reinstall engine, can't start, even push start

[Christien]

I've reinstalled my engine after dropping it for a tranny rebuild, and now that it's back in it won't start. When I turn the key I get a click from the starter, and when I release the key from the start position I can hear the plunger retreat back, but no movement of the flywheel at all. When I tried to push start it, all I was able to get was a faint grinding noise, and no start, not even a chug.

To give a bit more detail, I'm bump starting it in my driveway, in reverse, because my driveway slopes down away from the house. I've had to adjust the shift coupler because I of course had to disconnect it to remove the transmission. No doubt I don't have a perfect adjustment, but I can at least find all the gears and engage them, at least as far as I can tell with the car not running - it all feels normal. So I put it in reverse, put the clutch in with the brakes on, turn the key to run the fuel pump/electricals, let off the brake, get a good amount of speed and drop the clutch while giving it gas. The clutch engages and the car jolts like it should, but I can hear some bit of grinding or something moving in the tranny - grinding isn't really the word for it - it's not like when you blow a shift.

So my big concern is that I really screwed something up with the gears inside the tranny and the whole thing has to come out again.

Any ideas? Next step is to flatbed it into the shop.

Thanks,
Chris

[David]

Sounds like something bound up in the clutch. Did you change any clutch components?

If you put it in, you can pull it out so get to work

[Christien]

Yes, all new clutch - new clutch disc, pressure plate, TO bearing. Complete teardown of the 915.

What do you mean by "bound up"?

[Christien]

Just another thing I thought of - does it matter which bolt on the tranny the ground strap attaches to? I'm talking about the thick strap that attaches to the chassis right near the tranny mounting bar. Is it possible that it matters which nut on the tranny it goes on, and I've got it on the wrong one?

When I turn the key to start, I hear the click and the plunger in the solenoid move, then when I release the key I can hear the plunger release.

[mjshira]

I would start by removing the starter, do a bench test of it. once you remove that as a cause, inspect the clutch assembly as best you can. I would then check to validate you've got spark. then pull a plug and see if it is wet or not. Sometimes and engine can get vac locked.

try those steps and let us know what happens.

[Christien]

Ok, I'll pull the starter tomorrow.

But I won't get spark without the engine turning, will I? Because the distributor isn't turning?

What would make a plug wet? Fuel? The engine hasn't run since I put it away last fall.

BTW, it's a 2.4T with Zenith carbs, if that makes any difference.

Thanks!

[euro911sc]

When ever I get that starter sound it means that I have a dead battery... I hate that sound... Try a bat. swap with another of your cars and see if it works.

Best regards,

Michael

[David]

If you're getting noise out of the starter, clutch or tranny, I wouldn't do anything to start it until you've figured out for sure what's making the noise.

[tonythetarga]

Originally Posted by euro911sc

When ever I get that starter sound it means that I have a dead battery... I hate that sound... Try a bat. swap with another of your cars and see if it works.

Best regards,

Michael

The bump start should have worked if the battery was dead or close to it. I agree with 125shifter, don't force it to start as you might tear up the whole tranny and be deeper in the hole then had you just sent the tranny out to be done professionally in the first place.

[Christien]

Also forgot to mention, the battery is brand new - just bought it today.

Agreed about further bump starting. I'm going to solve the starter problem first, then get the car running in neutral, then try to engage a gear.

[mjshira]

remove the starter, bench test it. if you can get it to engage (with a 12v power source) you'll know that you've got an issue with the engine side of things.

try the coil wire I think it should spark when you attempt to crank.

I suspect the starter is locked in the extended position.

[FPB111]

Chris,
You say "the car jolts like it should" Does the engine turn over or just stop the car? If the second check for hydraulic lock of one of the cylinders. Easy to pull all spark plugs and see if the starter will turn it over.

[JP911]

Does your starter have 2 yellow wires? If you accidentally switch them, the car won't start.

[JP911]

Does your starter have 2 yellow wires? If you accidentally switch them, the car won't start.

[Christien]

The engine doesn't turn over at all- the car just stops.

Yes, the starter has 2 yellow wires. I've swapped them back and forth several times, just to be sure.

[sjf911]

Could it be the dreaded lost detent and now be in 2 gears simultaneously?

[dentist90]

Will the car roll freely when you select neutral? If not, you're stuck in one of the gears (R or 5 likely). When you attempted to start the car with the starter, did you have the clutch pushed in or just in neutral? If the motor won't crank with the clutch depressed it's not a tranny problem, as this 'detaches' the engine from the tranny. Bummer, man.

[wastintime]

Just a thought, you might not be too far off when you were thinking of the ground strap... I had that issue on my '67 once. Your issue sounds very simliar except for the faint grinding noise, of course, depending on how faint and how long since the car has run, that could be anything, even brake rotors.

Since you had a doubt, I would double check that, and try to clean the contact areas on the body and the transmission, make sure they are clean, maybe even add some dialectric grease to help and protect... sometimes a ground strap one can do wonders for a car.

[vreference]

Apparently the car rolls even if a gear is selected - which pretty much means the transmission is fine. At the very least it's not the root cause of this issue.

1) With a gear selected, if the car is rolled with the clutch disengaged then the input shaft (and clutch disc) is spinning freely which is good news.

2) With a gear selected and the car moving the clutch is then engaged and the car comes to a halt. This is a good sign as well; now we are pretty darn sure the that at least the tested gear (Reverse) is in working order and nothing south (or would it be north in a Porsche? ... Down stream!) of the clutch-disc is causing this issue.

1 and 2 do a pretty good job of eliminating the starter from the equation as well as mutually confirming each-other.

I gather you have not yet attempted to turn the engine over via the Fan? That's the very first thing I'd try but I'm afraid you'll get discouraging results. I take it the engine wasn't opened? It's reasonable to assume there is no mechanical issue with the motor? If so, this pretty much leads us to the flywheel area.

I'm afraid you may have a bolt that has gone through the bell-housing and is now in interference with the flywheel/clutch? I really hope the crunching sound you heard wasn't ring-gear teeth being sheared off or worse yet, the bell-housing giving way. Something is going wrong in that area but I'm hoping for a bolt as that won't require splitting them again assuming nothing is damaged now. This is the first thing I thought of when I read the post this morning. Your description made me a little ill but I hoped someone with more Porsche-specific experience (John Walker) might chime in with a miracle cure.

Let us know what happens, hopefully I'm wrong! If not, hardly the end of the world I suppose.

[SWISSMADE]

Hi, just a thought. When you mated up the tranny to the engine did you check that the clutch throwout fork located in the groove of the throwout bearing ?

Cheers Mike