Adding an airbag system

[BrokeMyCar]

Anyone experimented with adding an airbag system? I understand there will be some complication with impact sensors and testing, but any pointers towards kits/wiring diagrams would be much appreciated. This project is in the "musing" stage right now.

Babak

PS Even WikiAnswers doesn't have this one figured out

[Rot 911]

I would have to ask why? Are there any studies that show an airbag prevents fewer injuries than a good 3 point seat belt?

[BrokeMyCar]

I'm cool with broadening the topic. Say you wanted to improve the passive safety systems in the car. Air bags is one option (is it?). Replacing the old seatbelts and receptacles is another (@ $800, if available). Are side-airbags implementable? Any chance I can get my car to fill with foam, Demolition Man style? =)

PS I'm refreshing the brakes this summer, which got me thinking...

[Racerbvd]

I have a set of bags & wheel off a 944 Turbo "S" for sale

[Formerly Steve Wilkinson]

I'm pretty sure it would be DOT-illegal to install a DIY airbag system.

[signature65]

I wouldn't do it. First airbag systems are very dangerous when not installed by the factory. Your always run the risk of tapping a pole of something at 5mph and having the thing go off. Ever watch the you tube videos of people playing around with them? There are firemen who have been working in accidents and gotten limbs broken when the airbag went off. We do a ton of training on them and IMHO, if you want an airbag upgrade the Porsche first.

[haycait911]

Originally Posted by BrokeMyCar

Anyone experimented with adding an airbag system? I understand there will be some complication with impact sensors and testing, but any pointers towards kits/wiring diagrams would be much appreciated. This project is in the "musing" stage right now.

Babak

PS Even WikiAnswers doesn't have this one figured out

good way to get dead. airbag systems are extremely engineered and depend on microsecond timing. invest in better belts. a bag blowing too late by a couple of thousanths of a second can easily break your neck/back. watch a few slow-mo crash videos to get the idea. FWIW. Don.

[tcar]

Originally Posted by BrokeMyCar

Anyone experimented with adding an airbag system? I understand there will be some complication with impact sensors and testing, but any pointers towards kits/wiring diagrams would be much appreciated. This project is in the "musing" stage right now.

Babak

PS Even WikiAnswers doesn't have this one figured out

You should stop drinking the city water in Davis.

NOW!

[the]

Originally Posted by BrokeMyCar

I'm cool with broadening the topic. Say you wanted to improve the passive safety systems in the car.

Why are you worried about improving the passive safety system on your own personal car?

Are you worried you might forget to use your active safety system (i.e., your seatbelts)?

[BrokeMyCar]

That sounds like the voice of experience - the water in Davis is horrible.

The point about the timing I hadn't thought about, after hunting around on youtube I'm sufficiently frightened of airbag systems to avoid them. Thanks guys!

My only motivation was the realization that I'm not going to try and get more zoom out of the car unless I have to rebuild the engine years down the road, so at this point what what I want out of it is that it won't kill me and my passengers. Brakes are top of the refresh list. The belts look/feel good, but I recall a comment about how climbers replace their ropes every two years regardless of condition which has me thinking. Anything I should check on the suspension?

Thanks,

Babak

[rennch]

Maybe for the money you could install a roll cage, and some harnesses?

[Formerly Steve Wilkinson]

One thing you'd have to do if you intended to somehow install an airbag to protect a passenger is totally glue the windshield in place, and I mean completely. Windshields on airbag-equipped cars are usually an integral part of the passenger bag system. The bag blows out of the glareshield, and the windshield deflects/compresses it toward the passenger. Modern windshields are an integral, bonded-on-place part of the car's structure, while windshields in older and midyear 911s can be pushed out with one hand.

[ChrisBennet]

Originally Posted by BrokeMyCar

That sounds like the voice of experience - the water in Davis is horrible.

The point about the timing I hadn't thought about, after hunting around on youtube I'm sufficiently frightened of airbag systems to avoid them. Thanks guys!

My only motivation was the realization that I'm not going to try and get more zoom out of the car unless I have to rebuild the engine years down the road, so at this point what what I want out of it is that it won't kill me and my passengers. Brakes are top of the refresh list. The belts look/feel good, but I recall a comment about how climbers replace their ropes every two years regardless of condition which has me thinking. Anything I should check on the suspension?

Thanks,

Babak

New seatbelts are cheap insurance (~$150 per seat) and it's nice to have seatbelts that retract nicely. Professionally Engineered Products (PEP) is the only source of rebuilt belts I know of but check with Pelican, they might surprise you.

Refeshing your stock brakes is a great idea but remember that it's tires that stop the car. Big bakes aren't going to stop you any faster.

Learn how to "panic" brake in a 911 - it's different than in a front engine car. You need to brake hard enough to get weight transfer to the front (say 8/10) and then once the weight is forward, increase brake pressure to 10/10's. If you just slam them on, the light front end will tend to slide instead of sticking. Unfortunately, to learn this skill ("threshold braking") you usually have to wreck/flat spot some front tires.
Some clubs have a "driving skills" or "intro to autocross" day in the spring that teaches these skills. Try to use some crappy front tires for this if you can.

Speaking of autocross, it's also great for learning on how drive out of a situation with a 911. It get's you in the habit of flooring the gas and steering to get out of trouble instead braking.

-Chris

[911pcars]

An SRS (Supplemental Restraint System) aka Air Bag system is technically doable on the driver's side. All you would need is a proper steering wheel with the integral AB unit contained within. We'll leave steering wheel adaptation, SRS control circuits, input sensors and connections aside.

The passenger side is another story. The instrument panel (IP) of SRS vehicles is specifically engineered to contain an air bag unit. With sufficient collision force, the passenger side SRS unit deploys causing 1. the IP material to separate (split) and 2. allow the air bag to inflate properly toward the passenger. There's no such IP for cars never designed with passenger side SRS in the first place. An IP would have to be designed, engineered and tested; probably beyond the scope of anyone not approaching mad-scientist level.

I'm sure there's YouTube video of air bag launching demos. From stories I heard, when placed AB face down, an energized module can reach 40' or more. Not sure about current units, but AB assemblies I've seen some years ago used a propellant supplied by Morton Thiokol (now TRW?). That name might ring a bell as the supplier of solid rocket fuel for the Space Shuttle.

Sherwood

[RarlyL8]

I removed the crash bars from my doors and both bumpers and you want to add airbags.
Interesting take on how we view our cars.

[tab tanner]

In 1996 Midas muffler started installing airbag systems in older cars. I think the install was in the $700 range, here is a link http://www.allbusiness.com/company-activities-management/company-structures-ownership/7218955-1.html

[gestalt1]

i think i read somewhere that the 2 most significant safety devices developed for cars are the 3 point seatbelt and the side airbag. i guess these devices have shown as greatly dropping the injuries in auto accidents, most other devices did not make as noticeable a difference in the severity of the injuries. i think if you are wearing the 3 point seatbelt the front airbag is not that important. the 3 point seatbelt is not great at keeping the top of your body from side to side movement which is where the side airbag makes a big difference.

[xlr8]

Retrofit airbag systems are available for AIRCRAFT, and are built into the seatbelt. They inflate AWAY from you instead of TOWARD you.
I would be surprised if they would sell one for installation in a car.
Here is a link- http://www.amsafe.com/products/detail.php?id=4&type=categories

[SXSMAN]

Originally Posted by Racerbvd

I have a set of bags & wheel off a 944 Turbo "S" for sale

Are you open to any trades ???

I think you should add that to your sig .

Should save a lot of typing .

SxS