Declan, that's a pretty good cleaning job, bravo!

Now, take a pipe cleaner and run it down in the air corrector screw holes to be sure they are clear. Look at the screws-- if some DPO has buggered the tips they won't give you a good seal. They should be straight before being reinstalled.

For my own TBs I made a home-made flow bench with the shop vac I have for cleaning the interior of the car. It has about a 1.25" hose which I wrapped with duct tape so it would seal inside the throttle body on the underside. The STE synchrometer fits in the high side. Start up the vacuum and hold it tight so everything seals, you can see how many Kg/hr of air are passing the plate. Start with the air corrector screws all the way closed. Once you set the plate stops so they are all flowing LESS than 3Kg/hr, you can then balance them out with the air corrector screws.

The reason I say LESS than 3Kg/hr is because that reading is JUST off the closed position-- you don't want the plates resting against the magnesium because wear will be accelerated and they could stick in the bores-- but you don't want them too far open as you will pass too much air and have too high an idle. If you have too high an idle (with the distributor advance dialed back to TDC at idle so advance doesn't push it up) at least the good news is that with your '72- style throttle stops it's fairly easy to loosen the lock nuts and reset the plates to the more-closed position (but you lose the luxury of doing this off the car, you have to do it with the engine running.)

So, less than 3Kg/hr with your home made flow bench should do it, remember you can always adjust with the air correctors. NOW. . . set the rods so they are EXACTLY on the balls with no grease on the cups. Check with flow bench again, nothing should have changed. If any cylinder shows too much air, you had that rod set wrong, start over. Now grease the ball cups. Check again. Still all the same? Great, now put paint on the throttle rods so they don't move and you KNOW they are set. Then put the TBs back on the car with NEW gaskets top and bottom. Use M8 nuts that are 12mm ATF (across the flats) these are easier to get on and off with a swivel socket, and stainless wave washers. Do NOT drop any hardware down the intakes, have a magnet handy for when you do! Good luck!

p.s the TBS in the picture were just professionally rebuilt and set with a real flow bench. They will not be adjusted when on the car- only the air corrector screws will be used for fine-tuning, maybe only half a turn here or there. The procedure I describe above did work for setting the stops, however.

Aha. I thought the 13mm nuts were a pain to get off. I had to just loosen them about half a turn with the socket and do the rest by hand.

I had to google "wave washers". Never heard that term before.

Is there any particular type I should get ?
And, (to save me measuring wrongly) what thread size are the nuts ?

Last question for now, any tips for cleaning the stacks, or just get the
toothbrush out again ?

Thanks,
Declan

Declan, every M8 nut in the car is an M8x1.25. In non-engineer speak (I'm not one either) that's an 8mm metric thread with a 1.25mm pitch. The special 12ATF nuts are commonly used in the exhaust system (where they are an all-copper lock type, a BMW part number) or can be found from specialty suppliers. I THINK the 12mm atf is a Japanese spec? Like you might find on a motorbike. Our host can certainly get these for you. Ditto the wave washers, standard M8 size, these conform to DIN 137B (a German spec), any Wurth dealer should have them. For the pundits who say, "use aluminum" I say "you better enjoy the taste of chewing gum, because you will be chewing a lot to put on the end of a ratchet extension to retreive those non-magnetic aluminum washers!" (Stainless should be SLIGHTLY magnetic, enough for you to fish it out of the (hopefully valve closed) intake port WHEN (not if, we all do it!) one drops down inside!

Stacks are easy, get a bottle brush. If you use water, be sure to dry them thoroughly, as magnesium corrodes easily enough, in the presence of water looks even worse.

Thanks for the info John.

