. My 2 cents. And I do not say any of the above to imply that I am a tire expert. I am only commenting based on past experiences.

[}{arlequin]

no one should bother w/ "shopping" for street tires. you won't use them to the fullest potential. if you do, you're being reckless on the street. if you think it's WORTH IT for you to spend all this survey time just to take your two clovers at max speed, once, twice a day....

like someone already mentioned, if you know what size you need for your wheels/car combo, punch those parameters and see what comes up. if it says pirelli, get those. if you like bridgestone, get those. if they have this cool little tread pattern that you like, get those. i'm not apexing street corners so i chose kumho's. if you want to improve your clover laptimes, then get ra1's. best street tire you can own.