I'm missing one of the screws for the plate stops !! :eek:
I can't be 100% sure if it was there or not when I took the TB off the car. I made apoint of checking the 4,5,6 but am not 100% sure if I checked the 1,2,3 TB or not. I guess these are M4 ?
I still might find it in the drain-pan I was using for the clean-up operation if it came out during cleaning

I've just ordered some bits from our host - gaskets, distributor cap, etc, and found a supplier for the stainless wave washers over here, so by the time I'm finished cleaning & adjusting ( & being divorced for using the vacuum cleaner on "that old car" ;) ) , I should be ready to assemble again.

I ordered a dial gauge & z-block as well, so should be able to get an idea of what cams are in there.

Is there a recommended plug I should be using, for my temperature zone ? I've read a lot of the threads on here about plugs, but still unsure what would be best for my climate here in Ireland

Thanks again to all for the help so far. I'm enjoying all this learning :)

The NGK BP7ES has worked well for me in both my 2.4 T and my 3.0, both running MFI. Our Puget Sound climate is much like yours; kind of cool and drizzly much of the year. An average summer might see a few days running up into the 90's; and average winter might see low 20's to teens for a week or two.

I had a go this evening at John's flow bench system, using the vacuum cleaner.

The bypass screws were in pretty good condition, just a little carbon build-up but I had them steeping in brake cleaner overnight, so it scrubbed off easily enough.

I could get all but one flowing less than 3kg/hr. Cant remember if it was #1 or #3
Best I could get was 3.5, so I set them all to 3.5kg/hr.

Hopefully I'll get some more time tomorrow evening to put the linkages back on & ensure they dont change the airflow.

Today I managed to order a decent timing light, and am on the hunt for am LM-1 next, since our host stopped selling them :(

Declan, OK, but prepare yourself to remove them and reset to lower than 3.5. The concern is that you will have too much air passing the plates at idle even with the air correctors dialed all the way closed, resulting in the classic "2000 RPM IDLE" so common among MFI enthusiasts.

I would see if you can't figure out why that hole is pulling more air than the rest. Carbon buildup blocking the plate open? Air leak out the throttle shaft hole (likely!) What is the flow with the throttle stop screw all the way out of the hole and the spring holding the plate shut?

Wayne stopped selling the LM1? Titan offers them for a special price of $299. http://www.titanmotorsports.com/lmdiairame.html

Yeah, as I typed the last post, I was thinking I should investigate further why one was higher !

I could get it to 3 or slightly below, but then it seemed to bind/catch when moving it off the stop, which I didn't like, so I found that at 3.5 it was much smoother .

I thought I had them pretty clean, but mabye there is some carbon I missed in close to the butterfly shaft. I'll try & investigate further tomorrow evening.


I've found a few sources for the LM-1. Should get one ordered tomorrow I think.

I guess our host is preparing for the introduction of the LM-2 to replace the LM-1

Cheers.
Declan

Declan,

This is a situation where you need to carefully investigate ALL the engine details. Pulling more air (fuel?) from a particular cylinder can have many causes – some not very desirable.

This is where multiple tests for cranking compression, cylinder leakage, valve timing & clearance adjustment, vacuum leaks, imperfect injection nozzles, fuel pressure, MFI pumps, an ignition issue and much more can lead you down the path to confused diagnosis. This is the major reason everyone familiar with MFI is so determined (anal?) following CMA and the geriatric extensions. Without these (and more) tests and extensions, it is VERY easy to miss something simple and be lead down the path to complicated (expensive) routes that don’t solve the problem.

I probably have done and supervised way over thousands of Porsche MFI engines. I think I still own around 20 (resting quietly). I can’t tell you how many times I (and my employees) were ‘fooled’ by skipping some simple test because we KNEW it was OK :rolleyes: Lessons learned.

There is a great deal archived on Pelican (and a few others). A search on CMA and CMA2 will yield some important links. It is critical to have both the CMA booklet (4532.20 & revisions) and the Factory Workshop Manual pages (Vol I, SF 1-45).

While MFI was relatively complicated when new, today we have the issues of ‘geriatric MFI’ and the engines with similar conditions. None of this makes it easier to diagnose and repair these systems. These were (and are) ‘state-of-the-art’ race systems of the day. They deserve to be maintained in that status.

Best,
Grady :)

Quick Update.
I had another good look and I did miss some carbon in #3

I now have 2.5kg/hr on #1,#2 and #3.

While I was investigating I noitced that by opening the bypass screw it goes up to amost 7kg/hr then drops off to around 5 with the screw toally removed (sucking air in the actual screw hole).


I still have not found the missing stop screw, and still am not sure there was one in it at all !
(I keep thinking, surely I would have noticed something so obvious, but mabye not. I never had reason to adjust them on the car, and it's #3, so hardest to see when on the engine.)
I made up another screw to suit.

Declan

Declan,

This tells me you need to remove the throttle bodies off the engine and see what you have. First I’ll encourage some ‘sporting’ driving and repeat the cylinder leak tests.

Best,
Grady

Grady,
The figures I'm talking about are with the TB's off the car, using John's vacuum cleaner method.

Simply vacuum cleaner in bottom of TB and synchrometer in top

I was trying to achieve John's figure of sub 3kg/hr

Does it make any more sense now ?

Declan, that sounds good to me. As a final step, verify that at 2,5Kg/hr the throttle plate IS being held open by the stop screw. The way you would verify that would be to slightly back off the screw and watch the reading fall. If 2,5 is the absolute bottom you can see, then you might turn the stop screw a tiny, tiny bit to ensure that the plates aren't all the way closed.

Then verify settings with the rods ungreased, then greased, then seal with paint, then install. The time spent getting the readings equal will translate to easier correlation and better power balance when the engine is running.

Declan, one more thing. . . Grady is the one who gave me the idea for the "home-made flow bench. . ." he built one years ago using a vacuum pump and some manometers. . .

John,
2.5 is absolute bottom. If I back off the screw, i can push the arm further than the spring will take it and get down to under 2, but it feels like I'm forcing it beyond what I should. Not that I'm applying much pressure, just more than the spring can provide.

Would I be better to up them all a little, to just a shade below 3kg/hr ?

I still have to set the other TB set, its still on 3.5.
Continued thanks :)

And, Grady, Sorry for "over-explaining" the "home-made flow bench" bit. :)
Fantastic Idea, and so simple.

Cheers,
Declan

Declan,

Unfortunately it's not possible for me to say "2,89 Kg/hr is the perfect flow reading for a 900 rpm idle" because I haven't yet flowed my own rebuilt (above) throttle bodies on the bench or on the car. So what it translates to in terms of an idle reading, I'm not sure. What I am sure of is that if you get them reading the absolute minimum you can with the plates BARELY open, you can always adjust the idle higher with the air corrector screws if it needs it.

3Kg/hr times six is 18Kg/hr, the fuel consumption spec is around 225 g/HPh or 225 grams per horsepower/hour, so 18,000 /14.7 (stochiometric) = 1,224 / 225 = 5HP. So the engine puts out around 5 hp at idle. Actually, the way you would really do the measurement is figure out the horsepower at 900 rpm, fuel consumption and air/fuel ratio and divide by six. But this kind of stuff only happens in the lab. . .

John,

OK, I thought maybe the 3kg/hr figure was lower than the required airflow for a good 900rpm idle, meaning the additional air needed would be supplied by the bypass screws, and the "number of turns out from closed" bit from CMA.

Any ideas what the airflow per stack would be at idle ?
I'm expecting it'll be between 3 & 7, since I got 7kg/hr with the bypass screw fully open. (Hope my logic is right !)

Or, is this where the "geriatric MFI" bit comes into play ?

Slainte,
Declan

In my continuing "tool buying" mode, I've bought a set of circlip pliers, another set of combination spanners, some torx bits, a decent timing light with advance control, an innovate LM1 with the RPM kit, a leakdown tester (still unsure about this*), a dial gauge & z-block, etc etc and now I realised I haven't got a compression gauge/tester.

Is there any particular type/make of compression tester I should get, or are they all pretty much the same ?



* Leakdown tester : I have a Gunson 77005 Cylinder Leakage Tester,
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c2.../mfi/77005.jpg

http://www.gunson.co.uk/item.aspx?item=3441&cat=666 but I'm unsure if I'm measuring correctly. With #1 at TDC compression, gauge set to zero leakage, plug in the hose from ppark plug hole & get about 5% or 6% leakage.

Where I'm a bit lost is that I cannot see any way to zero the leakage gauage at anything higher than 1 bar.
I simply have the air supply from compressor directly onto the leakage tester. Mabye I should have a valve of some sort to stop the air supply & seal the gauage ?

If I leave it set at the 1 bar, and reading about 5% leakage, then turn the engine by hand, I can open a valve, hear the air escaping, and see a big value of % leakage.
That makes sense.

I just cant help thinking I should be able to do this at a higher pressure, so must either I'm doing something wrong, or my tester is faulty ?

Any advice ?

Thanks,
Declan

Declan,

I have the same gauge. I, like you, originally thought that I would use 100 PSI (makes the math easier) or 80 PSI (the old aircraft standard) but in practice I wasn't able to get more than about 35 psi. If you turn the pressure relief valve higher, then you can't zero the leakdown gauge. This is the identical "problem" you are experiencing.

In truth, it's not really a problem at all, the gauge gives very accurate leakdown numbers using the lower pressure. Some (Grady) advocate using very low pressures anyway, because 1) less tendency for the engine to rotate off TDC, opening a valve and throwing the reading off, and 2) the low pressure will develop leaks that would be sealed by higher pressure. Weighing against that is the old rule of physics that says that the airflow through an orifice is directly proportional to the size of the orifice and the pressure behind it. Maybe throw a square root in there somewher. Anyway, the bigger the hole the more the flow, but given the internal violence of an internal combustion engine, there's rarely such a thing as a small hole. e.g. leakage around the rings from normal wear shows up as 3-5%, BROKEN rings show up as 45%. See, for example, this thread: http://forums.pelicanparts.com/911-engine-rebuilding-forum/214288-leakdown-results-1966-911-normal.html?highlight=leakdown

Anyway, nothing is wrong, proceed as normal. . .and post your leakdown figures!

You may want to consider using a piece of tubing, plastic or metal, around the 14mm hose that threads into the spark plug hole-- this makes it easier to wind in there. Also, try spinning the hose with one hand and guiding it in with the other-- you'll get the hang of it eventually. Finally, I use a "whistler" compression tester that's been cut off and the hose slips over the small quick-disconnect fitting that goes into the tester-- makes it much easier to identify TDC on the compression stroke. Then again, if you see 100% leakdown, rotate the engine away from TDC OVERLAP. . . and hold the Guinness till the job is done!

Good luck!

OK, Thats what I wanted to hear :)
Thanks John.

Will post the figures when I get all 6 tested.

And today I.....












did nothing !

I ordered a compression tester, so I suppose that counts as something constructive !

:)

Declan

Houston, we have a problem.
 

Houston, we have a problem.


Right, I've hit my first problem, I think.

I was so happy with the leakage figure of 5% or 6% on #4, I got brave and tested #5

240 degrees clockwise rotation from #4, visually checked where cams are, should be rocking, looks right, checked inlet valve clearance - bit tight, but should be OK.

Took out plug, put in hose form leakage gauge, setup & zeroed leakage gauge, plugged in hose from plug hole ... 45% leakage.

Damn and blast... or words to that effect.


I turned a few revs, and got rocking again on #5, (inlet rocking, visually seeing exhaust off lobe, matching a 120degree mark on pulley). same thing. 45% leakage.

I haven't checked exhaust valve clearance.

I'm thinking I have a problem. :(

I didn't bother moving onto next cylinder

:confused:

First, check ALL the cylinders.
Do a ‘cranking compression test’ also.
Repeat your #5 cylinder test, noting where the air is escaping.


Now may be the time for what the Ferrari guys call an “Italian Tune-up”:

Find some place where you can drive extended up-hill under full throttle, high rpm and high speed – safely.
Repeat several times.
Re-rest the cylinder leak and cranking compression tests.

Best,
Grady

Declan,

Be absolutely certain that the #5 piston is actually at TDC on the compression stroke on that cylinder.

The way you can do this is: start just ahead of TDC, connect the air, you should see 80% leakdown because the intake valve is open. Then rotate the engine until you see the needle flip and you feel the engine push back, keep turning until the mark on the pulley lines up with the notch in the blower housing-- THAT is TDC. Read the gauge. Still 45%?

If so, then follow Grady's instructions to the letter and see if it helps. If not, then prepare for extreme de-coking using seafoam or water.

A related, relevant question is, WHERE is the leakage coming from? Intake, exhaust or crankcase breather? A rubber glove, like the ones you wear when working on the car to protect your hands from nasty Volatile Organic Solvents, can be stretched over the intake funnel on #5, the exhaust pipe, or with a rubber band, the breather outlet on the case. The air has to go somewhere assuming it's not leaking out the spark plug hole.

This has happened to me several times and invariably it's something other than a bent valve, it's operator error or a piece of carbon or something. (Someday it will be my turn. . . :) )

Grady, John,
Thanks for the suggestions.

I did crank up the pressure to about 4 bar and could hear the air leaking, but don't know where from.

I'm waiting on delivery of the gaskets from our host to get the throttle bodies & stacks back on, so can't do the italian tune up yet.
I'm also waiting on delivery of a compression gauage, so can't test that yet.

Hopefully I'll find half an hour this evening to test again.

Thanks for the input & I'll post my findings later.

Update.
I leakage tested #4, #5 and #6 again

#4 = 5%
#5 = 50%
#6 = 5% **

** When I started on #6, I had about 60%, found it was the intake valve, and a light tap on the the rocker arm sorted it.

I used the "glove on the exhaust pipe" method and found #5 is exhaust leakage.
I haven't checked any of the exhaust valve clearances yet.

I went through them again in case the inlet valve was sticking on #6 but I got the same 5% figure again.

I'm now thinking the problem with #5 might be carbon stopping the exhaust valve seating properly, or am I just hoping ?

Must admit I nearly paniced when I got 60% on #6 to start with !

Cheers.

Declan, you very well could have a burned exhaust valve on #5. Or you could have a piece of carbon blocking the valve from closing, could have fallen off the head or piston and be lodged in the bottom, gravity being what it is.

Did this engine run well before this exercise? Before tearing it down I would look inside #5 with a borescope or pull off the starboard heat exchanger and have a look at the valve (easy enough to do) to verify that things, in fact, HAD gone horribly afoul.

Once you get it running the picture will get clearer.

John,
This engine ran very well when warm.

I started down the CMA route as it was very very rich, especially when cold.

I've never driven another MFI car, so cant compare, but it would blow the socks off a basic 2.7 CIS I've driven, so I thought it was going well.


Cheers.
Declan

Update:
I've checked all cylinders for leakage now, and have :

#1 = 5%
#2 = 9%
#3 = 5%
#4 = 5%
#5 = 50%
#6 = 5%

#2 : Can't find where the leakage is. I did crank up the pressure to about 6 bar and listened. I can hear it, but cant find it ! I still have the glove on exhaust, but its not inflating at all. I tried putting a glove on the inlet port, and think I got it held in place, but no evidence of leakage there.
Sound seems to be coming from under the air shroud somewhere, but I cant pinpoint it.

#5 : is exhaust. still haven't done any further investigation.


I now have a compression gauge.

I presume "cranking compression" is the compression I get while cranking the engine, not running/idling ?

Could a broken/loose/pulled head stud have caused the head to loosen and slap the top of the cylinder? Maybe the mating seal is worn and allowing air out.

Excuse me for lurking before posting only now.

No problem ... I welcome any and all suggestions !

How do I do a compression test ?
I presume it's "cranking compression" I need to check, but I'm unsure what I need to do.

I have the electrical panel with the CD box out of the car.
I have all the pipes off the injectors

Should I simply take out the fuse for the fuel pump, and turn the engine using the starter motor, or is there more to it than that ?

I have a sealey compression gauge CT955
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c2...ion_tester.jpg


I have it fitted to the spark plug hole & get compression while turning the engine by hand.

Today I finally got my package from our sponsor. (I think it got routed through the UK, so it took aaaages), so I now have dial gauge & z-block, the gaskets for throttle bodies & stacks, new cam cover gasket kit, new dist. cap & rotor arm, etc.

First off, I guess I should measure the cams & see what I've got.
Can I measure exhaust cam from the top also, or do I have to do that from underneath ?

Thanks.

Edit:
OK, I got the z-block & dial gauge setup with dial gauge on the inlet valve "collar"
I measured 10.7mm. I thought I should see around 5.4mm .. or am I missing some logic here, and (5.4 * 2) = 10.8 ?

Help !!

I've checked all valve clearances now, and they are all set. very minor adjustment on a couple of exhaust valves, others were all perfect.

While I was down there, I noticed both case halves are stamped with 7R

From memory..
901 101 101 7R
901 101 102 7R

Also I noticed stainless heat exchangers, which I didn't know I had !

When I dropped the oil, I was amazed how much like petrol it smelled & I've only done about 150 miles maximum since I changed it !

So, I'm a bit stuck right now:

How & where to measure the cams using the dial gauge & z-block. I want to do this while I have the cam covers off, & access to inlet section is great without the TB's & stacks in place.

Declan

update :
My dial gauge is only 10mm travel, so I'm now waiting on delivery of a 25mm gauge.

Full deflection seems to be 10.7mm, so I still haven't measured the valve lift correctly !

OK, After ordering a 25mm dial guage today, I was searching on here for any specs on valve lift values to check against, and found the link to drcamshafts.com.

That shows the early S cam as:
inlet : 0.455" = 11.56mm
exhaust : 0.399" = 10.135mm

I also spotted the "setting" column as 5.0-5.4mm and that rang a bell from an earlier post in this thread, so I read back to see.

Yes, Grady explained about measuring valve lift at overlap which I totally ignored !

I have been measuring (trying to measure) the total valve lift, hence my needing the bigger gauge.

(I was silently cursing Wayne for selling me a 10mm dial gauge when I obviously needed a longer travel, but now it makes sense ! Sorry Wayne !)

So, that's this evening's work planned. Measure the valve lift at TDC overlap.

Inlet valve lift at TDC overlap is 5.2mm **

I haven't figured out yet how to meaure the exhaust valve using the 10mm gauge !

I should have a 25mm gauge soon, so will get more accurate readings on the valve lift & should be able to measure the exhaust valve at overlap also.

** I presume TDC overlap is one crankshaft turn (360*) from TDC Compression ?
It's the only way I can think of to get both valves open at the same time.


I also finished assembling the throttle bodies with the connecting arms between the butterflies and still have good equal airflow. I followed the recommendation above about assembling without grease, checking airflow & then assembling with grease & checking again. All good :)


I started to refit the electrical panel (with the CD box) but I need to shorten the mad cable assembly I had from CD to coil & points.

Where should these 2 screend cables be routed ?

I've searched for pics of MFI engine bays, but haven't come up with anything thats shows the cable routing.


Thanks,
Declan

feels like I'm talking to myself here for the last while .. should I start a new thread, or keep posting here ?

Anyway, Today I refitted the throttle bodies.

Nobody told me how difficult it would be to remove old gaskets. I think it took me 2 hours of poking & scraping, stuffing rags into the inlet ports, vacuaming the pieces out, spraying with WD40 to soften the paper that was left, scraping and scraping, etc etc.

At least its done now, just need to torque the nuts.

I got some stainless nuts & stainless wave washers. I presume thats OK ?

What torque do I need on these, or is is just "damn tight"

Next step will be the stacks .. Should I use wave washers or flat washers for those, and what torque should I use on those ?

Thanks,
Declan

Declan,

We are still here, listening intently for the results of that cylinder.

Stainless is fine from a corrosion standpoint but remember that stainless can gall against the steel studs so be sure to use some sort of antiseize when you reassemble. Old zinc-plated nuts would be fine.

What dimension across the flats (ATF) or if you prefer German, Schlusselweite (SW) of nut are you using on the stacks? I prefer an M8 SW 12 so you can get a 12mm swivel socket on it. This is one of those sockets that looks like a universal but instead of having a 3/8" square drive on both ends, it has a 3/8" female on one end and the 12mm socket on the other. Makes it easy to get on the nuts. Anyway, it's not hard to find M8 SW 12 even though the 13mm type are more common in hardware stores.

Wave washers are correct, these don't do much to maintain the torque of the fastener, they are really to protect the magnesium from damage by the nuts. There's no torque specfied in the factory literature so in this case we look at the torque of of every OTHER M8 fastener in the car for which a torque is specified, and it turns out to be 25NM (18.4 foot-pounds). So that's a good torque to use. That isn't very much torque at all, by the way. The fact that you are compressing a paper gasket should affect things, but I would go easy on it-- you do NOT want to crack the ears off the throttle bodies, they are old, brittle magnesium and this is easy to do.

The stacks are little teeny M6 studs with 10mm ATF nuts. These should get a torque of 11NM (8.1 foot-pounds). You can break these as easily as breathing on them, so stay away from the 24" breaker bar and just use a little toolkit wrench to snug them up. Again, there are paper gaskets to compress but it shouldn't take much, you just want to eliminate air leaks.

Obviously you should use no gasket sealant of any kind, they seal just fine without it and avoiding the sticky mess or horrors of RTV is a step up the wheel of Porsche Karma.

The reason nobody told you how hard working with MFI was is because if we told you, you would trade in your 911 on a used Fiat Panda, become a strict vegeterian, begin wearing cork-soled sandals and answer every question with a question. Far better that you cuss, swear, bleed, sweat and puzzle on the road to MFI triumph: the chainsaw-like howling of the flat six flat-out at wide-open throttle under load, baying like the hounds of hell in some macabre Wagnerian anvil chorus, has NEVER been heard by the owner of a Fiat Panda.

Have a nice weekend.

Thanks John !

I spent ages doing the valve adjust and trying to measure valve lift, so lots of revolutions.

I happened to check #5 leakage again, and now it is down to around 20% (from 50%)
Valve clearance was a little tight, but not too bad. I adjusted it anyway.
I'm hoping the italian tune-up will help !


I didn't find any 12mm atf nuts.

When I was buying the stainless wave washers, I bought some other washers & nuts, etc, all stainless, so I thought I'd stick 'em on instead of the old zinc plated ones.

Guess I'll take them off again. I didn't torque any of them yet, so an easy job.


Fiat Panda, eh. Interesting. ;)

Not much prgoress since..

I took off the stainless nuts & put on the old steel nuts again.
Both TB's in place now.
I refitted the stack to 4-5-6

I got carried away & refitted the upper cam covers :(
Forgot I still had to measure the total valve lift when I get the new dial gauge !
I hope the gasket will survive for a second use, as I don't have another ?

Next job is to refit the rear electrical box.
I've shortened those crazy long screened cables & fitted a nylon braided sleeve.
Just have to crimp & solder the spade & ring tags on the ends now.

Cleaned points (not bad at all actually), refitted & gapped.
Vacuum advance works nice & freely.

:)